repairing an oxygen valve on O/A torch

[ian111]

Hey all,

i just got a vintage smith #2 torch
its a small aircraft torch and i have been looking for this type for a very long time

however, i fear that the oxygen knob is going to leak because there is usually some sort of "packing" in there to prevent this, and i do not see any in my knob. (i found a small bit of it in there, but it looks like it was removed by someone)

does anyone know what this "packing" is and what it can be replaced by.
i have heard it described as a sticky thread/rope like substance

i have been warned not to ship it out to a repair shop, as it is a very rare and delicate torch

i was told not to use a rubber oring to fix the problem as rubber and oxygen do not mix
any thoughts on a substitute besides plumbing tape?

Thanks!
-Ian

[Oldiron2]

Not knowing the torch or the exact details of the valve........I have some packing 'rope', about 1/8" diameter, made of twisted Teflon tape (Teflon is very inert, even to oxygen) and would think you could roll some standard wide tape into such a 'rope', probably making it thinner and using more turns.It will pack well under nut pressure and still the knob will be easy to turn due to the low coefficient of friction.

[ian111]

awesome i think thats exactly what im looking for

where can i get some of said rope (or at least how should i search for it)?
recommendations?


the torch is a predecesor of the victor aw1a and is a very small and light torch
looks very similar to that torch
ill upload a pic and a pic of the older harris 15-3 that i got with it as well

both i think might need overhauls, but i dont have my tanks here in boston so i cant even check them out till i get back

the first is the smith i spoke of the second is of the harris

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL168/1702419/7934640/352908923.jpg
http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL168/1702419/7934640/352908915.jpg

[Oldiron2]

I think i found my 'rope' but have seen similar material in the Grainger catalog. The Teflon tape is available in any plumbing or hardware store, if you want to roll your own 'rope'.

[ian111]

does this look like what i need?

https://www.plumbersstock.com/product.html?partNumber=33738

STRING TEFLON GASKET ROPE

also, does anyone have expirience trying to clean a torch and how the cleaning process usually works

just curious as i am about to ship it out to be cleaned

[weldbead]

confusion now is mine
you were warned not to ship it to a repair shop but you are shipping it out to be cleaned.....?

have you tried toget info from smith, the mfr?

[DSW]

ian111 I'll PM you.

[makoman1860]

I think he means he was warned not to ship to just a generic welding shop, but to find one that specalizes in this type of equipment. Smith has no information on them.

[Oldiron2]

Yes, that is the kind of packing material I meant.

I would expect that cleaning of things like that would be done with ultrasonic vibration by most shops. That, of course, depends on what needs to be cleaned in/from it. I would think it would need little beyond blowing out with an air compressor, or perhaps 'brushing' with a pipe cleaner, perhaps saturated with "Brasso" or some other such cleaner. Maybe plug the holes and lightly bead blast it to restore the shine?

If mud daubers have already plugged the holes, just soak it in water and use the appropriate sized copper (or brass?) wire to 'ream' them out; no steel which can scratch the insides.

I agree w/ WB: why send it away for anything???

[makoman1860]

Yes, that is the kind of packing material I meant.

I would expect that cleaning of things like that would be done with ultrasonic vibration by most shops. That, of course, depends on what needs to be cleaned in/from it. I would think it would need little beyond blowing out with an air compressor, or perhaps 'brushing' with a pipe cleaner, perhaps saturated with "Brasso" or some other such cleaner. Maybe plug the holes and lightly bead blast it to restore the shine?

If mud daubers have already plugged the holes, just soak it in water and use the appropriate sized copper (or brass?) wire to 'ream' them out; no steel which can scratch the insides.

I agree w/ WB: why send it away for anything???

Brasso? not a good idea, it is combustible and can have adverse reactions with certain solders. It also contains waxes that cannot at times be washed out.

Compressor? Oil from the compressor....not a good idea.

Bead blasting? The handle is plated with surgical nickel

Ultrasonic? There ya go! Just have to use the right cleaners:)

[ian111]

i was going to send it out to a member of the miller weld forum who said he has rebuilt 2 of these torches to have a look at it
not just a generic welding supply shop cause its such a rare and old torch


so is soaking a good start before replacing valves? will that bad for it?
as long as i dont use chemical cleaners

one person suggested simple green
any thoughts?


if i were to send my torches out to have them cleaned (at least the harris one and probably not the smith) is there a place any of you would recomend?

Thanks to everyone who responded and for all the opinions and information!

-Ian

[76GMC1500]

The manufacturers may still sell repair kits for these torches. Smith offers a lifetime waranty most of their products and may refurbish your torch for free. If not, they may sell a kit to repair your torch. The kit may include parts to repair the valves or it may even have new valves that you simply thread in place of the old ones.

If you're going to have any cleaned, refurbished, or whatever send out the Smith as Harris stuff is junk.

Whatever you clean them with, just wash them out with a solvent that doesn't leave a residue. Lectra Clean (trichlorethylene) would be my choice. It's non-flamable, too. Just give it plenty of time to evaporate before you put it into oxygen service.

[Oldiron2]

Brasso? not a good idea, it is combustible and can have adverse reactions with certain solders. It also contains waxes that cannot at times be washed out.

Compressor? Oil from the compressor....not a good idea.

Bead blasting? The handle is plated with surgical nickel

Ultrasonic? There ya go! Just have to use the right cleaners
I was thinking of Brasso for the outside, although that's not the way I wrote it, I'll admit. It wouldn't do much good inside; it's not much of a solvent, just a reducer and polish.

The pictures above don't show any significant plating that would be damaged by light bead blasting, assuming the beads aren't tungsten carbide. Obviously some care is needed.

My compressors don't put out enough oil that it could be detected without a gas chromatograph; does yours? I would use air as a first or second step for cleaning out passages which were blocked by spiders, insects, etc. and be sure they were free of everything including oil in later steps.

I understand concern for safety and don't argue with that, but think that often many factors have to be considered. Nothing is completely safe; I sometimes drive cars, and even on the freeway.

[weldbead]

76gmc1500 did you see the foto of that torch? if there was a lifetime warranty its over, man..:laugh:.

[makoman1860]

This is what they typically look like after restoration providing the plating is in good shape. The cloth case is also original.

[Oldiron2]

Makoman;
The units this thread is about are nowhere near that condition, although I suppose they could be restored to it by re-plating once the other work is done. The tip on the bottom torch has been badly bent and the third and fourth tips on the top also appear to have bends near the bottom. They've all seen some action.

Posted by 76GMC1500
If you're going to have any cleaned, refurbished, or whatever send out the Smith as Harris stuff is junk.Could you explain that better? All my Harris equipment is well designed and well forged/machined of good material. I've never seen any Harris equipment which was poorly made. I wouldn't expect Harris to have parts for Smith though.

[makoman1860]

Makoman;
The units this thread is about are nowhere near that condition, although I suppose they could be restored to it by re-plating once the other work is done. The tip on the bottom torch has been badly bent and the third and fourth tips on the top also appear to have bends near the bottom. They've all seen some action.

Could you explain that better? All my Harris equipment is well designed and well forged/machined of good material. I've never seen any Harris equipment which was poorly made. I wouldn't expect Harris to have parts for Smith though.

You didnt see the "before" picture :) Yes I have handles re-plated at times, however I prefer not to in order to preserve the original finish. Tool restoration is a hobby in of itself. To the person that just wants to use it, the process of restoration is pointless to them as they just want it to work. I guess that could be said of anything, cars, motorcycles, furniture etc. Honestly if Ian here wants a useable tool, he might be better off fixing up the Harris handle as tips are still available. The Smith, elegant and refined as it is, is missing vital parts such as mixers and tips. These parts are rare, and usually in the same condition as his.

[vkuells]

This is what they typically look like after restoration providing the plating is in good shape. The cloth case is also original.

I was browsing the web looking for information on a Smith No.2 torch as I have my Dad's an was interested in finding more tips and maybe the cutting head for it. I saw this picture of your torch. This is it! Did you send it to Smith to be cleaned up? Mine is not in bad shape just not shiny like yours. I would love to restore it and just have in my shop in Dad's memory.
I know the local Smith Rep. and just last week bought the Dual Guard medium duty torch set up from him. Please let me know and if he can restore it I'll give him a call.

Thanks,
Vicki

[makoman1860]

I was browsing the web looking for information on a Smith No.2 torch as I have my Dad's an was interested in finding more tips and maybe the cutting head for it. I saw this picture of your torch. This is it! Did you send it to Smith to be cleaned up? Mine is not in bad shape just not shiny like yours. I would love to restore it and just have in my shop in Dad's memory.
I know the local Smith Rep. and just last week bought the Dual Guard medium duty torch set up from him. Please let me know and if he can restore it I'll give him a call.

Thanks,
Vicki

Vicki,
With the exception of plating, I do all of my own restoration work. I know a fellow with a cutting head, whats your e-mail and I will give it to him.
-Aaron

[ian111]

makoman-

know anyone with mixers or tips? :)

[vkuells]

Vicki,
With the exception of plating, I do all of my own restoration work. I know a fellow with a cutting head, whats your e-mail and I will give it to him.
-Aaron
Aaron
What do you use to polish them up? Can you use neverdull or semichrome polish?
Thanks,
Vicki

[makoman1860]

makoman-

know anyone with mixers or tips? :)

None to spare sorry, if enough people want them I may have a small production run made, but just for a couple it hardly justifies the hassle and cost.

[makoman1860]

Aaron
What do you use to polish them up? Can you use neverdull or semichrome polish?
Thanks,
Vicki


Vicki,
For cleaning the copper portions of the tips, here is my formula.

1-ultrasonic clean
2-scrub with WHITE scotchbrite
3-soak in CLR for about 10 minutes
4-Rinse and scrub with WHITE scotchbrite
5-Polish with Brasso or semichrome
6-Ultrasonic clean again
7-clear with laquer (optional)

I gave the fellow with the cutting head your e-mail. Hope it works out.

[ian111]

i might be interested in a set up mixers and tips if you do a run

also would be interested in buying a machined teflon washer from you for my oxygen valve
would you be open to make me one?

let me know some details
-Ian