Any problems with the powermax 65

[Heavyopp]

New to the forum, been reading for a few days.

Looking for my 1st plasma cutter. The powermax 45 would probably be plenty of machine for me but I'm also looking hard at the 65. I hate buying things twice. The 65 would definately be plenty of machine.

What scares me is that the machine is so new.
Anyone heard of any problems?
How's hypertherm themselves with fixing problems?
What are the chances that a second generation -- Revised model comes out relatively soon?
Thoughts on the 65?

When I bought my 1st welder I went big with no regrets. Miller trailblazer 250G. I never welded before but figured I'd learn and didn't want to be held back by which machine I had. That was 18 to 20 years ago. Still running 3 processes with that machine.

Today I also just ordered a MillerMatic 211 to replace a weldpack 100 I had for equally as long.

Just thinking along the same lines with my 1st plasma...

Thanks for any info.

[Rbeckett]

Heavy, The 65 is the replacement for the PM 1000 if I am not mistaken. The PM 1000 was a mature platform that has been in the system for many trouble free years. If this is an outgrowth or follow on technology it will be as good or better than the PM1000. Hyperterm has the reputation of constant product improvement and suppot second to none. The internal circuits and components should be equal or better and I would buy that machine based on that assumption. I have a PM 1000 G3 and it has worked flawlessly for about 5 years on my Torchmate 4X4 small shop machine. I ordered mine with the machine torch and it has also performed extremely well through the same time.
Bob

[jimcolt]

Rbeckett said it pretty well. Hypertherm has the largest market share with its plasma systems, so when you think about it.....when they release a new product they are in reality competing with themselves. This means that the new product must be better in every way. New products from Hypertherm are generally a new design that utilizes the best technologies that we have developed with past designs, and incorporates new technology that has been developed since the last product design. It takes Hypertherm over 2 years to develop a new plasma system, and about 12 to 18 months of that time is spent with alpha and beta prototypes in our reliability lab being abused with harsher operating conditions than would normally be found in the field.

Other manufacturers often just tweak an existing design, and tend to use their torch designs for 10, 15 or 20 years. Hypertherm, with its large engineering group is constantly improving power supply, torch and consumable designs, and when new technology is developed, it is incorporated into the next system designs.

Hypertherms improvement goals with new products are:
1. Higher reliability
2. Longer consumable life (lower operating cost)
3. Better cut quality (cut edge angularity, dross, cut speed, cut edge metalurgy)
4. Ease of use (portable, multi voltage, ergonomically designed)
5. Competitively priced.
6. Solving any past issues with systems.

If Hypertherms new products do not achieve the benchmarks that were developed by the design team early in the design phase...then the release is delayed, or the new design is scrapped. In my years at Hypertherm...I have actually seen a few major product designs that were scrapped after over a year of costly development!

So the answer on the Powermax 65, although from me may be considered somewhat biased.....is that it (and the new 85) is simply the most reliable, best performing air plasma system you can buy in its power level. It is a 65 Amp plasma rated at 50% duty cycle at full output (9 killowatts @ 104 degrees F), and 100% duty cycle at 46 Amps (6.4 killowatts @104 degrees F).

It is always a good idea to buy slightly larger than your current needs, however the Hypertherm units are not the lowest priced plasma systems....and are conservatively rated. Expect only the best as far as service and support for your Hypertherm equipment as well.....the company is owned by the employees, which tends to make each employee owner go the extra mile to ensure customer satisfaction.

Jim Colt Hypertherm

[Heavyopp]

Thanks for the replies. From your experiences it sounds like there's nothing to worry about with the newly developed machine.

I haven't even looked at other brands of plasma cutters. Like I said, I hate buying twice.

Jer

[LarryO]

The problem with the Hypertherm Powermax 65 is i dont have one.........:D:laugh:

[SundownIII]

Got two Hypertherm plasma's (PM 1250 & PM 600) in the shop and, as long as I own the shop, there won't ever be another brand there.

Great performance, long consumable life, and an overall great company (customer support) standing behind the product.

Buying quality only hurts once. Buying junk hurts every time you use it.

[AaronL]

I just got the 65 last week, and although I've only used it twice, It was very easy to use. After installing the electrical connection I was cutting metal in less than 5 minutes. So far I have cut 1 1/2" with it very clean and pretty fast I thought. The only thing I disliked about the setup, was that the cable supplied with the unit is a 3 phase cable, and the manual didn't tell you what colors to hook up for single phase operation, so the cover was removed to find which wires where in which terminal. Not that big of a deal, just added a little time to the initial setup. It did give me a chance to see the inside of the unit, not much there really some electronics, pneumatic controls, a fan, and a big heat sink. I think you will enjoy using whatever model Hypertherm plasma machine you purchase.

[ss42768]

Heavy, go for it, you will not be sorry. I work for an LWS and have sold Hypertherm plasmas for almost 20 years. I work with dozens of suppliers, and Hypertherm is by far the easiest to deal with, from customer service, to our rep, to the techs at the factory. When advances are made in plasma cutting, and plasma machines, Hypertherm is the one making them.

[ccawgc]

Don't worry about hypertherm products. And if it does fail, any hypertherm repair center will take care of you. Hyperterm watches the failure rates real close and will make changes if needed. Some times on a case by case bases the parts can be covered under warranty if you have a known problem pop up as your warranty expires.

[Heavyopp]

So it looks like I'm going to order from weldersource.com. My local welding supply houses are all a bunch of crooks. The good one where I dealt with for 18 years closed up the remote location a few years ago. It took a little while to find one where I wasn't just a number. But they sure do rob me.

The big one nearby, Airgas, Is the worst place any person could go. I can't believe they are still in business the way they treat people.

Maybe I'm just not big enough for them to care.

Thanks for all the info. I'll be sure to post how it goes with my 1st plasma.

Jer

[Heavyopp]

It's here!!! Would you belive that UPS didn't have a signature required for $2500 worth of product.
I was here but the driver was already walking away after just leaving it at the front door.

Anyway, I've opened the box and pulled out the manual. It seems that the 65 comes wired for 3 phase with a 4 wire cord with no plug. They already want me to buy another cord for single phase operation. Most likely I'll isolate the 4th wire in the supplied cord and still use it.

I've got the typical 3 pronged dryer connector for a supply @ 80 amps in my shop.

Any reason to change from this??

I've also been working on filters for my air supply. Bought the motor guard M60 and also a cheaper filter/water separator to fit into the system. Hopefully my compressor is up to the task. Time will tell.

Jer

[jimcolt]

The only concerns.....when operated on single phase, the maximum current draw could exceed the dryer plug rating (those are usually rated at 40 amps).....also, check the conductor size on the cable going in to the Powermax65....if it is large enough to handle the maximum rated current draw for your particular line voltage...then you will be fine. Look in your manual, or on the data tag on the unit....you will notice that for single phase operation the unit will draw more amperage at 200 to 208 volts input, a little less at 230-240 volts input. The wire size and fuse (breaker size) should be sized according to what you have for line voltage.

Use the green (ground) and the white and black for the hot legs, tape up the red wire as you won't need that one for single phase. If the existing inlet power cord is not sized adequately for your single phase power....you can use it temporarily until you can get the right sized cable. The unit will only draw maximum power when you are cutting the thickest materials with a long arc stretch.


Jim Colt

[Heavyopp]

Thanks for the reply Jim.

Having never had and electric dryer I just assumed that the receptacle I had there was like a dryer receptacle. I checked it today it's rated at 50 amps. NEMA 10-50R I believe is what it said. I wrote it down but off course it's still in the truck. It's also running off a 80 amp breaker. I've never used this circuit before. I'm in a garage converted shop that I've never welded in before. All my welding has been done previously at another location with an engine driven welder for the heavy stuff.

Anyway -- The building has plenty of power to handle the plasma. Previous owner did use this circuit for his welder.

According to the manual the PM 65 wants 74 amps for arc stretch with an input current of 44 amps @ 230-240 volts. On page 2-7 of the manual it calls for a wire change to a 3 wire power cord with 8 awg wire, A 4 wire power cord is supplied with 8 awg wire. It looks like what I was planning will be fine. I'm going to isolate the white wire out of the system and use the supplied power cord. Red and black for hot with green for the ground.

I'm also thinking of hard wiring the unit to the power source. I see no benefit for me to be able to unplug the powermax. I'll never be able to use it at my other location. Not enough juice. The only real reason I could see for being able to be "portable" is for someone to borrow it. Hard wired gives me an excuse to keep it for myself.

For the record, I'm an irrigation contractor. Have a few pieces of construction equipment and a few trucks and trailers. I'm not a welder by trade. I do get a great deal of enjoyment from welding and find myself behind a welding helmet whenever I get the chance. The plasma just opens up a few more doors for me. It should certainly make aluminum work much more pleasurable. Hopefully I can retire my jigsaw and candle wax.

Jer

[jimcolt]

Sounds like you have it under control....should work out just fine. Let me know how you like the unit once you are all set up....I haven't heard a complaint yet about the 65 or the 85 systems.

I know what you mean about systems getting borrowed! I have 3 portable plasma systems in my home shop...they often disappear for weeks at a time....my buddies just come take them without telling me.

Jim

[Heavyopp]

So I had the opportunity to get the 65 fired up today. Having never used a plasma before I wasn't sure what to expect. I have been around someone else using plasma but never myself.

After getting it all wired up I grabbed a piece of scrap 1/4 inch 6061 aluminum. I really had no idea where to start on the amps so I set the machine to 55 amps with the air flow being controlled automatically by the powermax. Before I had plugged the machine in I did check the torch consumables. There was a 65 amp tip installed which looks to have been test fired.

I didn't have any shaded safety glasses so I used my Miller helmet I just didn't turn it on. I was able to see just fine. So I set up on the aluminum and pulled the trigger. Dragged nice and easy and the piece fell to the ground. The powermax was awesome...for awhile.

I ended up pulling out a partial sheet of 1/4 inch aluminum and layed out some pieces I had to cut out for a project. I couldn't make a decent, straight cut freehand so I needed to use a straight edge. Not the powermax's fault.

Anyway things where going smooth once I got the hang of it but I was having trouble getting the torch to light. I figured this was just the nature of the beast and kept plugging away. Finally it got so bad that I had to stop and figure out what was wrong. I had my ground clamp on my workpiece not on the table so that wasn't it.

Turns out theres a pin that holds the safety latch on the trigger. This pin goes thru the trigger, a spring, and the safety latch. Unfortunately the pin is indersized for the hole in the trigger and kept backing out. When this pin moves just a little in either direction it prevents movement of the trigger. The bottom line is I just couldn't get enough movement out of the trigger to activate the torch. Once I knew to watch for the loose pin all was excellent. The torch lit easily every time.

I have a feeling I'm going to wonder how Iived without a plasma all this time.

Jer

[jimcolt]

Jer,

Please contact my direct email. It sounds as though there is a defect with your torch, and I would like to get your contact info so we can get it resolved immediately.

Jim Colt jim.colt@hypertherm.com

[Heavyopp]

And I was just going to locktite the thing.... Email sent.

Jer

[jimcolt]

If you could.....hold off from making any fix on the trigger assembly. Our production and quality people have already shut things down this morning and are inspecting every trigger assembly (hundreds of them!) for defects.....and I suspect they may want yours back. As soon as I hear how they would like to handle it...we will get back to you.

Jim Colt

[Mick120]

That's as good a reason to not consider using anything other than Hypertherm. (Apart from the lil Liquidarc that came with the factory)
One guy has a problem and the whole production stops to rectify.....speaks volumes about the company and the product.

[Heavyopp]

I certainly will hold off on doing anything to the torch. Well, I might use it a little, but I won't attempt to fix it.

The pin moves easily with my finger and about every 3rd firing I have to put it back into place to clear the main housing to allow the trigger to depress fully.

I have to agree about the quality control. If that 1 post about 1 defective pin shut down the line and caused hundreds of torches to be inspected... It sure does say something about you guys. I suspect that there had to be others found that contributed to the shut down.

Anyway, Thanks for looking after your product. I don't expect that I'll need a new plasma anytime soon but anyone who asks me will certainly get the push towards Hypertherm.

Jer

[TJS]

Why are you using the red wire for one of the hot leg swhen the white and black should be used for the hot legs and the green for the ground when using single phase 220v.
T.J.

[Heavyopp]

Why are you using the red wire for one of the hot leg swhen the white and black should be used for the hot legs and the green for the ground when using single phase 220v.
T.J.


I rewired the inside of the hypertherm so that the red wire was the hot wire instead of the white. I ended up sealing the white wire with tape and tying it up and out of the way. On the power end I cut it flush with the main insulation and ended up wiring a plug on there.

Nema 10-50p to match my receptacle.

I was gonna hard wire it but the big box stores didn't have what I wanted to do it and I forgot my vaseline for the trip to the electrical supply house. I didn't want to wait any longer so I put the plug on there. Most likely I'll order what I want for the hard wire but for now I'm gonna run the plug and see what happens.

If I was to use the white wire as a hot I should have recoded it black. I just figured I had 2 wires that where the right color so why not use them. There's no question that red and black are hot.

Jer

[Heavyopp]

Got a call from Steve at Hypertherm today. Said they checked their entire stock of torches and couldn't find any problems. This seemed to make him even more interested in getting his hands on my trigger assembly.

He's sending a new trigger assembly for me to swap out with mine. I'll then send him my defective assembly so they can see if there are any potential problems lurking on the horizon.

Sure sounds like Hypertherm is gonna be on top of any issues with the new units coming out. Kinda answered my question in my original post.

Jer

[jimcolt]

Jer,

Steve is the engineer that does much of the mechanical design and testing for the Powermax torches...he gets pretty concerned with reports of issues like yours! I know that our quality people disrupted production and inspected approximately 200 sets of torches/trigger assemblies the other day. Maybe you should go buy a lottery ticket!

Keep us posted on how things progress!

Best regards, Jim Colt Hypertherm