SHLURP - this sucks

[Franz]

Since we got new neighbors, the lawnmower guys, I figured I'd drag this over here and let the neighbors wonder how crazy us new folk are.
Shlurp
Shlurp is a Green, environmentally friendly, machine made with over 90% recycled material. It also replaces the 19 bent pieces of sheet metal I've made to drain oil from different machines and garden tractors, none of witch I can find when I need them.
Shlurp is made from one of the millions of 20# propane tanks that are now homeless because some government NITWIT decided tanks needed OPD valves.
The wheels are from an old system for spraying basement waterproofing, and the handle is from a floor scrubber. The onboard vacuum pump came from a hospital dumpster.
A dip tube was installed to within 1/2" of the tank bottom, and a port was added to the side of the nipple that replaces the valve.
Vacuum sucks the oil from the machine crankcase, and when the 20# propane tank is full, the hose on the pump is moved to the pressure side to discharge the oil from the tank.
Before removing the original propane valve, I ran a vacuum pump on the tank for a few hours, and then ran some Co2 into the tank before removing the valve. Neighbors downwind might have thought there was a skunk in the neighborhood during the evacuation.

This device can be made without any welding on the tank itself and it's probably a lot safer doing it that way.

[Franz]

Well, I screwed the picture up, so here it is, I hope.

[Scott S]

Franz,
I was going to change my oil in my boat that way. I ran that buy a boat mech in passing and he said that it is bad for the seals. What do you think about that? If so, is that just for boats? the engine is a 175 I/O Mercruiser. Basically a GM motor.

[Franz]

My first thought is the boat mechanic is making good bucks changing oil and doesn't want to loose it.
Did he explain exactly how sucking the oil out of the sump with what amounts to little more than a vacuum cleaner hurts seals? I'd like to hear that explanation.
I suppose if the entire oil sump were put under a vacuum it might be tough on seals, but that doesn't happen with this device.
If we're talking an inboard, I think they already have a hookup for a suction hose so the oil doesn't drain into the bilge.
There might be a problem, but I can't see it.

I'm currently working on a cousin of Shlurp that will suck antifreeze into some of the contraptions engineers call car cooling systems because refilling a lot of them does little more than eat time trying to bleed air locks out of the system.

Shlurp's other cousin is a hydraulic oil dispenser that has eliminated all the fun of pouring oil into small systems from a 5 gallon pail.

[boilerman]

friend of mine has a system to change antifreeze by sucking it out
start car ...remove rad. cap warm up till thermo is open ....sucks out all antifreeze and collapes the hoses ...flips 2 valve and refills system from another tank of premixed antifreeze....done in under 3 minutes...and it runs off of compressed air

[Jim314]

When I first bought my boat with an inboard outboard, I took it in to have the oil changed. Guess what they did, sucked the oil out. I figured I could do that too and save a little cash. Bought a pump and used for several years. Never saw any ill affects from it.

[Scott S]

Franz,
He said that because of the direction the pressured oil is pumped that it would do damage to pull it in the opposite direction.

[Franz]

Originally posted by Scott S
Franz,
He said that because of the direction the pressured oil is pumped that it would do damage to pull it in the opposite direction.

That makes sense, if the guy knew what the hell he was talking about. This system doesn't put negative pressure on the sump, it just sucks oil.
Come to think of it, the guy evidently never saw an ONAN CCK engine either cause those used pulsating vacuum caused by the pistons in the cylinders to operate a siaphram fuel pump mounted to the crankcase.
Does he get a lot of money for oil changes?

[Scott S]

Franz,
Yes he did charge me $65.00 for the oil change. I'm only stupid once! I have done my own after that. Your set-up will make it alot easier. The frain is so low into the bilge that I have to drain it into a small, flat container, stopping, emptying it about 8 times until totally empty. I won't mind not having to do that anymore!

[Franz]

Scott, I do have one thought I probably ought to add here, and that is it would be a good idea to open the drain valve and let the last pint or so of oil into that pan in the bilge, to be sure you get rid of sediment laying in the bottom of the sump.
I came up with this design to do lawnmowers and garden tractors cause I was sick of hunting up the drain chute I had made for each machine, so the damn oil didn't run down the belt, or making another one cause I couldn't find the one I made.
Shlurp is really just an adaptation of what a lot of the Old Engine guys call a topsider, and some small engine and lawn equipment manufacturers have even made electric pumps for oil changing.
I'm probably the last guy who should be giving anybody advise on boats, I see them as nothing but a hole in the water people throw money into, and I've always hated workin on the damn things.

[Scott S]

Franz,
Thanks for that tip. You sure are right about a black hole to throw money into. The two best days of a boat owners life; the day you buy it....and the day you sell it. See, I have something to look forward to...LOL

[Dave I]

Thanks Franz. Id really like to make one of these for my dad. He has a flat bottom v-drive Sanger with a big block in it and has to lay a glass cake pan in the bottom of it and drain the oil into that. He has to fill the cake pan 4-5 times and usually makes a mess.

I just keep finding more and more reasons for buying a new welder and more tools. Thanks!!! :D

[bitternut]

I found an easy way to drain oil in my I/O using a rubber grease gun hose. Its plumbed into the sump drain plug and when I want to change the oil I reach down and stick the hose out of the bilge drain hole. The hose has a pipe plug in the end and you just remove the plug and drain into a pan. I have a Iron Duke ( 4-cyl ) and a couple of my buddies have 4.3 v-6's. The hose drain works good for us and it drains oil the way it should be........out the bottom of the sump.

[Franz]

Bitternut, that's a lot like the way oil drains are set up in Bobcat loaders.
As long as a proper hose is used, it's a good system, but when people try it with a cheap hose, byby engine.

[Magnetic Mechanic]

Franz,
I was going to change my oil in my boat that way. I ran that buy a boat mech in passing and he said that it is bad for the seals. What do you think about that? If so, is that just for boats? the engine is a 175 I/O Mercruiser. Basically a GM motor.

When I was a boat mechanic (different lifetime) we used a rig (supplied by mercruiser9 that sucked the oil out through the dipstick tube

[farmersamm]

Good idea. Is that a Hoover handle?

I imagine even with a tightly sealed crankcase/block/your inlet tube, the PVC system on the engine would not let a vacuum build inside the motor.

[engnerdan]

Those things are great. I bought one of the liquivacs a while back and it works but I am tired of pumping it so I am going to buy an air powered one

Liquivac
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_465467_465467

Air Powered Suckers
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200323340_200323340

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=46149


I have a similar setup for sucking antifreeze made from an stainless steel fire extinguisher and a venturi sandblasting gun. Works great for sucking out all the coolant from and engine.


-Dan

[littlefuzz]

The oil is supposed to be sucked out of the dipstick, that's why the tube goes all the way to the bottom of the pan. My I/O didn't have a drain plug, just a place where the dipstick tube screwed in.

[duaneb55]

Wow! A 4+yo thread resurrected.:D Good ideas never die.

[KRS]

Holy thread-revival batman !

[farmersamm]

4 YEARS And I was dumb enough to ask if it was a Hoover handle.:)

[duaneb55]

Holy thread-revival batman !
:laugh::laugh::laugh:


4 YEARS And I was dumb enough to ask if it was a Hoover handle.:)
Sometimes it takes me longer than that to catch up!:laugh:

[denrep]

I wonder whatever became of cousin Franz?

If you want a tool that really sucks get one of these:
24703
Air operated diaphragm pump.

Very useful for all kinds of fluid transfer.
More suction and more efficient use of shop air than the venturi vacuums.
Just stick the wand in the dipstick tube... and -as 'ol Franz used to say- shluuurp!
Drains filter canisters and settled water from sumps too.

I've noticed lots of bargain priced AC system vacuum pumps around lately; that could be a cheap way to build the Franz system.

PS - Glad I stopped over. - I'm working in screen 2 trying to draft a polite response to a legal letter, but I couldn't find just the right words to express my feelings without being rude. I think I have ‘em now!

[farmersamm]

So then, by default, I was RIGHT. It is a Hoover handle, and ain't nobody around to dispute the fact:laugh:

The OP is off in the Bermudas with his babe enjoyin' his ill gotten sub prime mortgage booty, and just doesn't give a damn.:cry:

[farmersamm]

I wonder whatever became of cousin Franz?

If you want a tool that really sucks get one of these:
24703
Air operated diaphragm pump.
Very useful for all kinds of fluid transfer.
More suction and more efficient use of shop air than the venturi vacuums.
Just stick the wand in the dipstick tube... and sluuurp!
Drains filter canisters and settled water from sumps too.

I've noticed lots of bargain priced AC system vacuum pumps around lately; that could be a cheap way to build the Franz system.

PS - Glad I stopped over. - I'm working in screen 2 trying to draft a polite response to a legal letter, but I couldn't find just the right words to express my feelings without being rude. I think I have ‘em now!

No polite response to a legal letter. DROP DEAD??........ Saves printer ink.

[duaneb55]

denrep - will that thing pump NO OIL?

[farmersamm]

Isn't Franz the Gov. of California now?

[denrep]

Duaneb55 - First I want to challenge Jamlit to an oil pump duel:
http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php?p=217890
Then, winner pumps No Oil.

Farmersamm- To recognize the Hoover handle, are you a vacuum cleaner aficionado?
Or just been intently watching the maids for a long time? :laugh:

I had an old cloth covered vacuum cleaner hose around the shop. (No, not "around" it :angry:)
One day a guy spotted it: "Oh my gawd!" That's a such and such model Snake's Hide hose for a blah blah...

After he said that, it did resemble a snake's skin.
That's when I found out there are vacuum cleaner collectors/restorers too! :laugh:

[Billdacat]

I admire your ingenuity with using a propane tank. :D
This company “CAP Oil Change systems, LLC” markets a similar device that is used for extracting oil from heavy equipment; old news and serious money. What is most interesting, they also sell various Banjo fittings that bolt directly to the oil pan drain hole. A permanent hydraulic hose whip then allows connection to any vacuum extraction device.
The advantage is draining from the lowest point of the engine.

[duaneb55]

Duaneb55 - First I want to challenge Jamlit to an oil pump duel:
http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php?p=217890
Then, winner pumps No Oil.:
Wouldn't that be looser pumps No Oil?:rolleyes:


After he said that, it did resemble a snake's skin.
That's when I found out there are vacuum cleaner collectors/restorers too! :laugh:
Did you see that 9 or 10yo kid on Jay Leno a couple years back that restores old VCs? He had some pretty neat looking old 'suckers' on the show.

[duaneb55]

I admire your ingenuity with using a propane tank. :D
This company “CAP Oil Change systems, LLC” markets a similar device that is used for extracting oil from heavy equipment; old news and serious money. What is most interesting, they also sell various Banjo fittings that bolt directly to the oil pan drain hole. A permanent hydraulic hose whip then allows connection to any vacuum extraction device.
The advantage is draining from the lowest point of the engine.

We got a couple new 80K stand-by gensets where I work after Ike and they have a hand pump mounted on the unit and plumbed to bottom of the oil pan for doing the job with a discharge hose connection for directing the waste oil into the proper container. Units haven't been run enough to warrant an oil change yet (power came back on 5 minutes after I got the first one hooked up!:mad:) so I don't know how long it takes to pump out a full load. I'll try to remember to get some photos and post them.

[farmersamm]

Duaneb55 - First I want to challenge Jamlit to an oil pump duel:
http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php?p=217890
Then, winner pumps No Oil.

Farmersamm- To recognize the Hoover handle, are you a vacuum cleaner aficionado?
Or just been intently watching the maids for a long time? :laugh:

I had an old cloth covered vacuum cleaner hose around the shop. (No, not "around" it :angry:)
One day a guy spotted it: "Oh my gawd!" That's a such and such model Snake's Hide hose for a blah blah...

After he said that, it did resemble a snake's skin.
That's when I found out there are vacuum cleaner collectors/restorers too! :laugh:

Oh man, another hobby to get into?? I have enough stupid ones as it is:laugh:

Saw a teenage kid on "60 Minutes" a while back that collected vacuum cleaners.:confused: I'll feel like a fool one day when he retires on the proceeds from his collection, and I'm still scratchin' in the dirt. Probably worth more than a share of Ford stock right now:laugh:

[farmersamm]

About draining from lowest point in lube system. First time you pull an oil pan off to get to the crank, ya realize that a LOT of stuff stays right there in the sump. It ain't moved in 200 oil changes, and it ain't gonna.

Roll the truck etc., end over end, down a mountainside, and ya might have to worry about sediment gettin' in the oil. Lighter stuff that damages the bearings is held by the detergent oil, and filtered out. The screen on the oil pump sump, I guess, protects you from the rest.

[Old Fart]

Generally I dont say much cause I dont type real well 2 fingers take a while and I dont learn much when Im talking. I dont much take to smartmouthing so Ill just say I dont see any call for people who werent around when Franz led the walkout at Hobart that got this board going some years back. Its sort of funny how all you youngsters know so much, like has anybody got plans for and how would you do this think you have the knowledge to smartmouth.

That said, I have yet to see anybody ever asked Franz how to do something he didnt bust his butt to help. Franz has come up with more tools and ways of doing things easy than about anybody I ever met and I'm glad I dont live but 15 miles from him. The man came up with so many uses for used propane bottles there aint one to be found around here. Hes also always improving on designs and Shlurp with the handle from an ELECTRIC BROOM as shown on here is now replaced by Shlurp3 along with a oil cart that dispenses both hydro + gear oils. He used the rest of the electric broom for a stump burner rig. He also came up with a complete tire changing system for garden tractors that includes a blaster just like the tire machines have.

Now that he has fully developed electrolitic rust removal, hes reinventing a sandblast cabinet, using another propane tank that slefloads and recycles the sand using minimum compressed air. Funny thing is he seems to do all his projects with stuff most consider scrap or junk.

One final thing, this board lost a whole lot when Franz and the people who built it left, and I dont see a whole lot of replacement so far.

Best of luck to you youngsters.

[denrep]

Old Fart, I don't believe anyone was berating Franz.
And after all, he said himself that his idea sucked. :laugh:

As to: "...this board lost a whole lot when Franz and the people who built it left, and I don't see a whole lot of replacement so far."

Grab the reins!

Good Luck

[mark8310]

Generally I dont say much cause I dont type real well 2 fingers take a while and I dont learn much when Im talking. I dont much take to smartmouthing so Ill just say I dont see any call for people who werent around when Franz led the walkout at Hobart that got this board going some years back. Its sort of funny how all you youngsters know so much, like has anybody got plans for and how would you do this think you have the knowledge to smartmouth.

That said, I have yet to see anybody ever asked Franz how to do something he didnt bust his butt to help. Franz has come up with more tools and ways of doing things easy than about anybody I ever met and I'm glad I dont live but 15 miles from him. The man came up with so many uses for used propane bottles there aint one to be found around here. Hes also always improving on designs and Shlurp with the handle from an ELECTRIC BROOM as shown on here is now replaced by Shlurp3 along with a oil cart that dispenses both hydro + gear oils. He used the rest of the electric broom for a stump burner rig. He also came up with a complete tire changing system for garden tractors that includes a blaster just like the tire machines have.

Now that he has fully developed electrolitic rust removal, hes reinventing a sandblast cabinet, using another propane tank that slefloads and recycles the sand using minimum compressed air. Funny thing is he seems to do all his projects with stuff most consider scrap or junk.

One final thing, this board lost a whole lot when Franz and the people who built it left, and I dont see a whole lot of replacement so far.

Best of luck to you youngsters.

Hey, Franz ,,,,, good to see you stopped in, after so many years gone. How's everything been going????? Be sure to say hi to fishy for me ,,,,, kinda miss having my favorite whipping boy around everytime I feel like kicking a little *** :laugh::laugh::laugh:

[farmersamm]

Franz/Gov. of California was supposed to refer to Arnold (who is governor). A little humor. Sorry, didn't mean to offend. Point taken.

I thought using a recycled Hoover handle was a good idea. WAsn't puttin' it down. Scrounging's a good thing. I didn't realize it was an "electric broom" handle. Sorry.

[Mud Spaz]

Hey, Franz ,,,,, good to see you stopped in, after so many years gone. How's everything been going????? Be sure to say hi to fishy for me ,,,,, kinda miss having my favorite whipping boy around everytime I feel like kicking a little *** :laugh::laugh::laugh:

He's prolly stuck under a pile of old volkswagon wheels.:p

[retiredIW]

would like more details on how it is plumbed. cant tell much from this picture

[reefera4m]

Re; Damaging seals. Time to call BS on the mechanic that suggested this. I've seen a number of engines that use pumps to evacuate oil from engines - particluarly on larger engines. I have a friend that has owned a number of yachts with various diesel (Lehmans, Cummins, Detroit) and they have either had oil extraction pumps oringially or he has added them. The first one he added was at the recommendation of his mechanic. Just the thought of trying to drain the oil from an engine (or two in his case) in a confined space that hold 20+ quarts each makes a pump a neccessity.

Even if the PCV system was plugged you'd probably suck air past the piston frings befor you'd suck out a seal.

[tresi]

Re; Damaging seals. Time to call BS on the mechanic that suggested this. I've seen a number of engines that use pumps to evacuate oil from engines - particluarly on larger engines. I have a friend that has owned a number of yachts with various diesel (Lehmans, Cummins, Detroit) and they have either had oil extraction pumps oringially or he has added them. The first one he added was at the recommendation of his mechanic. Just the thought of trying to drain the oil from an engine (or two in his case) in a confined space that hold 20+ quarts each makes a pump a neccessity.

Even if the PCV system was plugged you'd probably suck air past the piston frings befor you'd suck out a seal.

At the risk hi jacking a very old thread I agree with calling BS. Wouldn't loosening the oil filler cap relieve any vacuum without effecting the suction pump? At work we have a 2008 R520s kubota loader that has the crankcase sealed so tight that if you just pull the drain plug the oil will just trickle out, Loosen the filler cap and the oil come gushing out.