Choosing an Automatic helmet

[Flywelder]

Guys, I am looking at purchasing my first automatic darkening helmet, I want to know from those who already use one, what features should I look for, what is needed and not needed as features,?
and what features and brands to stay away from,?
Is a fixed shade OK, or will I wish I could change the shade later on?
How fast do I want it to darken? or are they all fast, no mater who makes the helmet?
and where do you think the best price is for one right now?

I see my local TSC store has one on sale for $49.00 It is a fixed shade of 10., Is this the buy of the season?
Flywelder

[lorenzo]

I use a Jackson Executive ( I think that's the model ) anyway.... I like the large viewing area, ( at the time it was the largest I could find ) since I was used to 4 x 5 shield to begin with. Personally I wouldn't buy a lens that was a fixed shade but there again I do a variety of welding processes, some have a more intense arc than others. I think mine adjusts from 9 to 14. The speed of the darkening..... well I'd want that to be as fast as possible. When it comes to buying a helmet you have to make sure you are buying the best helmet you can afford to buy..... don't skimp it's better to have a helmet that adjusts to a shade you don't think you'll use than chance damaging your eyes because your helmet is a fixed 10 shade and what you really need is a 12 shade.

[Rich59]

I am a hobby welder and my helmet gets rather light use so I have a Harbor Freight auto darkening helmet. It adjusts from 9 to 12 and has worked reliably. I got it for $49.

In the low price range I doubt there is much difference in the quality between HF and TSC.

[lorenzo]

By the way, the Jackson helmet has enough room to allow me to wear a filter mask if I need to. The other helmets I looked at didn't have the room.

[Flywelder]

great info guys, keep the relies coming. I want to add the question,:between large view area and the standard small viewing area ( window) what are the advantages to the large, I have a small window now .

Also, a green lens or the gold? I like the gold's clarity, over the green, how about you?

Flywelder

[BD1]

hi, I looked at the Jackson Nex Gen and the Miller Elite.Chose the Elite. The hood is awesome. I think it is right up there with the other big buck ones, $250.00. They got the largest viewing area around and it will take magnifier lense too. There are all kinds of past posts about this. Thats where I looked. I found it is best to try one before you buy it. Even just putting it on makes a difference. Jackson head gear as far as i saw sucked compared to the Miler. Everybody likes something different , thats way they make so darn many. When I started 35 years ago there was only a few, jackson and fibermate I think were most popular. Good choosing, they all have awesome finishes and colors.

[cheeseclip]

mine is a blue lens and its great for clarity

[dad]

I know opinions vary when talking about trusting a companies research that is selling something, but here's my 2 cents. It is said ( good article on Lincoln Electric web site ) that an auto darkening helmet has the "uv" protection to protect your eyes, even when not darkened. The reason for the darkening is to help you see things better reducing the light from the arc. The reason for a large viewing area is so if you are in an awkward position, causing you to have to look through your helmet at an angle, either left, right, up, down, you have a better chance of being able to see what you're welding versus a small viewing area. I have a green lensed cheap $100 fixed shade "Hawk" helmet. The fixed shade is fine for me for now due to doing mostly mig welding. I would however like a larger viewing area though. If you have the money, go large with variable shade to give you the option to lighten or darken it. That way you should be able to find a setting that allows you to see your best. If you can't see it good than it will affect your welding in a bad way for strength and looks.
Dad.

[Spec-V]

Ebay is your friend. Don't get a fixed shade when you can get a variable 9-13 for same or less money. You want Light to dark 0.00004 seconds.

[Grahame]

Make sure the unit you do purchase conforms with your local safety standard for the this type of helmet.I think your US.ASMI has a Z.1 in the numerical coding somewhere There are a couple of reasonable Chinese ones that do, Tecmen is one of them.I checked them out they have been around since 1984. I have tried a friend's non adjustable one on mig tig and stick and it was ok from 30 to 130 amps.It was also solar,so there was no pain in the bum battery to go flat.

As far as eye damage from the slower speedis concerned, UV damage occurs with direct contact to the naked eye. The lowly pair of CR39 safety glass lens will stop UV. What does occurr is the bright light from the visible part of the spectrum that won't damage the eye but gives you momentary loss of vision and perhaps sore eyes - much like being hit with high beam when driving at night. Ask you eye doctor,opthalmologist cause thats what mine told me.

Grahame

[me37]

I was insistant on going old school for 15 years, but this year finally decided to get an auto dark. The reason is that so much of what I do is in odd/tight places and too often I didn't have the option of having the hood up and then flipping it down. One thing I found using other auto darkening hoods is that it is possible to cover both light sensors, and flashing yourself. Because of that I went with a hood with four sensors. I don't play with the shade setting much, but I adjust the sensitivity when going from inside the shop to out in the field.

One thing I like to do when buying something is to research it as much as I can, decide what I want, and then try to find it on e-bay

[zapster]

i cant see spending that kind of $$$$ on something that can break at any time..

i mean get broken like pieces of glass are in a pile..

i've broken my shade lens before...stupid crap ..you know...but whatever...

(i have 3 extra #12 lenses..do you?)

...zap!

[elvergon]

Make sure the unit you do purchase conforms with your local safety standard for the this type of helmet.I think your US.ASMI has a Z.1 in the numerical coding somewhere There are a couple of reasonable Chinese ones that do, Tecmen is one of them.I checked them out they have been around since 1984. I have tried a friend's non adjustable one on mig tig and stick and it was ok from 30 to 130 amps.It was also solar,so there was no pain in the bum battery to go flat.

As far as eye damage from the slower speedis concerned, UV damage occurs with direct contact to the naked eye. The lowly pair of CR39 safety glass lens will stop UV. What does occurr is the bright light from the visible part of the spectrum that won't damage the eye but gives you momentary loss of vision and perhaps sore eyes - much like being hit with high beam when driving at night. Ask you eye doctor,opthalmologist cause thats what mine told me.

Grahame


So in that case welding with any safety lenses that give enough UV protection and not being "darkened" would stop you from getting blind if you weld with them?

I don´t think so!

I´m not an opthalmologist thought

[Grahame]

Ok I will straighten that one up with you.
On a different forum there was comment that one could suffer UV damage through the electronic LCD lens of a cheaper auto helmet. I was trying to make the point here that wearing the safety glasses would prevent a "flash" injury to the eyes. the inference was that the flickering action of a unsuitably slow reactingLCD would admit UV. Firstly UV is not within the visible spectrum.The brilliant light is however.The safety glass or plastic stops the UV not the brilliant light.of coarse you would not try and weld with them and no shield.

Believe me, its was not hard to do when using the old helmet .Just an accidental touch on the work and you get a arc. I always wore safety glasses under the helmet and was saved countless times.
The trouble is when you are younger we think we are ten foot tall and bulletproof. I saw a young welder at my local shop tacking up aluminium with a MIG the other day -no glasses and no helmet. These sorts of actions have a way of paying you back when you get older.

I still remember that doctor ripping a strip off me because I had been in to see him too many times ( 8 times in 6 months ) cause I had not worn my safety glasses. He explained that each injury had a cumalative effort and i would pay for it with eye sight damage eventually. The last time was a ripper too, I had my eyelids fused together by some slag that come off the weld and stuck my eye lids together.
Well eventually is here now and I am having alsorts of complications between scared eye tissue and diabetic problems.
Look after yourselves OK!

Grahame

[Flywelder]

Thanks every one! great info! Graham, trhanks for sharing your story, I am buying quality sfatey glasses, and going to wear them under my flip helmet!
I still am not sure which Ebay helmet to get, as so many don't list the speed at which the helmet switches those that do say 25000 of a second, I don't think that is fast enough do any of you? Also, do I need battery and solar or just solar?
Nor do the listings mention how many sensors the helmet has, obviously being sold by a non welding individual.

[Grahame]

This info comes from your own American National medical Library
"
A critical evaluation of the protection provided by common safety glasses from ultraviolet emissions in welding operations.

* Horstman S,
* Ingram JW.

The purpose of this investigation was to evaluate critically several brands of safety spectacle lens and side shield combinations to determine their attenuation characteristics for ultraviolet (UV) radiation. By combining the information developed in this investigation with field data on UV from arc welding operations, it was possible to draw the conclusion that under the conditions stated, ordinary safety glasses with solid side shields provided adequate eye protection from UV.

PMID: 517436 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] "


I have learnt through another Australian study that sigificant UV can enter the helmet through the back and sides. Reflection from working inside a veesel or space with relective surface is the cause.
also found a bit in the Navy welding manual re Uv Radiation intensity is greater in Argon based processes.I I know something happens as I often have a smell ( no not that S /ar...s about meafter a Mig or tig session. It is something to do with UV ionising the argon.

Grahame

[Clay Walters]

Grahame & Flywelder,

Don't get hung up on the switch speed. Your eyes cannot detect anything that fast and as long as the flash doesn't bother you and the UV protection is in place you'll be fine.

Do a search on this forum and others to read all the past threads you can if you wish. Fact is the fastest switch time does not equate to any measure of quality and even a $50 hood will be fine as long as it functions properly. Most will state they meet Z??? standard and will.

If you do a lot of welding buy the best. Make sure it fits you and provides as much overhead, under-chin and back flash protection as possible.

No more than I've done the el cheapo Harbor Freight model worked great but I had to tolerate a weak headgear and poor mounting arrangement of a magnifier lens. If I worked with it every day I'd want a better piece of equipment. Not so much for my eye protection but for useful features that improved my ability to work.

My thoughts,

Clay

[Clanweld]

Also wearing the glasses under your hood means you always have them on, even when you flip up the hood for a break and decide now's a good time to clean slag. I learned to keep 'em on after my first eyelid blister. Good luck!

[elvergon]

Ok I will straighten that one up with you.
On a different forum there was comment that one could suffer UV damage through the electronic LCD lens of a cheaper auto helmet. I was trying to make the point here that wearing the safety glasses would prevent a "flash" injury to the eyes. the inference was that the flickering action of a unsuitably slow reactingLCD would admit UV. Firstly UV is not within the visible spectrum.The brilliant light is however.The safety glass or plastic stops the UV not the brilliant light.of coarse you would not try and weld with them and no shield.

Believe me, its was not hard to do when using the old helmet .Just an accidental touch on the work and you get a arc. I always wore safety glasses under the helmet and was saved countless times.
The trouble is when you are younger we think we are ten foot tall and bulletproof. I saw a young welder at my local shop tacking up aluminium with a MIG the other day -no glasses and no helmet. These sorts of actions have a way of paying you back when you get older.

I still remember that doctor ripping a strip off me because I had been in to see him too many times ( 8 times in 6 months ) cause I had not worn my safety glasses. He explained that each injury had a cumalative effort and i would pay for it with eye sight damage eventually. The last time was a ripper too, I had my eyelids fused together by some slag that come off the weld and stuck my eye lids together.
Well eventually is here now and I am having alsorts of complications between scared eye tissue and diabetic problems.
Look after yourselves OK!

Grahame


Thanks for that one Grahame....


Now...I´ve never understand the terms completely....If you remember from high school....light travels at 300,000 km per second...Even if the reaction time is 1/100,000 secs light will get to your eyes before the screen gets dark. Same for UV....different wavelenghts vary the speed of light but not that much so it don´t gets to your eyes before the lens is dark....

Now...what i´ve been told is that "human body can resist extreme stuff, but just for short periods of time" That means you´re pushing the limits? that´s wrong for your eyes?

I´m looking at the hobart XTV....99 bucks....variable shade 9-13 and 1/12,000 sec reaction time...but I´m doubting about getting it or not...

[h2oboy]

I have the Jackson Nex Gen, and would sudgest it. I have had it for about 2 years and have had no problems. It has battery and solar power and you can adjust it to diffrent levels gor grinding, torch and welding. I have gone through a few helmets and price does matter somewhat. When I was starting, the farm show special for 100 worked fine, but I eventually decided to go for the larger area, and more task oprions. Now the other helmets just stay on the shelf unless I have a helper.

[littlefuzz]

I have 4 auto hoods 2 miller XLIX, 1 jackson executive 3 in 1, and a jackson journeyman. The journeyman is a small fixed lens and is ok (I bought it cheap). Most of the time I use the XLIX. I'm about to get one of the new miller elites though. Several of the guys at work have them and they are nice. They have a big window and 4 sensors. The executive is a nice lens too, I've had it the longest. It's heavier than the others, it takes 2 AAA batteries where the XLIX takes a small lithium battery.

[Pitalplace]

I have a Miller Big Window Elite and love the big window, head gear, and the weight. Save your money you will be much happier with this one.

[Guttafixit1]

I am going to buy a auto darkening helmet also. I had no clue what to get like flywelder. After reading these posts I will definitely buy a big lens. And also wear safety glasses under the helmet. Hopefully I won't spend over $150.00. I don't want to buy a cheap one and then kicked myself in the A** later. :laugh:

[billettbob]

I used a self-darkening hood before I retired and opened my own shop. We used the very expensive ones. For myself, I took a chance on a Harbor Freight model for $40.00. It amazed me because it has worked for three years. I probably lucked out and got the only one that was good, who knows. There are TWO important features that I wouldn't be without no matter how good that you buy.
The first is a variable darkening, from 9 to 13. the other is a photocell instead of a battery.
Hope this helps Billet Bob

[Guttafixit1]

Thanks Bob, I just wrote those 2 things down on the LONG list I have going. I'll be at that lincoln dealer for a long time. :laugh:

[Doolittle]

i cant see spending that kind of $$$$ on something that can break at any time..

i mean get broken like pieces of glass are in a pile..

i've broken my shade lens before...stupid crap ..you know...but whatever...

(i have 3 extra #12 lenses..do you?)

...zap!
Butterfingers

[ridgerunner]

I am going to be purchasing an elite in the next few days.After numerous contract jobs(u know the kind...pay great but never sure when or if the next one is coming)Ive found myself at an low paying,but 5 min drive away,assembly line welding job.As i am running thru or almost thru a 60 pound roll of dual sheild a 9 hr shift i am finding myself accidently flashing myself entirely too often to justify my old flip helmet.
Ive always steered away from autos because call it whatever ya will...redknecked,immature,dumbass,just plain stupid.... thru the years ive found that when something goes wrong(usualy something involving lotsa "freebie" fix time )my helmets tend to take a somewhat hasty departure from my head and an express flight into whatever is handy...it used to be the workpeice but that gets expensive quik and ive found that richocheting hammers hurt like a dickens.
Hopefully 250 helmet can work as a little therapy lol

[welder81]

I dunno, I used a standard Jackson hood with a #11 lens for a few years, then i decided to get an auto tint cause i did a lot of work under cars, i did quite a bit of pipe welding, and did a lot of welding in really tight areas. I think it was a great investment. I just feel that if it can make me a bead just a little better, a tie-in just a little nicer, to me its worth it. Especially on pipe,and being out of position, there just isnt room for error. I bought a Speedglas Hood, with variable shade 9-13, with sensitivity setting on tig, and a conventional sized window. I have had the hood for 4 years now used everyday at work, and at home and have had no problems. Ive used Lincoln auto hoods, Optrel, Hobart, and MIller, and i like this one the best. Havnt used the jackson auto tint though. Its just a personnal preferance, and i got mine for about $230.

[kbnit]

I've got several autodarkeners, but if I had to make a choice between the Jackson Executive and the Speedglas 9000X, I'd go with the Speedglas. Lightest helmet I've ever worn, and the side windows really help. As regards the response time, the difference between any quality helmet is a few microseconds. And any quality helmet will revert in the undarkened condition to at least a shade 5, which will protect you from arc flash while the helmet darkens.

[BigEd36]

I know some have had good luck with the Harbor Freight hoods, but not me. I just can't see the joint that I'm welding with mine, no matter what shade I set it on. I can take my old cheapy that came with my Tombstone that I bought in 1968 and see much better. Soooooooooooo, tonight I bit the bullet and ordered the Miller Elite 29 Roadster (love that color scheme) from IOC.

http://www.weldingsuppliesfromioc.com/catalog/big_Roadster-Helmet.jpg

It ships tomorrow, and I expect that it will be here Thursday. (I'm only about 140 miles from Indianapolis.) Then it will be time to get much better acquainted with my Millermatic 210!!

[Rick Moran]

I'm with you BigEd, found the same one under the tree and it is SWEET. :blob1:

I dropped the model # and website on Santa's lap to make sure that SHE was good to me this year. I love the color scheme, headgear, weight and big lens. I'm just a hobbyist, but I do like nice tools and equipment. At my age, money is no longer an issue as much as feel and quality. It's the only good thing about getting older! :waving:

[IrishBrewer]

Those Miller and Spedglas helmets look pretty sweet.

For what it's worth, I have one of the HF Autodarkening helmets (#91214 -t the solar cell model with the blue flame design) and for a novice like me it has been an easy and inexpensive way to improve my welding. Prior to getting this I had borrowed a friend's autodarkening hood and liked it. This was also a HF helmet but a different model - it used a battery and had an on/off switch but no sensitivity or speed adjustments. Both helmets are variable shade, 9-14.

I like the one I bought even more than my friend's. I like having the sensitivity and speed adjustments and it seems to be much brighter (less shade) when in the non-darkened mode. It has two sensors and I haven't been flashed yet.

[vdotmatrix]

I have been reading all kinds of post from here to a month os sundays andI had to balance inexperience, wallet, eye safety and ease of use. I have only read good reviews fro the Northern Tools line of Auto darkening helmets. There is the TECMEN solar powered $50 unit that has 478 out of 480 positive reviews (5 out of 5), which boasts 1/ 25,000sec and giant viewing area. The next bump up is the TECMEN solar assisted/battery unit with 1/25,000 sec response, variable shade 9-13, delay, low battery indicator, manual on /auto off, giant window. Th only this is I can't find any mention of magnifier lenses for this thing. It is made by TECMEN electronics in china and made the helmet exclusively for northern tools. I paid 144$ total, with tax and shipping.

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200342922_200342922

Hope this helps someone.....

[artworksmetal]

I was just looking at these today on one website. Even the expensive Jackson Nex Gen had a trip time of 1/25,000, so I don't think you can get any quicker than that.
My HF one does the trick for me, but I'm just a weekend welder. I do like the variable shade, though.

[mrandrei]

Miller Inferno helmet looks great. It has a light weight design too!

[HankC1]

What applications need 1/25000 response time? There are cheap models list 1/10,000s
response time and may not be good for what applications? Is solar cell on the helmet sufficient to power the lense by itself when the internal battery died? Some models have internal battery that is not user replaceable.

[Bobcatter]

Thought I would add my two cents worth to this post - it's always a good topic to discuss. I'm not a full time welder, so I'm not going to spend the really big bucks until I start making some money on this.

I started out with a fixed lens, and didn't like it. Not while welding - that's the same - but the pre-strike and post-strike or while watching an instructor. With the auto dark, you can keep it down and watch what is going on, and if the other person forgets to warn you, you don't get flashed.

My first auto dark was a Hobart. It was about $120 three years ago, it has solar cells and a battery. I found the sensor would sometimes trigger to dark from various flashes - sun, grinding, - but there was a setting to adjust. I took a Lincoln class last summer and did some heavy duty mig, and liked being able to go up to 12. I used up a 30 pound spool that week, so the helmet took a beating. Shortly there after, it started to act up. Wouldn't turn "on". I messed with it and changed the battery, put it out in the sun- sometimes it would work, sometimes it wouldn't. It finally quit about a month ago and I could not finish a job I was working on.

My new helmet is the Lincoln Vista 2000. (about $170 when I shopped the internet) WOW, what a difference! Much clearer (yes, I routinely cleaned the old one, changed the covers, etc.). The mid size screen is much larger than what I was using. NO batteries, 4 sensors. So far, no random darkening, and the adjustments include more "range" than the hobart. The headgear is VERY comfortable and features several adjustments to get it close to your neck as far as you wish. I'm pleased.

Summary: always have a back up (even if it is a cheap fixed lens), you can see just fine with the small screens if you are doing simple welding -the big screens are good for real welding when you are welding in all positions, as your education changes you will put new demands on your helmet, and (drum roll please), you get what you pay for.