Pay rates for welders
RSS | Subscribe | Contact Us | Advertise | About Us
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 64
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Northwest Arkansas
    Posts
    460

    Pay rates for welders

    I am certain this had been posted already;I am just unable to locate it at the moment. So please forgive me if this is either inappropriate or in the wrong spot or a duplicate thread.

    With all that said - WHAT IN THE NAME OF JESUS HAPPENED TO THE PAY RATE FOR WELDERS?

    I know it fluctuates by region and by area of expertise, but it seems that the pay levels for competent and certified welders across the board have fallen to just above wal mart shelf stockers. The region I'm in has a large calling for tig welding sanitary stainless; pipe and other such sanitary grade stainless products.

    But to be offered $15/hr to Fab, layout, and weld sanitary pipe just seems ridiculous.

    Am I expecting too much or is this really a slap in the face to experienced guys?

    And the funny part is that they hire trainees at the same rate they hire experienced guys ($15/hr)

    Other shops in the area are in the range of $10 to $16/hr

    :banghead:

    Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    NH no mo - MA now.
    Posts
    1,595

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Welcome to the world of supply and demand - aka the free market.
    As long as there are more welders looking for work than there are jobs available the pay rates are going to sag.

    Funny part is there will be companies clamoring for welders with open positions they can't fill but they won't raise the wage they offer to attract the talent. They are competing for business that can be filled by competitors who may be thousands of miles away. Can you say "one world economy" ??

    - Mondo
    Member, AWS
    Lincoln ProMIG 140
    Lincoln AC Tombstone
    Craftsman Lathe 12 x 24 c1935
    Craftsman Commercial Lathe 12 x 36 c1970
    - - -
    Ask for a wrench and someone will offer you a grinder.
    I'll just keep on keepin' on.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    SoCal-LA
    Posts
    5,193

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    If you think it is rough for the weldor, think about what the employer goes through. Currently I have to charge my customer 4, yes 4 times the hourly rate of a weldor's wage. That means the median being $20 an hour. My best weldor makes more than $20, my worst makes minimum wage. Trainees make training wage, which is $6.80 an hour for 12 weeks. Most are dunderheads but are happy for the experience seeing as schools are having their budgets slashed.

    Until this country starts nurturing manufacturing again, I suspect wages will decline further. I have one item that I make competes directly with a chinese manufacturer. I win the job by building twice as many in a run and stock the balance. I also automate the machining and use my minimum wage fabricators and weldors to run the job. Even then I can barely make $40/hr. on the job when I include finish and shipping to the customer. Dang third world is working for food and shelter and are happy to be alive.

    We are living in a socialist bubble.
    "Nothing welded, nothing gained."
    Miller Dynasty700DX, 3 ea. Dynasty350DX, Dynasty200DX, ThermalArc 400 GTSW, MillerMatic350P, MillerMatic200 with spoolgun, MKCobraMig260, Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm 1250, Hypertherm800

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Northwest Arkansas
    Posts
    460
    Trust me, I'm well acquainted with the supply/demand/competition stuff. I've owned 2 businesses of my own. It just seems to me that what I made when I started in the metal industry as a press and shear operator, is now the average wage for qualified welders. That was 10 years ago.

    As for the country needing to pay attention to the manufacturing jobs - I totally agree. Seems there was so much of a push from every where to seek a college degree that most people have turned to scoffing at a "blue collar" career.

    I guess I'm just disappointed and upset right now as I'm trying to find a job, but refuse to lower myself to a wage that will not supper a family of five.

    I do have employment now that was able to meet my former employers pay, but without health benefits it is not really a long term position.

    Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    67

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    You need to move to make the money right now...well from what ive seen anyways.

    Got a call from a lady in ND early last week paying in the high 20's for tank welders. Mississippi is still looking for pipe welders. Also once fall hits the nuclear plants will start shutting down for repairs and such. That is some good money if you can get in somewhere. $35+ an hour depending what company you work for.

    Government jobs is where its at! A lot of "hurry up and wait" so they call it.


    I have been offered dirt too. Dont let it bring you down though. Most of the welding jobs are in the **** pay range...there are still good paying companies out there. Cianbro is paying $32hr for gas line welders but they are a tough company to work for IMO anyways.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Fishmurda NY
    Posts
    89

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Im almost scared. It seems so confusing. you read that there a shortages of Welders yet I see no job postings. Some Welders claim there sapose to make 35-40 Hr for a well qualified pipe welder with 6g cert. Very rarely do i see a Wage higher then 20 (non Union). Granted I live in NY most work is Union and those guys kill it in Salary.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    99

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    new york pays the most for welders or so i have heard! get with a contractor working in the city!
    Thermal Arc 186 AC/DC Tig System

    Millermultimatic 200 with spool gun

    Fisher Norris 124lbs Anvil

    Liebherr Mining and Liebherr Nenzing Cranes


    http://www.etsy.com/shop/ShootAphoto

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Fishmurda NY
    Posts
    89

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Quote Originally Posted by Virginia View Post
    new york pays the most for welders or so i have heard! get with a contractor working in the city!
    The city is all union and well ill keep my thought on union to my self. The best non union guys i know are make 20-25 hr. In the city thats basically welfare status

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Northwest Arkansas
    Posts
    460

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Quote Originally Posted by Bird View Post
    You need to move to make the money right now...well from what ive seen anyways.

    Got a call from a lady in ND early last week paying in the high 20's for tank welders. Mississippi is still looking for pipe welders. Also once fall hits the nuclear plants will start shutting down for repairs and such. That is some good money if you can get in somewhere. $35+ an hour depending what company you work for.

    Government jobs is where its at! A lot of "hurry up and wait" so they call it.


    I have been offered dirt too. Dont let it bring you down though. Most of the welding jobs are in the **** pay range...there are still good paying companies out there. Cianbro is paying $32hr for gas line welders but they are a tough company to work for IMO anyways.
    I did just move. LOL I moved from Pennsylvania to Arkansas. I remember before moving seeing all the welding positions available down here. Pay was not listed in most of the ads, but the ones that did list seemed on par or slightly above my PA wages. Now I'm seeing bottom dollar for top guys??!?!?

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinL90 View Post
    Im almost scared. It seems so confusing. you read that there a shortages of Welders yet I see no job postings. Some Welders claim there supposed to make 35-40 Hr for a well qualified pipe welder with 6g cert. Very rarely do i see a Wage higher then 20 (non Union). Granted I live in NY most work is Union and those guys kill it in Salary.
    That is exactly my issues. Where are the guys that are making the "big bucks"? Union or not, Government contract or not - What happened to being payed for what you are capable of?

    People go to medical school to become doctors, right? Some stop at general family practitioners, while others go on to become surgeons. If what is proving true in the manufacturing world held true with doctors, then the guy removing a tumor from your brain would make the same as the guy who gives you your flu shot

    Do you really want the "rookie" that only welds battery boxes all day to be welding that main support column for the new high-rise building going up? OF COURSE NOT! so don't insult the poor guy that's capable and certified to do such a task.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Guerneville Ca
    Posts
    1,766

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Quote Originally Posted by dcoffmanjr View Post
    I am certain this had been posted already;I am just unable to locate it at the moment. So please forgive me if this is either inappropriate or in the wrong spot or a duplicate thread.

    With all that said - WHAT IN THE NAME OF JESUS HAPPENED TO THE PAY RATE FOR WELDERS?

    I know it fluctuates by region and by area of expertise, but it seems that the pay levels for competent and certified welders across the board have fallen to just above wal mart shelf stockers. The region I'm in has a large calling for tig welding sanitary stainless; pipe and other such sanitary grade stainless products.

    But to be offered $15/hr to Fab, layout, and weld sanitary pipe just seems ridiculous.

    Am I expecting too much or is this really a slap in the face to experienced guys?

    And the funny part is that they hire trainees at the same rate they hire experienced guys ($15/hr)

    Other shops in the area are in the range of $10 to $16/hr

    :banghead:

    Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2

    It is a slap in the face. Polite version.

    They will hire you for $10.00 phr if you will take it.
    AWS certified welding inspector
    AWS certified welder

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Northwest Arkansas
    Posts
    460

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Sorry to sound so upset (if it's not conveyed within my text, it sure is in person on this side of the monitor.) I'm just reaching a point now that I'm faced with the fact I am unable to locate employment that will provide my family with not only financial support, but also the all-too-important medical benefits. And yes, I know the health insurance is a completely different and more headache inducing topic than just pay rates.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Back in HB, close to my boys!!
    Posts
    4,677

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Quote Originally Posted by dcoffmanjr View Post
    I did just move. LOL I moved from Pennsylvania to Arkansas. I remember before moving seeing all the welding positions available down here. Pay was not listed in most of the ads, but the ones that did list seemed on par or slightly above my PA wages. Now I'm seeing bottom dollar for top guys??!?!?



    That is exactly my issues. Where are the guys that are making the "big bucks"? Union or not, Government contract or not - What happened to being payed for what you are capable of?

    People go to medical school to become doctors, right? Some stop at general family practitioners, while others go on to become surgeons. If what is proving true in the manufacturing world held true with doctors, then the guy removing a tumor from your brain would make the same as the guy who gives you your flu shot

    Do you really want the "rookie" that only welds battery boxes all day to be welding that main support column for the new high-rise building going up? OF COURSE NOT! so don't insult the poor guy that's capable and certified to do such a task.
    Don't fret; the doctors' time is coming also. The big difference there is, the doc has $70-130K in school loans. A welder has maybe a couple thousand total.

    If you are good at tig, and working a SS food processing job, etc. then maybe you will have to take the hit for a little while. It can not hurt when a company loses man after man, and then has weld after weld fail...... and your welds are some of the better ones. At that point, you have more leverage. It's a tough grind, all the way across the board. Our welders are in the high 20's for the most part. Then again, they are tested and tested and tested...... and it's almost silly to see ANOTHER 12" saddle weld being done, by the same 3 guys, and they pass it again, just like the last time....

    But that is the direction the business is presently headed. Get a job where there are tests and x-rays done a lot. Most guys can't consistently pass. It's amazing, but a lot of pretty good welders can't pass 10 out of 10 tests it seems. If you can?? You are the guy for the job, and that owes you to a better pay rate. Seek out the critical jobs if you can do them; it is worth the effort.

    Good luck!
    I think she is Bi-polar. She is a bear sometimes. Does this make her a BiPolar bear????

  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    4,408

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Pirates for weldors?
    Attached Images Attached Images      
    City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;
    "Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."
    Job 28:1,2

    Lincoln, Miller, Victor & NKJV Bible

    Danny

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    15

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Welding positions in NWA have never paid well. Most manufacturing positions pay better, just standing there running a machine for 8 or 12 hours.

    Your best bet for making a decent wage here as a welder is get on with a plumbing company that does chicken plant work. The last welding job I did was almost 7 years ago. It was a prevailing wage job for the U of A and paid 24 per hour. Since then I use my plumbing card every now and a small job comes up.

    My first job out of school was welding at JV manufacturing, also known as Cram-Alot. It paid 10.50 an hour in 1994. The painters and material handlers made the same wage as the welders

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Northwest Arkansas
    Posts
    460

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Quote Originally Posted by belliott View Post
    Welding positions in NWA have never paid well. Most manufacturing positions pay better, just standing there running a machine for 8 or 12 hours.

    Your best bet for making a decent wage here as a welder is get on with a plumbing company that does chicken plant work. The last welding job I did was almost 7 years ago. It was a prevailing wage job for the U of A and paid 24 per hour. Since then I use my plumbing card every now and a small job comes up.

    My first job out of school was welding at JV manufacturing, also known as Cram-Alot. It paid 10.50 an hour in 1994. The painters and material handlers made the same wage as the welders
    So I'm finding out about the wages. I just moved here from Pennsylvania in March, and I truly think I work for the highest paying company around. They do a lot of chicken plant work, but I have not personally had that "joy" as of yet.

    The other main problem I am facing is that being new to the area, I have no idea how many companies (or names) actually hire welders. The JV Mfg you mention, not only did I not know they did any sort of welding, but I didn't even know they existed until I google'd them.

    I am really searching right now for a job TIG welding stainless or alum, but with my family situation, I can't be on the road traveling all the time. I did interview with FPEC down here, and even took a weld test. But due to my inexperience with running a foot pedal (current shop does not have or allow them) My weld test was a little less than what I am capable of. So no go on that. That was the only "well paying" position I have found starting at $18.xx to about $21.xx

    BTW where in NWA are you?

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    South Texas
    Posts
    588

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    You're in the wrong part of the country and the wrong industry. You need to get to the Gulf Coast and the oil industry. I'm working in a pipe fab shop in Port Arthur making $32. If you want to work in a refinery you can make more than that.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Baytown, TX
    Posts
    178

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Quote Originally Posted by TimmyTIG View Post
    You're in the wrong part of the country and the wrong industry. You need to get to the Gulf Coast and the oil industry. I'm working in a pipe fab shop in Port Arthur making $32. If you want to work in a refinery you can make more than that.
    I second that! I'm working in Baytown at the Exxon Refinery for a tank maintenance company and our guys make mid $20's with full health care options. If you were to go "on the road" so to speak you could make tons of dough (no insurance tho) working turnarounds making $35+ /hr plus perdiem and some companies even pay you mileage

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    18

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Outside big industry or union jobs skilled labor only pays 15-20/hr. The cost of living has crept up and wages havent kept pace. At one time skilled lanor wages ment you could libe a half decent life, those days are gone and aint coming back. Go where the money is in the oil industry.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Fishmurda NY
    Posts
    89

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Also when ever I see jobs a lot of times they never really need a Full time welder. They want some who knows how to weld but is Mechanically inclined in other things.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Northwest Arkansas
    Posts
    460

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Quote Originally Posted by bullfrogg0 View Post
    I second that! I'm working in Baytown at the Exxon Refinery for a tank maintenance company and our guys make mid $20's with full health care options. If you were to go "on the road" so to speak you could make tons of dough (no insurance tho) working turnarounds making $35+ /hr plus perdiem and some companies even pay you mileage
    Wages sound good, but I can't talk the wife into moving to Texas....

    Quote Originally Posted by Forged View Post
    Outside big industry or union jobs skilled labor only pays 15-20/hr. The cost of living has crept up and wages havent kept pace. At one time skilled lanor wages ment you could libe a half decent life, those days are gone and aint coming back. Go where the money is in the oil industry.
    Crept up? More like sky-rocketed. But I think you're onto something with your wage figures. There are very few $20+ positions available. And with the COL, $20/hr is about where a man supporting a family is able to meet the financial needs and just start to save some ( highly dependent upon lifestyle of course)

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinL90 View Post
    Also when ever I see jobs a lot of times they never really need a Full time welder. They want some who knows how to weld but is Mechanically inclined in other things.
    HIRING: Welders
    Must Possess all the below:

    • Operate ALL forms of metal fabrication equipment
    • Know how to repair said equipment when it breaks
    • Train new guys in above operations and be held liable for thier mistakes when they happen
    • Be able to Engineer on the fly from simple verbal directions given by less than knowledgeable engineers and/or project managers
    • Fix company vehicle when they break down
    • Take fault for every incorrect print that is handed to you
    • Be able to lift 50 lbs (OK we lie, more like 150 and by yourself [did we mention that 150 lbs is a 20' long stick of material you have to cut?])
    • Be able to operate all material handling equipment - for EVERYONE in the shop
    • Be able to stop what you just started doing to take care of a hot order (that just became hot at 30 minutes till quitting time)


    Then if you are Really lucky, you can work for a company that charges you for ALL of your PPE. Yes, I get to pay $11.00 for cheap Chinese "deerskin" gloves that are not made for any form of welding.
    $25 for a complete face shield (including head gear)
    $7 for a clear replacement face shield (no head gear)
    $11.00 for a cheap-o Husky brand tape measure that is 3/32" off compared to several others tapes

    The company supplies zero tools at all, no grinders, not even an extension cord. You may, however, "check out" a grinder for a day if yours should be broken and in need of repair. It is nice because they will fix your grinder for you (at a nominal fee of course)


    ^ Ok, I need to stop now. I can feel it boiling up again.....

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Fishmurda NY
    Posts
    89

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Hey man its all over the place, its not just Welders. The economy forced company to More with less. The closer and closer I get to School the more anxiety i get. I love welding and wish and hope I could do it as a Career.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Back in HB, close to my boys!!
    Posts
    4,677

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Quote Originally Posted by dcoffmanjr View Post
    So I'm finding out about the wages. I just moved here from Pennsylvania in March, and I truly think I work for the highest paying company around. They do a lot of chicken plant work, but I have not personally had that "joy" as of yet.

    I did interview with FPEC down here, and even took a weld test. But due to my inexperience with running a foot pedal (current shop does not have or allow them) My weld test was a little less than what I am capable of. So no go on that. That was the only "well paying" position I have found starting at $18.xx to about $21.xx

    BTW where in NWA are you?
    I test 2-3 welders a week; when busy and hiring, I test 2-3 a DAY.
    Many, many welders really believe they are the S, the H, the I, and the mutherfuggin' T When it comes to their welds.
    In reality??? I drop 75% for their inability to pass a root test, let alone hot pass and then cap. I would say a third of them get a root that is decent, but they have to try 3 or 4 times. (We give them a coupon to practice, then they fly a real test coupon.) Many can not set the root in a reasonable amount of time. (10-20%) I have guys who burn thru on the tacks, keyholing all over the place. I have them getting great looking tacks, and then cold lap them, and it shows. I get them wandering with the arc; hitting the side of the pipe with the electrode. I have them burning a root so full they are almost done on the first pass.
    They all believe they are great welders. Many run a nice 6010 on the plate while setting the heat. When the pipe gets put up into 6G and they are told they can not use 2 hands full time, as it is a single hand weld test????? Most start to sweat.
    It pains me to fail SO many welders. One week, I dropped 13 guys. Man, did I cut a lot of coupons that week, for nothing. A few of these guys REALLY needed the job. But they were at best structural steel qualified. And that is a world away from single hand pipe welding.
    I am the best tig welder in the shop. I have trouble passing some of the SS tests I have taken. And..... I have the benefit of my own machine, in 'My house', and no time limit. All the welding I do is in the shop, with the exception of some aluminum field work every now and then. The tig tests are not easy. Not at all. And, I suck at stick, I will admit it freely. I just do not do enough to make a worthwhile pipe welder with a wand.

    This said, I do believe the statement KevinL90 made is dead nuts accurate: Shops want a good welder, but he can't be a one trick pony. Hell, I fix tools, trucks, clean stuff, weld stuff, do paperwork, deliveries, operate cranes, test and repair cranes& forklifts, test and certify all the safety equipment in the house, service the AC systems and ventilation systems, and sweep floors and take out the trash.
    We had a really good welder who flat out refused to do a fire watch for other welders who had certified for a particular job. His argument??? "I'm a welder. Read it in my job application: W-E-L-D-E-R." SO, the other welders took turns doing their own fire watch, and got mad OT for it. Joe, the W-E-L-D-E-R stayed home for 3 weeks. That represents about $3300 take home with the OT thrown in. A high price to pay to be just a welder.

    Our best welder, Raul. He's a fabricator, a welder, and a layout guy. Speaks broken Spanglish. It's hard to do layout with him at times because of the language barrier. But EVERYONE learns when they work with him. And, he's not too proud to pick up a broom, or fix another guys' broken tool if he can. He's that good at layout; multiple manifolds of 12-30" pipe, 3 sections all at once. And he can pass the tests; all of them, every time.

    Dcoffman, I recommend you try to get as much practice on ANY type of welding you can, so if there is a test, you can ace it on the first try.

    And, don't pout about tools. We have some odd 35 welding machines at the shop. I primarily weld with my own personal machine. It's cost me well over $5000 with all the accessories. Every tool I use up to 3/4" impact are my own. From 3/4 drives and up, I use shop stuff. My own plasma cutter. My own bandsaw, sawzall, drills, and every hand tool known to man.
    I DO use shop gloves. We get good gloves, so I use them. If the gloves were ****???? I'd get my own gloves. My hands are worth more than they are paying me.
    Not bashing, just telling it the way it is. I wish you the best of luck landing a great gig!!!
    I think she is Bi-polar. She is a bear sometimes. Does this make her a BiPolar bear????

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    South Texas
    Posts
    588

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Quote Originally Posted by Rojodiablo;2894531 When the pipe gets put up into 6G and they are told[B
    they can not use 2 hands full time, as it is a single hand weld test[/B]?????
    I've been taking pipe tests since 1978 and I've never heard of this nonsense.

    'Single hand' in the welding world means you're working for a company and using their equipment, as opposed to being a rig welder and using your own equipment.

    It doesn't mean you can only use one hand to weld.
    Last edited by TimmyTIG; 07-26-2013 at 07:02 AM.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Back in HB, close to my boys!!
    Posts
    4,677

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    Quote Originally Posted by TimmyTIG View Post
    I've been taking pipe tests since 1978 and I've never heard of this nonsense.

    'Single hand' in the welding world means you're working for a company and using their equipment, as opposed to being a rig welder and using your own equipment.

    It doesn't mean you can only use one hand to weld.
    Hehehehe!!
    At least somebody knew what it means!
    This was more of a poke about the post complaining about using your own tools rather than using company equipment.
    If a guy is relying on a business to supply the tools of HIS trade, he's not opening the door to success very wide for himself. Kinda like.......trying to weld with one hand.
    I think she is Bi-polar. She is a bear sometimes. Does this make her a BiPolar bear????

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    15

    Re: Pay rates for welders

    I live just east of Springdale in the Hickory creek area.

    There is a ad on craigslist for a tig welder in Springdale, but it requirs some weekend work and travel.

    I think you should look into Multi-Craft. You can google them and get all the info to apply. They are a pretty big company and do pretty big projects. They do plumbing,hvac,commercial refrigeration, electrical,steel erection,concrete,crane services and abunch of other ****.

    They have decent benifets and they pay decent. Instead of paying OT for anything over 40 they pay daily for anything over 8. Saturday and Sunday work is 1 1/2 time weather you work the week days or not.

    They do alot of travel, but it pays pretty well so it's optional. They have alot of guys that just travel and do weekend work.

    If you work in the fab shop, you will never want for anything as far a equipment goes. I worked for the plumbing division on the Airworks side of the company. It is a good company.

    I don't know if they have any openings or if it's for you but you should look into it.
    http://www.multi-craft.net/

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
RSS | Home | Penton Media | Contact Us | Subscribe | For Advertisers | Terms of Use | Privacy Statement