Lincoln sa-200 timing
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Coolidge, AZ
    Posts
    35

    Lincoln sa-200 timing

    Hey All,

    I asked this question a couple of months ago, but just got around to timing the old Lincoln today. Something I guess Im not totally clear on... I found the two dots on the gear of my governor, but I am not seeing any kind of mark on the cam gear. I turned the fan blade by hand, and cleaned of both sides of the gear with lacquer thinner so I could see it, but I am not.
    Which side of the gear is it on? Is it like a dot, a hash mark?
    Also, I took off the air cleaner so I could maybe see the mark in there, but not so much. The flywheel/gear was fairly clean, but I am not sure what I am looking for in there.

    HELP!!!

    Thanks!
    Skip

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Orange, TX
    Posts
    11,575

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    Does this (Continental L-Head Magneto Timing.pdf) help? Remember, you're timing to cylinder #4 (cylinder closest to the welding generator) when you're looking for those timing marks. In other words, make sure #4 piston is at TDC when looking for them.
    MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1
    Syncrowave 180SD
    Bobcat 225G Plus - LP/NG
    MUTT Suitcase Wirefeeder
    WC-1S/Spoolmatic 1
    HF-251D-1
    PakMaster 100XL
    SA-200 Blackface Code# 8638
    Star Jet 21-110

    Two term limit - one in office, one in jail.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Coolidge, AZ
    Posts
    35

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    Hey Duane,

    Since I posted I think I *may* have found the mark on the flywheel, kinda hard to tell, its fairly corroded, but there does appear to be some old red paint on it. I have the two marks on the gear on the governor, the only thing I dont have is a mark that makes sense on the camshaft gear. There are what appear to be two stamped dots, not one, on the side that is closest to the radiator, but nothing where I would expect to see it, on the other side of the gear.
    I tried to ascertain TDC/compression on number four, the thumb over to hole was inconclusive, and for some odd reason I couldnt get the tried and true method to work, a soda straw sitting in the hole, it didnt seem to travel up or down as I turned the engine over.

    What an adventure, its like looking for Atlantis or something!

    Thanks for the PDF!!

    skip

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Coolidge, AZ
    Posts
    35

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    Am I correct when I say that whether or not I find the mark on the timing gear, *If* I have the TDC mark on the flywheel in the center of that hole, and the female recess on the governor horizontal, it will either be right on, or 180 out, as far as the position of the governor goes?

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Orange, TX
    Posts
    11,575

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    It sounds as if you have the front cover off if you can see the cam-to-crank timing marks on the cam gear as shown here (Continental L-Head Cam Gear Timing.pdf).

    The reason the 'rising straw' method didn't work is because the spark plug isn't over the piston bore but rather over the valve area of the block.

    You are correct, with the governor gear slot horizontal, the timing will either be close to where it belongs or 180 degrees out - providing the crank and cam are timed correctly. If you're not getting any compression on your TDC check, it's possible one or both valves are stuck in the open position. To check, simply pull the lifter access cover which you'd have to have off to free them up if they are in fact stuck open.
    MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1
    Syncrowave 180SD
    Bobcat 225G Plus - LP/NG
    MUTT Suitcase Wirefeeder
    WC-1S/Spoolmatic 1
    HF-251D-1
    PakMaster 100XL
    SA-200 Blackface Code# 8638
    Star Jet 21-110

    Two term limit - one in office, one in jail.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    334

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    I'm not trying to overtake what Duanne helping you with, but lets just say for the moment that there is no dot on the cam gear ( the dot should be on the side away from the radiator, and the dot looks like someone started to drill a hole w/ a drill bit on the centerline of the tooth itself, so that tooth fits between the two teeth where youve already found two dots on the mating gear). I'd think that if you took your magneto in your hand while its off the machine, and the cap off the mag, w/ the rotor installed and turn the drive lugs by hand in front of mag just until after it clicks ( and no farther ) and fires on the number 4 position, the two drive lugs should be lined up w/ the two recessed slots on the back of the back of the cam gear, providing you have the mark on flywheel in the middle of the round window, you may or may not be 180 off though. If not I'd think something isnt right.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Orange, TX
    Posts
    11,575

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    Good tips 123weld and actually one would need to to turn the mag drive coupler backwards approximately 1/4 turn after the impulse coupler trips to get the drive lugs lined up horizontally.
    MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1
    Syncrowave 180SD
    Bobcat 225G Plus - LP/NG
    MUTT Suitcase Wirefeeder
    WC-1S/Spoolmatic 1
    HF-251D-1
    PakMaster 100XL
    SA-200 Blackface Code# 8638
    Star Jet 21-110

    Two term limit - one in office, one in jail.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    5,748

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    Really, the engine doesn't care where the mag's drive gear or tang is meshed, or which tower has #1 wire in it; what matters is that as the piston approaches TDC compression, there is a spark across the plug's gap, and that the rotor passes the towers as 1-3-4-2, to fire each cylinder in sequence.

    Doesn't matter if the drive is off 180, 270, or 90 degrees; at most you will have to re-clock the plug wires in the cap. There isn't much room to swing the mag for timing adjustment, so you probably have to hit on 90 degree increments. Either DuaneB's or 123welds' MO should do just fine.

    Good Luck

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Coolidge, AZ
    Posts
    35

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    Thanks for the input guys,

    I am going to take another run at this morning.I cant see very well thru the small hole behind the air cleaner, so I may pop out the starter, thinking that might afford me a better view to make sure the mark on the flywheel I think is the timing mark, actually *is* the timing mark.
    Here we go... Ill let you know how it turns out.

    skip

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    1,497

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    You may want to shoot some brake cleaner through the little key hole to clean the flywheel so you can see the marks in there. The "T" mark will likely be high lighted or marked in red, after you see that about 1 1/2" to 2" further you will see a mark (D/C) presumably "dead Center" The D/C mark is the one that you shoud use to place the Mag static time. Then the T mark is used to fine tune the dynamic timing with a timing light. As far as the mark on the timing gear between the 2 dots on the govenor I had a hard time finding mine as it is barely a pin point a little more than a scratch. I used a small pick to feel anything that I thought might be a dimple and sure enough the the tooth between the two dots had the only thing that might be a punch mark. Just a tip, you may want to or not. I covered my marks in some axle grease and took a small drill bit to them to make them much easier to see once I found them. The grease will help to catch the chips so they don't fall to the crank case. I would really examine the tooth between the dots you have already found as it is the most likely if this hasn't been apart and was running. good luck.
    "Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum"

    (2)Lincoln 225AC/DC portables, Miller Syncrowave 300, miller sidekick,Lincoln Idealarc 250,Miller 251 Mig, Miller 30A spool gun, Hende lathe, Horizontal bandsaw, pora band ,14FT enclosed trailer.SA200's

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Coolidge, AZ
    Posts
    35

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    Got her going! I took the starter out this morning, ran the engine around slow by hand, and in a spot where I might never have seen it thru the keyhole was the D|C mark. I put some whiteout on it and put the starter back in. And then wouldn't you know it, all of a sudden there was the *tiny* mark on the cam gear! I must have turned that sucker around like seventy times and never saw it. Anyhow started right up.As soon as it warms up, Ill pull it outside and throw the timing light on it, and next see if I can figure out an idle issue it seems to have.

    Thanks again... virtual beers (or coffee) all around!

    skip

  12. #12

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    Hey i have a sa 200, ihave been having trouble with no spark at the plugs, the wires are good the plugs are brand new, i have changed the condensor in tghe magneto, when i removed the rotor cap i did not mark it, does this get the unit out of time, the machine has setup for approx; 6 years when i got it, the motor turns over and is gettin fuel since i rebuilt the carb, now no spark, would someone guide me please.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    1,497

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    Is this a Fairbanks Morse Mag? Take the mag out and turn it by hand, it should load a spring as you do and it will resist then it will snap. The snap is the spring thrusting the rotor and mag quickly , generating a spark and electrical field. If the mag just spins without loading and snapping you may have a broken impulse spring that will have to be replaced, Around $12 from Mcdonalds carb and ignition. Also may be point corrosion or gap setting, possible bad coil. All may contribute to no spark condition.If the machine was running when you stored it , likely some moisture got in and corroded the points. Check them first. Take a plug wire off and put a screwdriver in the boot and put the metal near a metal part of the engine while you crank it. See if any spark jumps to ground, should be blue in color and not a dim orange.
    "Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum"

    (2)Lincoln 225AC/DC portables, Miller Syncrowave 300, miller sidekick,Lincoln Idealarc 250,Miller 251 Mig, Miller 30A spool gun, Hende lathe, Horizontal bandsaw, pora band ,14FT enclosed trailer.SA200's

  14. #14

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    I have a 6? sa 200 used it sunday ran fine tried to use today no start checked no compression on any cyl. any ideas???????????????????
    Thanks

  15. #15

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    I've got a sa 200 f 162. I Need help on anybody

  16. #16

    Re: Lincoln sa-200 timing

    If Anyone can help give me a call please 318-341-0997

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