Limited by 60 and 70 amp circuits.
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    west texas
    Posts
    2,245

    Limited by 60 and 70 amp circuits.

    How many welding amps can I expect to get out of a 60 or 70 amp circuit on a miller model 250 (the dialarc before they called it a dialarc)?

    My garage sub panel is 6 gauge on a 60 amp breaker.
    I know the 60 amp is too big for 6 gauge. I turn it off at the main panel when not in use.
    If I ever get it inspected again I have a 50 to stick in there.
    My out door sub panel is at the service drop with the main and has a 70 amp breaker.
    I ran my 230 amp craftsman the most and hardest on the 60 amp circuit and never got a nuance trip, that machine recommend a 70 amp circuit.
    So I'm assuming 60 input amps can support 230 welding amps no problem.

    My generator is also rated to hold a 72 amp load. I'm sure I will power this welder with my 17.5kw run, 21kw surge generac.

    Just wanted to know at what point I should expect to need the miller recommend 100 amp circuit.
    old Miller spectrum 625
    Lincoln SP-135 T, CO2+0.025 wire
    Miller model 250 (dialarc) stick AC/DC and WP-18V torch
    Craftsman 100amp AC/DC and WP-17V torch
    Century 115-004 HF arc stabilizer, now with foot switch!!
    Home made DR44G alternator welder

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Bemidji MN
    Posts
    12,818

    Re: Limited by 60 and 70 amp circuits.

    I would just clamp a meter on and test the draw at various amps for stick and tig.

    I know I ran the Airco 300 at 230 amps AC tig on a 60 amp circuit with zero trips. But it is power factor corrected.

    This chart from the 70's dialarc indicates 200 amps output at 70 amps input.

    I'd bet yours is similar.

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    Last edited by MinnesotaDave; 07-16-2017 at 08:51 PM.
    Dave J.

    Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~

    Airco 300 - Syncro 350
    Invertec v250-s
    Thermal Arc 161 and 300
    MM210
    Dialarc
    Tried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    west texas
    Posts
    2,245

    Re: Limited by 60 and 70 amp circuits.

    If my mod 250 i's not power factor corrected I will power factor correct it.
    On my old 240v machine power factor correction saves 2 amps.

    But looking at that chart stays I can save up to 20 amps with power factor correction. Wow.
    Looks like I need to open my machine up and see if it's got functioning capacitors.
    Looks like I might be able to run full power with a 70 amp breaker.
    A 70 amp breaker should be able to hold a 80 to 90 amp load for a few minutes before tripping.
    old Miller spectrum 625
    Lincoln SP-135 T, CO2+0.025 wire
    Miller model 250 (dialarc) stick AC/DC and WP-18V torch
    Craftsman 100amp AC/DC and WP-17V torch
    Century 115-004 HF arc stabilizer, now with foot switch!!
    Home made DR44G alternator welder

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    CT
    Posts
    2,502

    Re: Limited by 60 and 70 amp circuits.

    It depends on what else is running on the circuit. If it is a dedicated welder circuit you are allowed by code to over rate the breaker. I run a 110 amp breaker on 6 gauge wire to feed my syncrowave 250. The Syncrowave pulls 92 amps at peak load. I am fully within code, and never have a problem, simply because it can't pull that 92 amp load for more than something like 2 minutes out of every 10, due to duty cycle. So long as you are only running the welder, you would be able to do the same. Now on a mixed use circuit, everything changes.
    Hobart Handler 190
    Syncrowave 250
    Purox Metalmaster

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    west texas
    Posts
    2,245

    Re: Limited by 60 and 70 amp circuits.

    Yes my 70 amp back yard circuit is on 6 gauge wire.
    My garage sub panel is wired with 6/3wG on a 60 amp breaker. But it only powers welder, plasma cutter, air compressors and gets turned off when not in use.
    The garage light and electric cloths dryer are on other preexisting wiring.
    If I need to I could drop 6/2wG and put it on a 100 amp breaker to a deticated welder plug but pulling wire under my house sux a lot.
    Too bad NEC doesn't allow for a over fused welder, plasma cutter air compressor sub panel.
    Last edited by mad welder 4; 07-17-2017 at 05:02 PM.
    old Miller spectrum 625
    Lincoln SP-135 T, CO2+0.025 wire
    Miller model 250 (dialarc) stick AC/DC and WP-18V torch
    Craftsman 100amp AC/DC and WP-17V torch
    Century 115-004 HF arc stabilizer, now with foot switch!!
    Home made DR44G alternator welder

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Elkhorn, WI
    Posts
    1,680

    Re: Limited by 60 and 70 amp circuits.

    Isn't the chart only showing the max in / max out corrected value indicating that at lower loads the correction would not be as great?
    I remember a Thread on this issue years ago where it was found that the "Idling" current draw is higher due to an imbalance of the capacitor to inductor ratio?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    west texas
    Posts
    2,245

    Re: Limited by 60 and 70 amp circuits.

    Yeah that may have been one of my posts.
    Power factor correction saves the same amount of power from idle to full power, it's usually a few amps, works on motors and welders.
    old Miller spectrum 625
    Lincoln SP-135 T, CO2+0.025 wire
    Miller model 250 (dialarc) stick AC/DC and WP-18V torch
    Craftsman 100amp AC/DC and WP-17V torch
    Century 115-004 HF arc stabilizer, now with foot switch!!
    Home made DR44G alternator welder

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