Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.
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  1. #1
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    Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    Quote Originally Posted by tapwelder View Post
    I heard both ways( referring to the way to run trusses in a gate). I typically to trusses under tension. I think mine are mostly cosmetic. However, I can see the argument for going compression. It is actually difficult to place tension on a gate truss and thus they may yield to sag as slack relieves. With the compression design the gate stands on the truss.

    At what angle does the truss become ineffective? How should they run? Is there a performance difference in the way the truss runs?

    Thanks

  2. #2
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    no matter what the material of the gate or the truss, I run support trusses from the top hinge area down to the opposite lower corner on the gate to prevent sag...the less of the angle the more stress on the truss and less ability to hold the gate from sagging..im sure if you google there are probably some big long engineering computation to give exact locations and holding power of the trusses...but 45 degree from corner to corner is the best I would think..

  3. #3
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    since this came from my post ill chime in..

    the furthest top outside corner to the btm closest to the hinge. the weight sags against the brace and it holds it up by pushing against the lower corner. pushing is always better than pulling.


    https://diy.stackexchange.com/questi...-a-wooden-gate

  4. #4
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    Quote Originally Posted by dieselbeef View Post
    since this came from my post ill chime in..

    the furthest top outside corner to the btm closest to the hinge. the weight sags against the brace and it holds it up by pushing against the lower corner. pushing is always better than pulling.


    https://diy.stackexchange.com/questi...-a-wooden-gate
    thats good only if you are using a solid truss, but if you use any kind of cable or band iron no worky... plus , lets say you have gates 10ft wide, you can extend the hinge post much higher than the top of the gate to give a better angle to keep gate from sagging...

  5. #5
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    diff is I think we mean 2 diff things...youre taking supporting from the pivot pole..i mean from internally.

    picture an h brace on a line run..

    http://farmfolly.com/2009/06/building-an-h-brace/

    the last pic shows a completed one...it would be tied off to the post farthest to the left

    idk...that's the only way I know..maybe im wrong but ive built I know at least 20 miles of fence here on my place...don't mean its right tho! lol

  6. #6
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    High tensile fence bracing is(in my mind) quite different from open steel gate bracing. The applied forces are not the same. I think i can make a gate lighter by putting a diagonal brace from the top of the hinge side to the bottom outboard side. Braced in the opposite configuration the brace has to be stiff enough not to flex and will add unnecessary weight to the gate. Take 6 feet of 1/8" by 1" band iron. Attach one end to something solid(your vise for example), grab the other end and pull. How much did it stretch? Now push on the loose end. How much did it bend? By using the lightest configuration in the gate it will result in less stress on the post holding the gate so it will resist tipping longer hopefully. My $0.02.
    ---Meltedmetal

  7. #7
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    Quote Originally Posted by dieselbeef View Post
    diff is I think we mean 2 diff things...youre taking supporting from the pivot pole..i mean from internally.

    picture an h brace on a line run..

    http://farmfolly.com/2009/06/building-an-h-brace/

    the last pic shows a completed one...it would be tied off to the post farthest to the left

    idk...that's the only way I know..maybe im wrong but ive built I know at least 20 miles of fence here on my place...don't mean its right tho! lol
    we were talking the same thing a gate, not fence line, but the way you show fence line is how I have seen it done plus a few other ways..I have a bunch of those cheap tractor supply metal gates from 12 to 14 ft wide and the best way to keep them from sagging down is to run a cable from the far lower corner( opposite hinge side) to a hook eye about 5 to 6 ft up on the pole that extends past the top hinge, and throw in a turn buckle to keep taking up any slack as the cable stretches...now to also keep that longer pole from being pulled over in the ground you can run another cable from a hook eye opposite side of the pole to the bottom of the next pole in the fence line and that will hold mighty solid even if someone decides to lean down on the gate opposite hinge side..

  8. #8
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    ok..well I can see both arguments....I guess it probably isn't a right or wrong..just preference....

  9. #9
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    It works both ways but as MeltedMetal stated if you run the brace from high on the hinge side to low on the opposite side, because narrow metal is stronger in tension you can use a smaller member - saving weight and $.
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  10. #10
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    My experience with narrow strap metal is it often does not rest at tension. Thus if the gate is built square then it can sag under load since the strap is not under tension.

  11. #11
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    Quote Originally Posted by tapwelder View Post
    At what angle does the truss become ineffective? How should they run? Is there a performance difference in the way the truss runs?

    Thanks
    Not at all. Place the force on the upper hinge.The " truss" is irrelevant. If you use 3 hinges on a 7-8 foot tall gate( or door---metal or wood) Put the upper 8 or so inches from the top and the middle at 18-24. The bottom is merely a guide.Nada mas

  12. #12
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bonzoo View Post
    Not at all. Place the force on the upper hinge.The " truss" is irrelevant. If you use 3 hinges on a 7-8 foot tall gate( or door---metal or wood) Put the upper 8 or so inches from the top and the middle at 18-24. The bottom is merely a guide.Nada mas

    This is one reason I think a few of my trusses are cosmetic. Many ornamental gates built/designed to support themselves well. However simple frame gates are a different story?

  13. #13
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    For steel keep it in tension if using flat bar or round bar. Tubing can go either way so long as it is the same size tube as the gate frame, small tube would need to go in tension as well. Wood gates it goes in compression only.

  14. #14
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    i see what yer saying now...the brace will not stretch. if it is pulled but can bow or distort under compression...never had it happen but I can see if using a smaller material it could..good info....never thought of it like that and I have built a lot of fence and hng a lot of gates..more than I wanna talk about

  15. #15
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    Quote Originally Posted by dieselbeef View Post
    i see what yer saying now...the brace will not stretch. if it is pulled but can bow or distort under compression...never had it happen but I can see if using a smaller material it could..good info....never thought of it like that and I have built a lot of fence and hng a lot of gates..more than I wanna talk about
    thats what I was trying to say, not to dismiss your way...
    as for wood gates it can go both ways also, not just compression, at least the way I do it, I find cable or thin chain with a turnbuckle on any type of gate is quick easy and gives you the ability to adjust the gates to meet evenly at the latch side...

  16. #16
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    Hmmmm? If a long piece of metal is held horizontal it will naturally sag due to its own weight and gravity. Going in tension direction does not combat the sag. Compression direction opposes gravity and the weight of the metal. ???

  17. #17
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    Quote Originally Posted by tapwelder View Post
    Hmmmm? If a long piece of metal is held horizontal it will naturally sag due to its own weight and gravity. Going in tension direction does not combat the sag. Compression direction opposes gravity and the weight of the metal. ???
    correct if it is the only piece, but most gates are built with cross pieces either welded, bolted or riveted, so the center doesnt sag on its own but the gate as a whole can go out of square as it sags..

  18. #18

    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    This is what I do to support gates. To me it looks the best and it seems to be darn strong.

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    Sincerely,

    William McCormick
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  19. #19

    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    I used to make curbs for giant equipment on rooftops years ago. The problem with the large roof curbs is keeping them from tearing themselves apart. We found that if we turned each one 45 degrees to the other, that they became indestructable. We never lost another one after we started storing and transporting them that way. That was my inspiration for those diamond backed gates.

    Sincerley,

    William McCormick
    If I wasn't so.....crazy, I wouldn't try to act normal, and you would be afraid.

  20. #20
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    William,

    I like that idea A LOT. How wide are those gates? I need to build 2-9 footers and I had already considered a diamond insert for design but didn't know how it would add to the strength. I have some fine shaker screens impregnated with rocks that I was going to put into the diamond part.
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  21. #21
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    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    Quote Originally Posted by William McCormick View Post
    This is what I do to support gates. To me it looks the best and it seems to be darn strong.

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Views: 167
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    Sincerely,

    William McCormick
    That's a nice looking solution, I might steal that in the future.

  22. #22

    Re: Gate Trusses? What is the correct way.

    Quote Originally Posted by bigb View Post
    William,

    I like that idea A LOT. How wide are those gates? I need to build 2-9 footers, and I had already considered a diamond insert for design but didn't know how it would add to the strength. I have some fine shaker screens impregnated with rocks that I was going to put into the diamond part.
    Thank you.

    I believe they are eight feet and a couple of inches. I rode on them while jumping up and down on them, to see if the yard of cement around each post holding them was enough. They were very solid, that was before I put the vinyl fencing into them. They are still there, and they never settled at all. I modified the magnets that hold the drop bars up a little to a more modern design. Like the ones in the movie below.

    We used to make these flimsy roof curbs, they were fine once everything was mounted but while building, moving and storing them, they would fall apart, get bent and collapse. Then one day we laid one on the other at a 45-degree angle and C-clamped them together, they were suddenly super strong.



    Sincerely,

    William McCormick
    If I wasn't so.....crazy, I wouldn't try to act normal, and you would be afraid.

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