oh dear should have checked.

[naughtyboy]

boss wants me to make a load of racks up for work, only to store spares on for the new machines were getting.
no probs worked out we needed 582m of 20x50mm box, he ordered 600m to allow for errors.
arrived monday during my 4 days off , so to save time he got senior engineer to cut it all to length.
did it on band saw, now big sign on bandsaw tells you to check cut angle before starting as we cut a lot of bits at 5degrees.
this guy didnt check and didnt read drawings properly so also cut it all short, drawings were hand done as cant get head rd cad etc, and i work in inches, turns out he doesnt understand what he calls primitive measuring systems.

can save some of it to use as shorter lengths but still need wagon load more box section.
boss is threatening to take it out of his wages.

[DSW]

I've cut it twice and it's still too short!

[BD1]

Take it out of his wages ??? What kind of shop is this ? Sign should say , set to 90 when done.

[duaneb55]

I'd say that's why he's senior engineer instead of lead fabricator.

BD1 - I agree taking it out of his wages is certainly questionable but one should ALWAYS check such settings before starting. NEVER rely on the guy before you.

The boss decided to "save time" so he needs to accept responsibility of assigning the task to someone who clearly shouldn't have been IMO.

[CharleyL]

I don't know where you're at, but Employment Security doesn't allow an employer to take the cost of mistakes out of an employee"s paycheck. The employer bears the risk for mistakes and damages. I know of several cases where the employers tried to do this and the (former) employee went to Employment Security about it. In every case the employee got his back wages paid by the employer. This may not be true in every state, but it works in NY, CT, and NC.

I agree with Duaneb55. It's the boss's fault. The boss put an unqualified guy on the job, so it's the boss's mistake.

Charley

[rabidchimp]

That sucks. Ya think the guy'd be able to tell when the first cut was done @ 5 degrees. When I started a job at a heavy duty fab place, I was working on the little horizontal saw, and one of the guys that had been working there for a few years came to cut a few pieces on the saw, a few degrees off from square. I made a couple cuts before realizing the SOB didn't put the saw back to 90. Guy was always only concerned about himself. Looking forward to your pics.
-Aaron

[Broccoli1]

5˚ ?

pfft that's nothin'- I can fill that in with plenty o' wire and some paint

[woohoo]

Originally Posted by Broccoli1

5˚ ?

pfft that's nothin'- I can fill that in with plenty o' wire and some paint

good penetration thats all

[David Hillman]

Originally Posted by CharleyL

I agree with Duaneb55. It's the boss's fault. The boss put an unqualified guy on the job, so it's the boss's mistake.

Unqualified? The guy has "senior" in his title, so he should be able to read a sign! Or at least, be smart enough to double-check his work before cutting two thousand feet of metal. Taking the cost out of his check is probably not legal, but not that bad when you realize people have been fired for a lot less.

[Rog02]

Need to quote Winston Churchill here
"America and Great Britain are two countries divided by a common language."

Since the OP is in the UK, his terminology is different than what we would use here in the states. A "senior engineer" in the Queen's English refers to a long term technician, opposed to a pencil pushing, over educated, PIA.

I would guess that the OP must live in England where the metric system is the only unit used for shop measurement. Kind of odd however because road distance and speed is still given in miles and even stranger is measuring body weight in "stone". From the shops I have been around in Scotland all units are understood and on the fly calculations are simple head math.

As for docking the guys pay for the screw up? It probably would not fly there as well, but the boss has to blame someone.

[duaneb55]

Originally Posted by David Hillman

Unqualified? The guy has "senior" in his title, . . .

"Senior" could just mean he's top engineer dog and still be fresh out of college with zero hands on experience.

[BD1]

Originally Posted by duaneb55

"Senior" could just mean he's top engineer dog and still be fresh out of college with zero hands on experience.

SENIOR, maybe a old guy that can't see anymore . Plus, what's 5 degrees among friends ?

[David Hillman]

Originally Posted by duaneb55

"Senior" could just mean he's top engineer dog and still be fresh out of college with zero hands on experience.

And can't read a sign? And without enough sense to double-check before cutting up thousands of dollars of material?

Would you hire that guy as a shop hand, nevermind a 'senior engineer'? Would you keep him after this screw-up?

When I was a young man, I worked several jobs that required no qualifications at all, except for a strong back and a little sense. I'd have been fired from all of them for this. Are standards that low, now?

[duaneb55]

I know it sounds like it but just so there's no misunderstanding, I'm NOT sticking up for this guy and what he did. He obviously shouldn't be left in charge of something like that if that's going to be the results. And then I was was just covering some of the bases on the "senior" reference.

[David Hillman]

Originally Posted by duaneb55

I know it sounds like it but just so there's no misunderstanding, I'm NOT sticking up for this guy and what he did. He obviously shouldn't be left in charge of something like that if that's going to be the results. And then I was was just covering some of the bases on the "senior" reference.

Understood, it just chafes me to hear people blaming the boss for this because the employee is "unqualified". Unless something is missing from the original story, this guy is unqualified to flip burgers, and that's not the boss' fault unless he hired him.

[bearston]

When I was apprentice in the tool & die shop, my first lesson was how to how to measure, the second was how to use a file and the 3rd was how to check my work both before and after making the first cut. Arrogance like Mr. short cut's was always met with a boot to the curb and is the best way to save money in any shop. Dwayne's dead on in his first post, that's why the boss is the boss. Remember, most people are hired from the neck down, but never in a shop. In this case, poo rolls uphill.

[70Challenger]

It sounds pretty simple to me, if the guy did not understand how to read the measurements he should have stopped and told the boss he didn't know how to do it (or maybe to save some embarrassment ask for the instructions to be gone over more accurately because he didn't want to mess it up)
I just don't understand how someone could just start cutting away knowing that they don't understand the "primitive" measuring system regardless of what their title is.

Heck with it I'll just eyeball it, those numbers aren't important, if it's not right someone else can fix it. Just weld it back together.

[walker]

When I was newly married my wife asked me to do the laundry. I took her favorite red sweater and put it in the load of whites, then popped it in the dryer on high when it was done washing. I have not done a load of laundry in 20 years! A failure? I think not.

[Bruce Avison]

Originally Posted by walker

When I was newly married my wife asked me to do the laundry. I took her favorite red sweater and put it in the load of whites, then popped it in the dryer on high when it was done washing. I have not done a load of laundry in 20 years! A failure? I think not.

I did that the other day. Everything is still it's original colour, but the sweater shrunk around some of the embroidery. She appreciates my efforts, at the very least. And that's why I do the dishes, she hates dishes and I love food. Mutual exchange.

Bruce

[nadogail]

The more education you have, the bigger screw ups you can make.

[BD1]

Originally Posted by David Hillman

Understood, it just chafes me to hear people blaming the boss for this because the employee is "unqualified". Unless something is missing from the original story, this guy is unqualified to flip burgers, and that's not the boss' fault unless he hired him.

I would fire the guy that hired him !

[mb_welder]

Bondo...lots and lots of bondo!

Or copper/aluminum backing bars as backing strips! (works wonders for non critical stuff! Smack them with a hammer after welding and they pop right off!)

[naughtyboy]

its not a shop as such, just our own factory shop.
we make plastic milk bottles that go straight through to dairy for filling.
are getting some new machines in from your side of the water.
guy is electrical/mechanical engineer apprentice trained as well, boss also sent him on welding/ fabrication course last year.
he even admits first thing they said on course was always check saw and your first cut.

prob 95% of what we cut on saw is set at 5deg.

its not turned out as bad as we thought only actually need to replace 96m of it, as racks were designed to hold biggest spares so they would all look same.
just means more cutting and some slightly bigger racks as others will all be bit smaller now.
in guys defense he as apologised,asked me to show how to do it, and is doing it in his time to make amends.

[1awert1]

all i can say is, there is NO one on this board who never made a stupid mistake.....(I know, Speak for yourself)

[hobohilton]

A hard lesson for me to learn -----

Even when the "boss" is wrong.............. He's still the boss.....