Burning up tips?

[PoisonPancakes]

Hey I have a Hobart Handler 210 that I've burned about 5 lbs of flux wire through so far. Today I've been doing some work on 1/4" angle iron with .030 flux wire on tap 5 of my welder. I have had to change my contact tip out about 3 times this morning, with my last one only lasting about 10" of weld. The wire seems to be getting stuck inside the tip, and the contact tip itself is turning a bright red where it screws into the gun. Any one have any ideas why I could be going through so many tips? I havent had any problems with it yet but this is the first I've been welding thicker material with it. Thanks

[obewan]

Do you have the correct size contact tips? If it is arcing inside the tip and the hole is too big it might act like that. Could be the voltage is too high too?

[pulser]

One reason for a tip to overheat is if it not tightly screwed/seated in the gun, or for some other reason is not making good electrical contact with the gun. High electrical resistance from a loose tip will cause heating.

[PoisonPancakes]

Yes the tip sizes are correct. I am tightening the tip in the gun with a pair of pliers.

[MoonRise]

??

Tip turning red means it is getting hot. (duh!) It gets hot from current/amperage and resistance. Resistance somewhere in the tip-to-gun connection? But you said you were screwing it on tight. Hmmm, curious and puzzling and annoying.

Maybe a bad/mislabeled batch of tips?

0.030 FCAW wire seems a little bit thin for 1/4 material. Looks like 0.030 FCAW wire maxes out at about 100 amps or so at 200 ipm wire speed. Maybe you are maxing out the wire, amps-wise, and vaporizing it (burning back) back into the tip, causing the red tip and wire stickage issues?

btw, pretty nice and uniform ripples on the weld bead, no spatter (or did you clean it up when you removed the slag?), nice toes onto the one piece but can't see how it fused into the other piece (the angle iron?).

[TEK]

A thing to remember with Flux-core wire is that it crushes easily. Any time it gets stopped in the liner, for whatever reason, the drive rolls spin on the wire and crunch it or leave a flat spot on it. Then, your welding away and the flat spot hits the tip. Guess what happens????It sticks in the tip, you leave the trigger on for a half second, you make ANOTHER flat spot, you curse and change the tip, then your welding away and.........

After you take the tip out, pull the wire out far enough that you get rid of that spot. Also, even brand new tips sometimes have a burr in them. Run a torch tip cleaner through them(gently) and remove any rough spots you can feel. Do NOT go to an oversized tip...This is bad info that has been mentioned too many times. It will cause more issues than you want.

[zapster]

Originally Posted by TEK

A thing to remember with Flux-core wire is that it crushes easily. Any time it gets stopped in the liner, for whatever reason, the drive rolls spin on the wire and crunch it or leave a flat spot on it. Then, your welding away and the flat spot hits the tip. Guess what happens????It sticks in the tip, you leave the trigger on for a half second, you make ANOTHER flat spot, you curse and change the tip, then your welding away and.........

Exactly!
My cheapo mig does it all the time because I need a C-Clamp to squish the rollers..

...zap!

[TEK]

Originally Posted by zapster

Exactly!
My cheapo mig does it all the time because I need a C-Clamp to squish the rollers..

...zap!

I dont understand....
Why do you need to 'squish' the rollers?
Is that a factory set-up or did you modificate it????
You really dont need a super amount of tension on the drive rolls to push F/C wire. You could probably rig a spring of some kind to give you enough....post pics of your rig so we can laugh at you.....er, I mean, so we can help....yea, thats it.....help you figure it out.

[PoisonPancakes]

Well I was able to get the wire out a two of the tips and cleaned them out and they worked out. TEK you bring up a good point and maybe that could be the problem there.

Most of the welding I do tends to be toward the 3/16" to 1/4" material, would you all recommend moving up to the .035 wire instead. And I just got a bottle for my welder and am going to purchase some solid wire, what size do you all recommend?

[TEK]

If you still can find the pieces of wire that you got out of the tip, look and see if you can tell if it has a flat on it.
Your machine will handle the .035 wire just fine if thats what you want to do, although there is nothing wrong with the .030 for what you are doing. Use it up and then get the .035.
For the solid, I'd also get the .035. That way everything is inter-changeable....



as for me having a point, I'll try and keep my hat on so no one will notice........

[DDA52]

On that machine, yes, go up to a .035 FC for that thickness. It will also run .045 effectively. When field testing that unit, I did quite a bit of 5/16 and 3/8 with .035 FC. It runs it like a champ.

For solid wire, the HH210 runs .030 the best. It will run .035, but you get the best results out of the .030. At least I did. I had one deal that the .035 performed better on, but that was it. I've put maybe 80# of .030 through the machine in the last two years and have yet to complain about it.

[PoisonPancakes]

Thanks DDA for the input. So far I love this machine and have no problems with it.

[Bob]

It seems that happens when the ground isn't real good. With wire you need a good solid ground where stick will burn the ground from poor to good. Just my opinion.

[lotechman]

Maybe increase your stickout a bit...try welding with the wire about 1/2 to 3/4 inch past the end of the contact tip. Possibly the wire is not able to preheat before it reaches the arc. The stickout distance is important when using self shielding flux core.

[zapster]

Originally Posted by TEK

I dont understand....
Why do you need to 'squish' the rollers?
Is that a factory set-up or did you modificate it????
You really dont need a super amount of tension on the drive rolls to push F/C wire. You could probably rig a spring of some kind to give you enough....post pics of your rig so we can laugh at you.....er, I mean, so we can help....yea, thats it.....help you figure it out.

I laugh every time I take it out!!
You will also..




The "stock" set-up is useless..
So this is how we do it..

...zap!

[TEK]

zap, I dont know how it will help but here are some pics of my Millers drive set-up. Maybe you can get a spring or a rubber band or something to get a little better control on what you got? I dunno.......If it causes you problems every time you use it, I would do something about it.....

[zapster]

Thats a much more engineered set-up than what you get with Harbor Freight cheapos...

I have tried almost everything and this is what "works"

I only use it when the muffler is ready to fall off the car before work or something stupid needs to be done NOW!..

It's a P.O.S. but very handy at times..


...zap!

[Ag Specialties]

I was haveing the same problem a couple of weeks ago. What i was told here on this site was to blow out your liner. Since we are portable, everynight when my trucks come in from the fields, we blow them out and run a small drill through the tip. Haven't had a problem yet. I also got a wiper that we change out every week.

[DSW]

Originally Posted by Ag Specialties

I was haveing the same problem a couple of weeks ago. What i was told here on this site was to blow out your liner. Since we are portable, everynight when my trucks come in from the fields, we blow them out and run a small drill through the tip. Haven't had a problem yet. I also got a wiper that we change out every week.

Nice to see that the info posted by others helped you out and that you are now passing that info on to others. Thats what this site is all about.

[Ag Specialties]

Tek
you brought up the over size tip. When i was have my problem, i had a miller rep come out to my shop and that is was he told me to do. Run .045 tip for .035 wire. That is what i have been doing, but you have been the one of few people who have said not to do that. We tried everything with running .035 tips for .035 wire. Blow out the liner and put new tips in, matter of a couple of inches wire would stop. Grabed a new suitcase off of the floor and did the same thing. Miller rep told me to put a .045 tip and run with it. Like i said before, now we blow out our liner and run .045 tips and havn't had a problem yet. From what i was told by this miller rep, that crap comes off the the .035 wire and has no room in a .035 tip. You look and .045 compared to .035, you have less then .005 per side. I don't really see what could go wrong with running an over size tip. I would like to hear your reason on it, so i can jump my miller rep. I think if i look in my miller book for my suitcase, it even mentions that you can run over size tips on flex core wire. ???????????????

[Sandy]

I'll throw this in there just to see what comes out; I can easily slip an .040 drill into a .035 tip, so they are already over sized. Wonder what .045 tip really is?

One thing I noticed is that most flux core issues just magically go away once a person becomes familiar with that machine.

If you were running teflon liners I could see a problem with contact area using tip too much oversized. Your tip would then not only be the primary but the only contact area. Not sure about the coated steel liners. Seems like the entire liner can be your contact area as long as you don't mind your tip not being the primary/optimum contact.

[Static-XJ]

Originally Posted by Ag Specialties

Tek
you brought up the over size tip. When i was have my problem, i had a miller rep come out to my shop and that is was he told me to do. Run .045 tip for .035 wire. That is what i have been doing, but you have been the one of few people who have said not to do that. We tried everything with running .035 tips for .035 wire. Blow out the liner and put new tips in, matter of a couple of inches wire would stop. Grabed a new suitcase off of the floor and did the same thing. Miller rep told me to put a .045 tip and run with it. Like i said before, now we blow out our liner and run .045 tips and havn't had a problem yet. From what i was told by this miller rep, that crap comes off the the .035 wire and has no room in a .035 tip. You look and .045 compared to .035, you have less then .005 per side. I don't really see what could go wrong with running an over size tip. I would like to hear your reason on it, so i can jump my miller rep. I think if i look in my miller book for my suitcase, it even mentions that you can run over size tips on flex core wire. ???????????????

I've run oversized tips when nothing else was available. .035 in a .045 tip, and .045 in a .052 or 1/16" tip. The cast in the wire will cause the wire to make contact with the tip even with the larger opening. A tighter cast or longer contact tip will make better electrical contact. Too large of a tip and you will start arcing inside the tip causing rough spots that the wire will be more likely to stick on. A large gap between wire and tip will also allow spatter to collect inside, also impeding wire feed.

Normally, I will run the like sized tip for the wire I'm using. When a tip does foul, if I can get the wire out of it, I will run a torch cleaner through it to smooth out any burs and try the tip again. Poor quality control on the tips or wire size can lead to tip problems. So can cranking down on the drive roll tension tight enough to actually deform the wire.

About two years ago the shop I worked at switched fro Tweeco to Binzel guns. I have noticed (with no hard evidence to back me up, so it could just all be in my head), that I have fewer issues with the Binzel equipment than with the Tweecos.

[TEK]

Originally Posted by Ag Specialties

Tek
I don't really see what could go wrong with running an over size tip. I would like to hear your reason on it, so i can jump my miller rep. I think if i look in my miller book for my suitcase, it even mentions that you can run over size tips on flex core wire. ???????????????

All the reasons have already been cited. I know I can tell a difference when there is a worn tip and I put a new one in. Do what works for you. I prefer the right tips because it welds better for me that way. I'll not fault anyone for gettin-r-done....

[Mark...]

AG specialties, I have had small berries lodged in the hole in the end of the tip with oversized holes. Granted, its not too common and as I recall this only happened after wallering out a used tip with tip cleaners over and over until the hole was way too big. I am referring mostly to aluminum wire, but I think that it would be pretty much the same with any metal. My guess would be that it would depend alot on how much spatter you are throwing around.

Spray transfer is probably different too. Maybe someone else has a better 2c on that one.

Sandy, I am thinking that different manufacturers have slightly different standards for tip hole sizes designated for different size wires.

[flydrifter]

Just a thought looking at the pic of the tip. You said you were installing the tip with pliers, is it possible that you are distorting the tip with too much pressure from the pliers?