Argon gas question

[klapp]

So I took the plunge and bought my first welder. It's just a small 88 amp flux core/mig mastercraft (canadian brand).
I am just about finished my first project. a small sand box digger/backhoe. Anyway, my next project is a welding cart (big surprise!!).
Anyway I am just running flux core at the minute but I plan on building the cart with room for an argon cylinder. I imagine I will be getting the smallest cylinder.
My question is related to the height of the welder on my cart. If I have the smallest cylinder and the welder is sitting higher does that impede the gas flow??. As I design the cart I want to put the welder on the top shelf but not if I will end up with bad welds due to a lack of shielding gas.
Any input would be appreciated
Sorry if this is an over talked about topic. I haven't had or taken the time to surf the threads.

Thanks in advance

[zapster]

I don't matter where the tank is just as long as it stays upright..
It's under pressure ya know?

...zap!

[klapp]

thanks

[turk]

argon would be useless on that welder, co2, or a mixed gas. I would use co2

[zapster]

Originally Posted by turk

argon would be useless on that welder, co2, or a mixed gas. I would use co2

Good point!

...zap!

[AndyA]

Actually only the cylinders with liquid need to be upright. Propane, acetylene, CO2, etc.

Is there enough partial pressure on 75% argon+25%CO2 to make liquid CO2? I don't think there is, but I could be wrong.

Most of the cart setups will have the cylinders upright. It uses less floorspace that way.
You do want a sturdy support for the cylinder to prevent it falling over and knocking the valve off.

Edit: Don't worry about the up/down routing of the gas hose. A full cylinder has maybe 2200psi. After the regulator the pressure may be anywhere from 25 to 50psi. The gas is very lightweight and it doesn't take much pressure (very small fraction of a psi) to make it flow uphill. The size of the hose makes more difference. Even then, the flow you need for shielding gas isn't that much. So the little 1/4" hose will work fine.

[turk]

in c25, the co2 is gas AndyA. good point to bring up about bottle position

[kbmeier]

You may want to reconsider the size of the bottle you buy.

20 cu ft. is a small bottle (there may well be smaller). You will probably be using gas at around 20 cu ft/hour, maybe a little less, maybe a little more. Now, that's 20 cubic feet per hour of arc time. It will take you many hours to accumulate one hour of arc time (does anyone have a good estimate of how long it takes to accumulate an hour of on time?).

The bottom line is that you will be taking a 20 back to refill twice as often as a 40.

Also, note that it it will cost MUCH less to fill one 40 than two 20s, and MUCH less to fill one 80 than two 40s. There is, probably a limit on the size of bottle that your LWS will fill.

Check around. Here in central NJ, we have dealers that will only go to 60 cu. ft. on customer bottles, while others will fill or exchange 125s. I have also been quoted from $25.00 to $55.00 to fill an 80.

[Jack Olsen]

Listen to kbmeier's advice. It is spot on. There is false economy with a small tank.

I'm just a hobby welder, but I use a 125 cf tank (of 75/25 mix). The difference in price for me between the two tanks initially was $25 ($170 for an 80, $195 for a 125), but more importantly the difference in refill cost was only $4. That's twice the gas (and half the frustrating trips to get it refilled) for only a $4 difference.

Also: keep an eye on the flow rate you're using once you've got your gas going. 12-20 cfh is the usual range, and if you're inside where there isn't a breeze, then keeping it closer to 12 will make your tank last longer.

Also, shop around for tanks. I paid less than a hundred for my 125 tank with current hydro and no issues getting it refilled (you have to be sure it's not a rental tank that someone is trying to sell).