Miller mm211 mvp 220/230?

[badvette]

Saw this on a review on Cyberweld web site:

"I bought this machine to upgrade from a 130amp machine, so I could use thicker material in my artwork. I liked that it could switch between voltage inputs, but I misunderstood 230V to be 220V, which is what I have in my shop, so I can't use the 230V option (230V seems not common for home use, I'm not sure why they didn't make it 220V). However, using 110V it has plenty of power, I can weld 14" material no problem. It's very easy to use with the auto-set function, my welds have improved alot just by using this machine.
Pros:
Auto-set is easy to use
Plenty of power
Cons:
230V plug instead of more common 220V"

I assume this guy is just referring to the plug. And if so why wouldn't he just make an adapter? I think the plug design is more of a amp limitation for 220/230vac then what you would normally see on a typical welding or dryer 220/230 rated at 30 to 50 amps.

[badvette]

Just pulled up the 211 spec sheet on Cyberweld and looks like it show 3 plugs one of which is or looks like a regular 50amp welding type plug!

[Broccoli1]

He is confused fo' sho'

The 230v MVP plug that comes with the MM211 is a standard Nema 6-50 Plug found on just about every 220v,230v,240v welding machine that comes with a power cord installed by the manufacturer.

220v, 230v, & 240v are all the same thing

110v, 115v, 120v same thing as well


There are several 240v Plugs & receptacles to match amperage rating

[Broccoli1]

Originally Posted by badvette

Just pulled up the 211 spec sheet on Cyberweld and looks like it show 3 plugs one of which is or looks like a regular 50amp welding type plug!

It only comes with 2 Plugs:

one for 120v that will fit in the standard 5-15 Receptacle
one for 220v/230v/240v that fits in a 6-50 Receptacle


Miller does show a picture of 3 Plugs but only 2 come with the machine, the 3rd plug has to be purchased separately.
MVP™ Adapter 115 V 5-20P #219 259 Used to connect power source to 5-20R receptacle (not included with machine)
MVP™ Adapter 115 V 5-15P #219 261 Used to connect power source to 5-15R receptacle (included with machine)
MVP™ Adapter 230 V 6-50P #219 258 Used to connect power source to 6-50R receptacle (included with machine)
http://www.millerwelds.com/pdf/spec_sheets/DC12-54.pdf

[Bistineau]

If you ever put a meter to your outlets to check actual voltage, you will find that what a lot of people call 110/115 V AC is in fact 120 V AC. Same with 220/230, it is really 240 V AC. This is probably where this guy's confusion is coming from. He thinks his MM211 is 220, and if he plugs it into 240 it will fry something, so he is stuck using it as a 120V AC mig instead of 240V AC MIG. In this case he could have saved himself some money and got a MM140 W/AS and been just as well off. He will never use the 211 to it's potential until he plugs it into 240 V. I bet he's to scared to try that though unless someone convinces him differently. I guess he is just eat up with the dumb asp.

[con_fuse9]

It he has it at a 'shop' he might have 3 phase and then 208.

I suspect an inverter that can handle 110 - 250 can handle 208.

I'm not one for ripping people off. I'd contact the guy, tell him you think he's wrong (in a nice way) but if he insists he's right offer to take the problem welder off his hand

[Broccoli1]

Originally Posted by con_fuse9

It he has it at a 'shop' he might have 3 phase and then 208.

I suspect an inverter that can handle 110 - 250 can handle 208.

I'm not one for ripping people off. I'd contact the guy, tell him you think he's wrong (in a nice way) but if he insists he's right offer to take the problem welder off his hand

You are your Name today-

The Text in the Op's post is from a Customer Review on Cyberwelds site

and what are you talking about : "I suspect an inverter that can handle 110 - 250 can handle 208"

The MM211 is not an inverter

[scudzuki]

Nominal voltage in the US is supposed to be 115/230/460.
Depending on location it can be higher or lower.
My "115V" is 119V so I have 119/238.
Most equipment can handle variation within this range from nominal.

Since an electrical circuit limits amperage not voltage (within its rated range i.e. using at least 300V wire for a 230V circuit) a 230 circuit that actually measures 240V is good for about 5% more power.

The reviewer on Cyberweld.com needs an education.

Joe

[Showdog75]

Most input voltages show + or - 10%.

[Boostinjdm]

Originally Posted by scudzuki

Nominal voltage in the US is supposed to be 115/230/460.
Depending on location it can be higher or lower.

Correct. I have read as high as 256v in my garage before and it's the farthest run from the meter.

[SuperArc]

I don't know what the problem or debate is here. I think the original review was from a confused poster and I also think the OP is confused as well.

As others here have already clearly stated, in AMERICA, that Miller 211 will work on ANY household 240V single phase (aka: "220, 230v") outlet with a NEMA 6-50R outlet like this one:



....because the Miller 211 comes with a NEMA 6-50P plug like this one:



Unless the welder is going into a true "shop" in an industrial area not zoned as "residential," there is virtually zero chance of plugging that welder into a 3-phase 208V outlet. Traditional homes in America are not wired for 3 phase.


Recapping "220v" terminology: "220v" = "230v" = "240v" It's all the same thing.
Recapping "110v" terminology: "110v" = "115v" = "120v" It's all the same thing.

***NOTE: ("single phase," and "three phase" are NOT the same thing and something listed as "208v" is "usually" a sign that the motor is a 3-phase driven motor which is NOT able to run on "220v" houshold current). --I'm trying to keep it simple here!

[badvette]

Originally Posted by SuperArc

I don't know what the problem or debate is here. I think the original review was from a confused poster and I also think the OP is confused as well.

As others here have already clearly stated, in AMERICA, that Miller 211 will work on ANY household 240V single phase (aka: "220, 230v") outlet with a NEMA 6-50R outlet like this one:



....because the Miller 211 comes with a NEMA 6-50P plug like this one:



Unless the welder is going into a true "shop" in an industrial area not zoned as "residential," there is virtually zero chance of plugging that welder into a 3-phase 208V outlet. Traditional homes in America are not wired for 3 phase.


Recapping "220v" terminology: "220v" = "230v" = "240v" It's all the same thing.
Recapping "110v" terminology: "110v" = "115v" = "120v" It's all the same thing.

***NOTE: ("single phase," and "three phase" are NOT the same thing and something listed as "208v" is "usually" a sign that the motor is a 3-phase driven motor which is NOT able to run on "220v" houshold current). --I'm trying to keep it simple here!

I'm not confused, I know there are 2 legs of 110/115/120 or what have you = 220 exc. I was merely posted what I saw on a review and hoping the 220 plug that you pictured in your post is what I was going to get with the machine and the weird monkey face with one vertical and one horizontal blade which I think is a 20-25 amp plug.
It's all good,

[Broccoli1]

You won't get the Weird Monkey Face Plug- 5-20p


Read my Post, #4

[RedOctobyr]

Originally Posted by Boostinjdm

Correct. I have read as high as 256v in my garage before and it's the farthest run from the meter.

Since we're on the subject, the distance from the meter shouldn't really matter (edit- only for measuring line voltage up/down variation), as long as you are not actually drawing a load through the wires feeding that outlet, when you measure the voltage. Voltage drop happens as a result of current flow. When nothing is actually drawing current through those wires, the voltage that you measure at the outlet should be identical to where the wires leave the breaker panel. Once you add a load, however, the further you are from the panel, and/or the smaller the wires, the greater the voltage drop will be.

Edit- This is *only* in reference to measuring voltage at your outlet with no load. Introducing a load makes both the distance, and wire gauge, very important.

[SuperArc]

Originally Posted by RedOctobyr

Since we're on the subject, the distance from the meter shouldn't really matter, as long as you are not actually drawing a load through the wires feeding that outlet, when you measure the voltage. Voltage drop happens as a result of current flow. When nothing is actually drawing current through those wires, the voltage that you measure at the outlet should be identical to where the wires leave the breaker panel. Once you add a load, however, the further you are from the panel, and/or the smaller the wires, the greater the voltage drop will be.

Well if your outlet is 75' away from the panel, then you do need to be "concerned" and you absolutely must calculate that length, into the TOTAL length of your lead to your machine.

Running #8 or worse, #10ga wire from panel to outlet with a 75' run, limits your ability to maybe run a short extension cord to your welder. In fact, 10ga wire at 75' with a machine that can draw 50amps would make me not sleep too well at night.

[RedOctobyr]

You're absolutely right. Sorry, I should have tried to word it more clearly. I've edited my post.

I was only referring to measuring voltage at an outlet, when you are *not* drawing a load. In that specific scenario, the distance from the panel does not matter (you should measure the same voltage whether right at the panel, or at the end of a 100' 16 gauge extension cord).

However, the wire gauge and length must be considered and selected appropriately when you're planning for a high-current application.

[badvette]

Originally Posted by Broccoli1

You won't get the Weird Monkey Face Plug- 5-20p


Read my Post, #4

You are correct!
Got the machine today got it hooked up with the spool gun. Only had time to run a couple of passes and was fairly happy with the results on aluminum. beads looked good and consistent seems pretty sooty on the outside edges, is this normal. I'm using forehand and holding off work about 3/4" pretty sure the filler metal is no sorting out in the puddle. I've only got the gas turned up to 20 CFH. Ideas?