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  1. #101
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    OK, Billy Mac,, once again you are displaying just how little you really know.

    Judging a tank to be empty and advocating leaving it valved open are two different things entirely. At no point did I advocate nor imply that it was acceptable to leave a tank valved open. Get your BS straight if you're going to accuse me of something.

    You also aren't bright enough to understand the difference between evaporative cooling and windchill. THEY ARE NOT THE SAME THING!! Got that? Try to keep it straight, this may get a little complicated for you.

    That thermometer with a sock on it is called a sling psygrometer(sp) and it is used as the wet bulb half of a dual bulb thermometer to measure RELATIVE HUMIDITY, not windchill. And the sock is not to hold atmospheric moisture, it is moistened so that it will provide evaporative cooling. The difference between the dry side and wet side can be charted to give relative humidity.

    Windchill does not apply to inanimate objects once they reach the temperature of the surrounding air (spare me the BS about the paint holding moisture enough to be a factor). Windchill is just a number that compares the heat loss of a warm object in moving air as compared to still air. Try to stay with me now,, a warm engine will cool faster in the wind than in still air but it will never get any colder than the actual air temperature. Your hands, in that windy alley are subject to windchill, hence they feel colder than if the wind was not blowing.

    I know this may be hard for you to understand but that is just because you're a BOZO!!! There is no government plot to keep things secret, you are not blessed with being the only one allowed to know the secrets of the universe. You are also not generally acknowledged as being a source of viable information.

  2. #102
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan N
    OK, Billy Mac,, once again you are displaying just how little you really know.

    Judging a tank to be empty and advocating leaving it valved open are two different things entirely. At no point did I advocate nor imply that it was acceptable to leave a tank valved open. Get your BS straight if you're going to accuse me of something.

    You also aren't bright enough to understand the difference between evaporative cooling and windchill. THEY ARE NOT THE SAME THING!! Got that? Try to keep it straight, this may get a little complicated for you.

    That thermometer with a sock on it is called a sling psygrometer(sp) and it is used as the wet bulb half of a dual bulb thermometer to measure RELATIVE HUMIDITY, not windchill. And the sock is not to hold atmospheric moisture, it is moistened so that it will provide evaporative cooling. The difference between the dry side and wet side can be charted to give relative humidity.
    Yup 100% correct.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan N
    Windchill does not apply to inanimate objects once they reach the temperature of the surrounding air (spare me the BS about the paint holding moisture enough to be a factor). Windchill is just a number that compares the heat loss of a warm object in moving air as compared to still air. Try to stay with me now,, a warm engine will cool faster in the wind than in still air but it will never get any colder than the actual air temperature. Your hands, in that windy alley are subject to windchill, hence they feel colder than if the wind was not blowing.
    Just a little minor clarification.

    And engine will cool faster in a wind than in still air but that is not "wind chill". Any moving fluid will be more effiecient in cooling than a non moving fluild. Basic thermodynamics.

    Quote Originally Posted by NOAA
    Wind Chill Temperature

    Is the cooling effect of wind on exposed skin.
    The formula to compute Wind Chill:
    Wind chill temperature = 35.74 + 0.6215T - 35.75V (**0.16) + 0.4275TV(**0.16)

    Where V is the wind speed in statute miles per hour
    T is the temperature in degrees Fahrenheit.
    Wind chill factor was determined by the military post WWII, to aid in potentially fighting a war in colder climates (Siberia).

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan N
    I know this may be hard for you to understand but that is just because you're a BOZO!!! There is no government plot to keep things secret, you are not blessed with being the only one allowed to know the secrets of the universe. You are also not generally acknowledged as being a source of viable information.
    Yup you are 100% correct again.
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  3. #103
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan N
    OK, Billy Mac,, once again you are displaying just how little you really know.

    Judging a tank to be empty and advocating leaving it valved open are two different things entirely. At no point did I advocate nor imply that it was acceptable to leave a tank valved open. Get your BS straight if you're going to accuse me of something.

    You also aren't bright enough to understand the difference between evaporative cooling and windchill. THEY ARE NOT THE SAME THING!! Got that? Try to keep it straight, this may get a little complicated for you.

    That thermometer with a sock on it is called a sling psygrometer(sp) and it is used as the wet bulb half of a dual bulb thermometer to measure RELATIVE HUMIDITY, not windchill. And the sock is not to hold atmospheric moisture, it is moistened so that it will provide evaporative cooling. The difference between the dry side and wet side can be charted to give relative humidity.

    Windchill does not apply to inanimate objects once they reach the temperature of the surrounding air (spare me the BS about the paint holding moisture enough to be a factor). Windchill is just a number that compares the heat loss of a warm object in moving air as compared to still air. Try to stay with me now,, a warm engine will cool faster in the wind than in still air but it will never get any colder than the actual air temperature. Your hands, in that windy alley are subject to windchill, hence they feel colder than if the wind was not blowing.

    I know this may be hard for you to understand but that is just because you're a BOZO!!! There is no government plot to keep things secret, you are not blessed with being the only one allowed to know the secrets of the universe. You are also not generally acknowledged as being a source of viable information.
    Ok lets take a look at the humidity checking device. Now it is not made of skin is it? No it is not.

    I swing it around and it lowers the temperature of the thermometer. And will maintain that lowered temperature.

    We are talking about a standard thermometer. Nothing skin like, no moisture on it. Just a thermometer and something that can hold ambient moisture the sock. We don't add moisture to the sock as you mentioned. The reason is it has to measure the moisture in the atmosphere.

    Yet it lowers the temperature of the skinles, human less bulb. Continuously drains heat from it. As long as you keep it moving. Imagine a whistling wind in the Brooklyn alleyway.

    In Brooklyn, on a day with the current temperature of 7 degrees. In an alleyway with a strong constant wind. It makes acetylene stop coming out of the tank. In about a minute, under these conditions. A good new tank of acetylene can give no gas. Even when the regulator is removed.

    I will go as far as to say that the tank may actually suck in air under these conditions. If the tank is opened without the regulator.

    This should be tested and documented. It is very real. We had a plant in New Jersey blow up recently during an extreme cold spell. Here in New York we are not allowed to manufacture it.

    In my book the humidity checker does in fact measure wind chill.



    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  4. #104
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by William McCormick Jr
    In my book the humidity checker does in fact measure wind chill.
    Obviously there is only one copy of "your book", the rest of us deal with reality

  5. #105
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade Tree Welder
    And engine will cool faster in a wind than in still air but that is not "wind chill". Any moving fluid will be more effiecient in cooling than a non moving fluild. Basic thermodynamics.
    No the humidity checking device does not need to be wet. It works dry or with the humidity in the air.

    That is how it measures the humidity, by using the windchill to determine how much humidity is in the air.


    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  6. #106
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan N
    Obviously there is only one copy of "your book", the rest of us deal with reality

    Alan maybe you could go to your book and enlighten me. Tell me how your book explains the movement of the humidity checker and its relevance to the temperature and humidity?

    We used them in class and we did not wet the sock because it would give you a very high humidity reading. Also you would not be able to maintain with any scientific accuracy the proper amount of moisture by adding it to the sock. It would always be equalizing to ambient humidity rather then using ambient humidity and maintaining a constant.

    You want to rely on the moisture in the atmosphere to cause the cooling effect. And it does.

    It is like on damp days. In a wind on a damp day it is very cold. It is more then evaporative cooling, if by that term you mean that the humidity is there and then evaporates once.

    It is windchill. Air is compressed nearing the surface of an object it gives off heat into the air. Then its velocity increases causing a lack of pressure and this takes heat away from an object. The more moisture the better it works.

    The material sock on the humidity checker, offers an excellent surface for air to compress and then decompress.





    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  7. #107

    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Willy Nilly - where have you been? I found the oompa powered perpetual plane!!

    Here in Oompa Loompa land, we don't have weather.
    Oompa, Loompa, doom-pa-dee-do
    I have a perfect puzzle for you
    Oompa, Loompa, doom-pa-dee-dee
    If you are wise, you'll listen to me

  8. #108
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan N
    OK, Billy Mac,, once again you are displaying just how little you really know.

    Judging a tank to be empty and advocating leaving it valved open are two different things entirely. At no point did I advocate nor imply that it was acceptable to leave a tank valved open. Get your BS straight if you're going to accuse me of something.

    You also aren't bright enough to understand the difference between evaporative cooling and windchill. THEY ARE NOT THE SAME THING!! Got that? Try to keep it straight, this may get a little complicated for you.

    That thermometer with a sock on it is called a sling psygrometer(sp) and it is used as the wet bulb half of a dual bulb thermometer to measure RELATIVE HUMIDITY, not windchill. And the sock is not to hold atmospheric moisture, it is moistened so that it will provide evaporative cooling. The difference between the dry side and wet side can be charted to give relative humidity.

    Windchill does not apply to inanimate objects once they reach the temperature of the surrounding air (spare me the BS about the paint holding moisture enough to be a factor). Windchill is just a number that compares the heat loss of a warm object in moving air as compared to still air. Try to stay with me now,, a warm engine will cool faster in the wind than in still air but it will never get any colder than the actual air temperature. Your hands, in that windy alley are subject to windchill, hence they feel colder than if the wind was not blowing.

    I know this may be hard for you to understand but that is just because you're a BOZO!!! There is no government plot to keep things secret, you are not blessed with being the only one allowed to know the secrets of the universe. You are also not generally acknowledged as being a source of viable information.

    I am in the scrap yard it is seven degrees out, the old acetylene tanks from a closed down factory, have been in whistling winds amongst the scrap overnight.

    They open the tanks one by one and they bleed off for about a minute but not with any great amount of pressure. They stop. Almost seems like they are sucking in air.

    We know Alan N. And he says no problem if it is not minus 83 degrees they are empty baby. So off they go to the super crusher.

    I might if I had not lived through this, had sided with you on some points, but after seeing this personally I can tell you we are lead by a bunch of nuts.



    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  9. #109

    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Willy can you please come fix our reverse osmosis chocolate filter? Please?
    Oompa, Loompa, doom-pa-dee-do
    I have a perfect puzzle for you
    Oompa, Loompa, doom-pa-dee-dee
    If you are wise, you'll listen to me

  10. #110
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Can we please put a "clamp" on this thread!!!!!..

    This stupidity has gone on long enough..

    And I think we all know where it's coming from...

    ...zap!


    I am not completely insane..
    Some parts are missing

    Professional Driver on a closed course....
    Do not attempt.

    Just because I'm a dumbass don't mean that you can be too.
    So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.

  11. #111
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    I spent an hour trying to find something to support this magic tool of yours william. I deal with humidity checkers all the time and they all use a wet bulb and a dry dulb. The wet bulb is wet not dry. We also have some eletronic wet bulb readers now and they work very well. According to everything I could find, wind chill is a calculation drived from freezing water.

    I think this thread has run it's course and we all need to step back and let it go. If we don't agree on something, then we need to agree to disagree.
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  12. #112
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Not quite a book, but it was the best I coudl find quickly. It did come from a .gov site so it's probably part of the conspiracy to keep us in the dark.




    Weather Instruments to Make
    Sling Psychrometer
    Relative humidity can be measured by an instrument called a hygrometer. The simplest hygrometer - a sling psychrometer - consists of two thermometers mounted together with a handle attached on a chain. One thermometer is ordinary. The other has a cloth wick over its bulb and is called a wet-bulb thermometer.

    When a reading is to be taken, the wick is first dipped in water and then the instrument is whirled around. During the whirling, the water evaporates from the wick, cooling the wet-bulb thermometer. Then the temperatures of both thermometers are read.

    If the surrounding air is dry, more moisture evaporates from the wick, cooling the wet-bulb thermometer more so there is a greater difference between the temperatures of the two thermometers. If the surrounding air is holding as much moisture as possible - if the relative humidity is 100% - there is no difference between the two temperatures. Meteorologists have worked out charts of these differences for each degree of temperature so that the observer can find relative humidity easily. A sample is shown below:

    Partial Relative Humidity Chart for 30° C Difference Between
    Dry Bulb and Wet Bulb
    Temperatures Relative Humidity
    None 100%
    0.5° 96%
    1.0° 93%
    1.5° 89%
    9.0° 44%
    9.5° 42%
    14.5° 19%
    15.0° 17%
    18.0° 5%

  13. #113
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by oompa_loompa
    Willy can you please come fix our reverse osmosis chocolate filter? Please?
    It is probably the water in the strawberries.


    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  14. #114
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by oompa_loompa
    Willy can you please come fix our reverse osmosis chocolate filter? Please?
    Brandy, olive oil, and even grape seed oil does not fix it.


    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  15. #115
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan N
    Not quite a book, but it was the best I coudl find quickly. It did come from a .gov site so it's probably part of the conspiracy to keep us in the dark.




    Weather Instruments to Make
    Sling Psychrometer
    Relative humidity can be measured by an instrument called a hygrometer. The simplest hygrometer - a sling psychrometer - consists of two thermometers mounted together with a handle attached on a chain. One thermometer is ordinary. The other has a cloth wick over its bulb and is called a wet-bulb thermometer.

    When a reading is to be taken, the wick is first dipped in water and then the instrument is whirled around. During the whirling, the water evaporates from the wick, cooling the wet-bulb thermometer. Then the temperatures of both thermometers are read.

    If the surrounding air is dry, more moisture evaporates from the wick, cooling the wet-bulb thermometer more so there is a greater difference between the temperatures of the two thermometers. If the surrounding air is holding as much moisture as possible - if the relative humidity is 100% - there is no difference between the two temperatures. Meteorologists have worked out charts of these differences for each degree of temperature so that the observer can find relative humidity easily. A sample is shown below:

    Partial Relative Humidity Chart for 30° C Difference Between
    Dry Bulb and Wet Bulb
    Temperatures Relative Humidity
    None 100%
    0.5° 96%
    1.0° 93%
    1.5° 89%
    9.0° 44%
    9.5° 42%
    14.5° 19%
    15.0° 17%
    18.0° 5%

    But back in my day we got pre-World War Two schooling. Our humidity checker, a bit easier to say then slingphsychitree or whatever.

    Used to have a glass sock. If you were lazy you only used that one device. You could read it first for the temperature and then swing it around for the humidity.

    You did not wet the bulb. It is a much more sophisticated instrument. Much more accurate then putting water that can range in ph and chlorine, fluorine, sodium hydroxide and minerals greatly. Even bottled distilled water has contaminants in it from the plastic that could cause you to get a false reading.

    I just went down and got a five degree differential, I did some other things in between and I would guess my breath in the basement for 30 minutes brought it up to 7 degrees differential.

    I used a silicon wool. And I used a "J" type thermal couple to take the temperature. I believe it is accurate to +/- 0.1 degree Celsius. At the thermal couple level. Meaning it will show temperature differential at the thermal couple to 0.1 degree Celsius.

    At correctly reporting the temperature compensating for ambient radiation I believe it can be off by one degree Celsius.

    I used a house fan to blow on the sock.

    Try yours with a glass sock.



    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  16. #116
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamlit
    I spent an hour trying to find something to support this magic tool of yours william. I deal with humidity checkers all the time and they all use a wet bulb and a dry dulb. The wet bulb is wet not dry. We also have some eletronic wet bulb readers now and they work very well. According to everything I could find, wind chill is a calculation drived from freezing water.

    I think this thread has run it's course and we all need to step back and let it go. If we don't agree on something, then we need to agree to disagree.
    I could not believe that they would do away with that instrument. It was cool and very easy and quick to use. You read the temperature in the room swung it around and took your reading. It is pre-world War Two though. Most of what I learned in school was pre-World War Two.

    We had a periodic table that was about 75 years old in the seventies. It became the modern periodic table for many years. Only recently did they start to change things into kelvin on the periodic table.

    We learned about kelvin and understood that scale to be used for work at sub-zero temperatures. Work on super ARC weapons was being done at those temperatures.

    It would never be used in day to day life. However as you may or may not know they have started to make the periodic tables giving temperatures in kelvin. That is just plain crazy.

    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  17. #117
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by William McCormick Jr
    I just went down and got a five degree differential, I did some other things in between and I would guess my breath in the basement for 30 minutes brought it up to 7 degrees differential.
    Makes sense with all the hot air you have.

  18. #118
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    I did experimenting and in fact a cotton cloth around the thermocouple in front of the fan does nothing really to change the temperature of the thermocouple.

    But you put the glass cloth on there and away she goes. I mean the bottom just falls out. The temperature just drops.

    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum3.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum4.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum5.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum6.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum7.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum9.jpg

    I don't know why you guys don't believe me but maybe you have some really good reason. I don't know what it is, but I will try to be as believable as I can. Sometimes I clown a bit, but I just need some comedy. Ha-ha.

    Sincerely,


    William McCormick
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  19. #119
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    I did experimenting and in fact a cotton cloth around the thermocouple in front of the fan does nothing really to change the temperature of the thermocouple.

    But you put the glass cloth on there and away she goes. I mean the bottom just falls out. The temperature just drops.

    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum3.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum4.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum5.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum6.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum7.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum9.jpg

    I don't know why you guys don't believe me but maybe you have some really good reason. I don't know what it is, but I will try to be as believable as I can. Sometimes I clown a bit, but I just need some comedy. Ha-ha.

    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  20. #120
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    I did experimenting and in fact a cotton cloth around the thermocouple in front of the fan does nothing really to change the temperature of the thermocouple.

    But you put the glass cloth on there and away she goes. I mean the bottom just falls out. The temperature just drops.

    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum3.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum4.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum5.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum6.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum7.jpg
    http://www.Rockwelder.com/WeldingWeb/Humidity/hum9.jpg

    I don't know why you guys don't believe me but maybe you have some really good reason. I don't know what it is, but I will try to be as believable as I can. Sometimes I clown a bit, but I just need some comedy. Ha-ha.

    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  21. #121
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Does anyone know how or why I can make one post, and three pop up. This is the only forum it happens on. Maybe they are still ironing out some stuff. And this is fine. I just would like everyone to know I just make one post and then sometimes three pop up.



    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  22. #122
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Someone shoot me..
    When will this all end???



    ...zap!
    Last edited by zapster; 12-27-2007 at 11:42 PM.


    I am not completely insane..
    Some parts are missing

    Professional Driver on a closed course....
    Do not attempt.

    Just because I'm a dumbass don't mean that you can be too.
    So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.

  23. #123
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Quote Originally Posted by zapster
    Someone shoot me..
    When will this all end???



    ...zap!
    What is it about humidity that you don't want others to talk about? Ha-ha.



    Sincerely,


    William McCormick

  24. #124
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    I have 28% Humidity in my house right now and the wood stove at full tilt..

    Kettle's on the boil and we're so easily drawn away..

    What's gonna happen next?

    ...zap!


    I am not completely insane..
    Some parts are missing

    Professional Driver on a closed course....
    Do not attempt.

    Just because I'm a dumbass don't mean that you can be too.
    So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.

  25. #125
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    Re: Acetelyne explosion?

    Zap, it would be good if we could stay on the topic from the originalThread, what yu thunk? John
    SMAW,GMAW,FCAW,GTAW,SAW,PAC/PAW/OFC
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