Legal ramifications of a cab swap ? - Page 2
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  1. #26
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    centrail valley, California
    Posts
    5

    Re: Legal ramifications of a cab swap ?

    is the truck non oped? in California they go off the vin on the body. you can weld the vin up on the frame and restamp to match if you get a title with the cab. I had a theft recovery truck that they pulled vins off. the chp gave me a sticker for the door and told me to stamp the frame. it works on older cars too. you can put an old truck body on a new truck frame. if your pre 75 with the cab.....no smog.

  2. #27
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    79

    Re: Legal ramifications of a cab swap ?

    In my state if you have the title to the cab and the title to the frame and they are in your name; they will take both and issue a state VIN number and attach a metal VIN tag with said number. Then they take both titles and issue you a new one with the State VIN number as the VIN.

    However, I have taken trucks that were from out of state, but completely legal, and when the inspector is looking it over I have been told the following, "we don't really make a big fuss about these old trucks because of all the farm trucks we see; cabs get swapped, frames get swapped so it doesn't really matter if the truck ain't worth anything"

    So if you take in an old (older than 1985) truck they don't look it over as close, but if you take in a 2010 escalade they pick it like a fine tooth comb.
    Some blue machines
    Some red machines
    lots of heavy steel

  3. #28
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Duarte, CA
    Posts
    3

    Re: Legal ramifications of a cab swap ?

    I'm building my '65 C10 truck & had to opt for another cab - the original has so much cancer it would be foolish to repair it. I posed this same question on a truck forum 6 months ago & had similar responses & warnings about "it could be a felony" from some outside my state. I acquired another cab with title paperwork just to be safe.

    There is no mention in the California vehicle code book nor the DMV regs of what percentage of the original cab has to remain attached to the VIN plate to do repair of the VINned body part here in JackBootLand. As long as the rosette rivets aren't disturbed, cutting out around the VIN plate & carefully welding the piece into the "new" cab is the way to go.

    There used to be rosette rivet kits available on fleabay but I suppose someone objected so they're no longer being listed.

    My cab & frame match the original title VIN numbers - just as they always have for 22 years.

  4. #29
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    10

    Re: Legal ramifications of a cab swap ?

    Quote Originally Posted by BradTN View Post
    So, I called the biggest local body shop that I know of and the guy seemed to know very little about the subject.
    That's because they're in no position to offer you legal advice and they don't want to expose themselves to any scrutiny, either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dualie View Post
    i would actually start by calling the state police
    It's a mixed bag talking to the police. Generally speaking, they don't provide legal advice nor do they offer free legal educations, they just enforce the laws as they understand them. You'll have to look up the laws in your state on your own if you really want to know the truth.

    BradTN, your best bet is to educate yourself on state and federal law, including all relevant case law and legal interpretations issued by the courts and by the various law enforcement entities. Recognize there may be conflict from one state to another or between state law and federal law (nobody is perfect, not even judges). A shortcut might be to hire a qualified lawyer to provide you with legal advice.

    Remember, VIN tampering is only a crime if your intent is to commit fraud or otherwise misrepresent the vehicle. But walking down this path gets into deep philosophical and legal issues of what constitutes a motor vehicle (the frame or the cab or the sum of the parts), what constitutes a valid repair, what fraud was or was not intended, etc. There is no simple answer and as others have stated what works for you in TN might not work elsewhere. Good luck!
    Miller Diversion 165

  5. #30
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    NH no mo - MA now.
    Posts
    1,753

    Re: Legal ramifications of a cab swap ?

    Quote Originally Posted by freedomgli View Post
    ...Remember, VIN tampering is only a crime if your intent is to commit fraud or otherwise misrepresent the vehicle.
    Not necessarily so!

    But walking down this path gets into deep philosophical and legal issues .... Good luck!
    Very true!

    Tampering with serial numbers of any kind is a slippery slope. As to being a crime, under many statutes it has nothing to do with intent. Be very careful of how the law is written. If it says anything about "prima facie evidence" then intent is irrelevent.

    It's like the joke about the girl who is spending an afternoon at her father's lake cottage and take the little boat out for a spin. A game officer is standing on the shore when she come sback and spying the tip of a fishing rod under the seat askes for her fishing license. She doesn't have a fishing license. But in just about all 50 states being in a boat on a lake with a fish pole in your posession is "prima facie evidence" that you are fishing and the law enforcement officer has no requirement to show any other proof of intent. According to the law she's guilty!

    In the joke the girl tells the officer that she will file charges of rape. The officer complains that he didn't even get close to her but she explains "You have the equipment!"

    Back to reality.... If you mess with a VIN then the crime has been committed. Intent to defraud is irrelevent.

    - Mondo
    Member, AWS
    Lincoln ProMIG 140
    Lincoln AC Tombstone
    Craftsman Lathe 12 x 24 c1935
    Atlas MFC Horizontal Mill
    Craftsman Commercial Lathe 12 x 36 c1970
    - - -
    I'll just keep on keepin' on.

  6. #31
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    10
    Good call Mondo. From a federal law standpoint, my understanding is that there must be intent. From a state law viewpoint, it really depends on the particulars of each state's law. Hence my encouragement to contact a lawyer. The law is intentionally stacked against the layman who does not have the legal education foundation to understand how the law might be applied in actual practice regardless of how he interprets what's written.

    That joke is a good way to explain the concept of prima facie evidence. I'll have to use that.
    Miller Diversion 165

  7. #32
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    18

    Re: Legal ramifications of a cab swap ?

    I agree cut and paste that b!tch in there. IM thinking bout doing the same, i have a 1977 SS halfcab that i would consider doing it to since there's a lot of rust and the bed is shot-- but i might just weld it all back together. the state didnt even know that it was a truck, they had it listed as a wagon and had to redo the state title anyway, so they wouldn't even know if you did swap cabs.

  8. #33
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Sparks, NV
    Posts
    9,590

    Re: Legal ramifications of a cab swap ?

    here is a pic of one I did, took a 1981 S1754 International crewcab and installed it on a 2001 International 4700. used the 4700 reg cuz I had paid the tax on that already. Scrapped the 81 and still have the vin plate and title for the 81.. heh
    Last edited by soutthpaw; 04-17-2013 at 09:29 PM.
    Tiger Sales: AHP Distributor www.tigersalesco.com
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