Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...
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  1. #1
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    Oct 2013
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    Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...

    Been discussing on the side with gamble but figured it can't hurt to post it here too.

    Been using the cut45 with hypertherm style torch in a cnc table for the last few days, all was going great.

    Randomly today it decided it didn't want to work right anymore. The arc would just stop firing in the middle of a programmed cut, which resulted in a loss of a few pieces of steel so far.

    Took the torch out of the machine, tried using it manually. Arc fires intermittently. When you pull the trigger, the air always goes off but the arc only goes off some of the time. Sometimes it also makes a small spark like it tried to ignite and it failed, but still blows air. This includes the pilot arc not firing as well.

    I am using authentic hyperthem brand PM45 consumables as well.

    I tried replacing everything but the swirl ring and no dice. The items shown in the photo with the exception of the swirl ring were brand new. They have some charring from the couple times it did ignite.

    Spring for the electrode is fine. Everything else seems ok. The only thing that seems off is there is an air leak between the grey plastic connection and the black portion of where the torch begins.

    Edit: after further testing, it seems to work with the very worn Razerweld consumables that came with it. They’re too worn to use for decent cuts but when I swap out the nozzle only to the Razerweld one with hypertherm electrode, it seems to function fine. I tried yet another new hypertherm nozzle and still nothing.

    It was working fine with the hypertherm consumables until this point. All consumables are from the same 5 pack.

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    Last edited by BrooklynBravest; 11-01-2018 at 07:03 PM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
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    151

    Re: Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...

    How is the plasma arc /air triggered ?
    by chance a solenoid pushing the mechanical switch on the torch?

    I ask because my Lotos acted like that after a years use.

    It would Always trigger the air solenoid - But Not the pilot arc/main arc from time to time. Similar symptoms to what you describe.

    i tested the torches switch and even when pushed hard it would be between 50-300 ohms.

    Took the switch out and cleaned it until it was about 1 ohm -been fine ever since.

    I know these are different plasma cutters- but depending on (how) the triggering of the air /arc initiation takes place- it may pay to command arc- if no (mechanical) triggering is used and measure the resistance that the plasma cutter sees at it's connector when the arc is command is sent.

    Hope this makes sense
    1962 Idealarc Tig 300 300
    1974 Idealarc Tig 300 300 ( till owner needs it back)
    1988 Power Mig 150 (.112 f cap mod)
    2015 Lotos Ltpdc2000d plasma/arc/tig
    Victor 100 torch, 200- 210 Oxy/Acet gauges

  3. #3
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    Re: Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...

    It is a solonoid but i don’t think that’s the issue. The machine is pretty much brand new.

    I put the hypertherm consumables back in and now it’s firing again, but i guess i have to do extensive testing to see if it keeps firing normally.

    I can’t figure out why it stopped to begin with. I also do not know why it’s leaking air between the retaining cap and torch body.
    www.FirehouseFabricators.com



    Lincoln 210mp
    Lincoln SW200

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    New Hampshire
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    Re: Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...

    The torch is a copy of a 20 year old torch design from Hypertherm. If you are putting Hypertherm consumables in a torch manufactured by another company....the most common issue would be related to the stack up tolerances between the torch and the consumables. If the torch was built using a dimensions directly from a Hypertherm design.....then the consumables would work. If the torch was built using measurements taken from a Hypertherm torch (as it was) then likely it could be straying a few thousandths from the stack up specs. I would suggest using consumables made by the torch builder. The nozzle in your pic does not look like the correct nozzle from Hypertherm that would work in that torch design. Are you using all Hypertherm parts? Swirl ring, electrode, nozzle, retaining cap and shield? Jim Colt

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
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    151

    Re: Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...

    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBravest View Post
    It is a solonoid but i don’t think that’s the issue. The machine is pretty much brand new.

    I put the hypertherm consumables back in and now it’s firing again, but i guess i have to do extensive testing to see if it keeps firing normally.

    I can’t figure out why it stopped to begin with. I also do not know why it’s leaking air between the retaining cap and torch body.


    Testing the switch contacts only requires disconnecting the torch from the plasma cutter.
    Then alligator clipping to the pins (usually) pins 1+2 and measuring in the lowest ohms test with a multi-meter while holding the trigger down.

    If the resistance is close to zero with switch pushed -you will have eliminated the torch switch as a possible contributor to the inconsistent triggering.


    Jim is definitely the expert with plasma cutters, and I certainly agree with using the OE parts the manufacturer recommends to eliminate a mismatch for sure.
    1962 Idealarc Tig 300 300
    1974 Idealarc Tig 300 300 ( till owner needs it back)
    1988 Power Mig 150 (.112 f cap mod)
    2015 Lotos Ltpdc2000d plasma/arc/tig
    Victor 100 torch, 200- 210 Oxy/Acet gauges

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
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    Long Island, NY
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    Re: Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...

    The retaining cap and swirl ring are the only non hypertherm parts. I purchased the hypertherm style torch so i would be able to source consumables locally while not having to spend $2500 for my first plasma cutter. That said, I had to determine the consumables which fit on my own because Jasic only wants you to buy their consumables which you can’t buy basically anywhere unless they’re willing to special order for you or are already a Razerweld dealer. I will most likely purchase the retaining cap and swirl ring to go along with the rest.

    These are the 3 items I purchased, totally by the fact that they fit into the torch i might add. Not by research whatsoever because Jasic wouldn’t tell me what I could use...

    Nozzle - 220718
    Shield - 220717
    Electrode - 220669

    Should I decide to expand my operation to a more production setup, i will without a doubt be purchasing a genuine hypertherm. I mostly bought this setup to learn with and play around.


    Other than not telling me the comparable hypertherm consumables, Jasic has great customer service. The torch at a minimum does have an air leak in it at the retaining cap and torch body. I spoke to jasic and they are sending a full replacement torch.
    www.FirehouseFabricators.com



    Lincoln 210mp
    Lincoln SW200

  7. #7
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    Oct 2007
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    New Hampshire
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    Re: Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...

    The torch “leak” is further proof that the torch is a copy of a Hypertherm design. The real torch from Hypertherm will have the same cooling flow that exits between the retaining cap and the torch body! Jim Colt. Hypertherm. I suspect if you have all genuine parts, swirl ring, retaining cap, electrode, nozzle and shield....that you will have better luck. Mixing genuine and aftermarket parts often causes misfiring and consumable failure.

  8. #8
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    Re: Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...

    Thanks Jim for the info. I will definitely be buying a 30 or 45 from hypertherm in the next couple of years.

    Tried new consumables and having firing issues again after it worked fine for a cut of a small sign.

    When i look at the tip of the electrode and inside the nozzle and see that burnt swirl pattern, should it be even? It seems to only be to one side of center. I’m not sure if that means the consumables are not seated on one another properly and maybe they’re losing contact.

    Also, is it ok to be using the machine at 45 amps all the time as long as I’m using 45 amp consumables or should I not be at the upper limit?
    www.FirehouseFabricators.com



    Lincoln 210mp
    Lincoln SW200

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
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    Chicago
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    Re: Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...

    In case anyone finds this thread. Problem is all fixed by replacing the damaged swirl ring
    Torchmate 2x2 CNC with Flashcut CNC controls
    Hypertherm Powermax45
    2015 AHP Tig
    Razorweld 195 Mig
    Razorweld 200ac/dc Tig
    ViperMig 180
    Razorweld, Vipercut/Vipermig, SSC Foot Pedal & MK Products & Atlas Positioner Dealer

  10. #10
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    Nov 2009
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    Pensacola , Fla
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    Re: Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...

    Thanks Gamble it's nice to see at least someone posts the solution for those that may have similar problem at a later date. So many ask for help and never report back people offer help.
    DIY CNC Plasma table & CandCNC DTHC-IV MP 3100 Feather Touch option
    Hypertherm 65
    Everlast PT 256 EX Tig
    Miler 180 Mig
    13" metal lathe
    Mill/ Drill
    ECT, ECT,

  11. #11
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    Oct 2013
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    Re: Razerweld Cut45 stopped working...

    My apologies, i posted it in the other thread and forgot about this one.

    Yes as gamble said the problem seems to have been the swirl ring. Not sure if I damaged it somehow or what but he edge that meets the nozzle was rough and a little uneven.

    Replacing it with a genuine hypertherm one seems to have done the trick.
    www.FirehouseFabricators.com



    Lincoln 210mp
    Lincoln SW200

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