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Thread: Flood

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
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    Mount Tabor VT
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    Flood

    In 2011 Hurricane Irene was blown out by the time it hit VT. Still it did record breaking damage.

    Last night we had heavy rain. No big deal. High elevation still had deep snow. The phone rang before 5 AM, a neighbor.

    Our house, and garage were not at risk, but the "dry brook" was 12 feet deep. Another foot, it'd be over the floor of the sugar house. We don't make syrup anymore, but it contains tractors, wood, 14 ladders, and the Miller Bobcat. Nancy and I scrambled to move tractors, the welder, and ladders to high ground. The wood would take too long to move. It didn't rise much after that.

    I had fleeting thoughts of the disaster in 2011, wondered if I could go through that again.

    Again, the man made turn in the river failed, not catastrophically this time.

    The picture shows the barricade the Federal US Forest Service built in 1980 to turn the river 110 degrees, preventing most of the time water from coming down the old brook. It blew out instantly in 2011 when a series of beaver ponds failed further up the mountain.

    When they replaced it in 2011, they used bigger stones, but no taller.

    Name:  Engineering.jpg
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    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Manitoba Canada
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    2,527

    Re: Flood

    Glad to hear you escaped serious damage.... that's a nasty looking current. We're monitoring the Red River as well. So far it's not reaching excessively high levels but there are already some road closures going on near the Canada/US border.
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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Wenatchee Washington
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    343

    Re: Flood

    WOW, that's some serious power going down that "dry" brook!!! Glad you're safe.
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  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Delavan WI
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    443

    Re: Flood

    Lotsa water!! I bet that dry brook is a few feet deeper now.

  5. #5
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    Dec 2013
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    Re: Flood

    Quote Originally Posted by flushcut View Post
    Lotsa water!! I bet that dry brook is a few feet deeper now.
    To the contrary! Earth, mostly small rock 5' and smaller come from the mountain. Each big storm brings millions of cubic yards to lower elevation.

    I'm sort of at the bottom of the steepest of the mountain. From home to the Otter Creek is 1/3 mile, it only falls 50 feet to the Creek. The volume of crushed rock deposited after each storm would amaze you!

    The 2011 flood raised the floor of the mountain brook average 5' downstream from me.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
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    Outside of Raleigh, NC
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    894

    Re: Flood

    Holy Crap Bill! Glad that you're ok.
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  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
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    Mount Tabor VT
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    6,257

    Re: Flood

    Quote Originally Posted by scsmith42 View Post
    Holy Crap Bill! Glad that you're ok.
    Alive, and well thus far. Sleep was not in the equation last night, maybe tonight.

    Thanks
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  8. #8
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    Dec 2013
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    Mount Tabor VT
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    Re: Flood

    Quote Originally Posted by whtbaron View Post
    Glad to hear you escaped serious damage.... that's a nasty looking current. We're monitoring the Red River as well. So far it's not reaching excessively high levels but there are already some road closures going on near the Canada/US border.
    I gave a paragraph of fascinating response, then it disappeared. Just imagine an interesting response, I don't remember what I said.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    SoCal-LA
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    9,313

    Re: Flood

    Wow! Goes to show, you never know so be prepared.
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  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
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    Mount Tabor VT
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    6,257

    Re: Flood

    It's funny. 40 years ago when the feds were mapping flood hazard areas, we were not considered. Despite the damage in the 1927 flood, All, especially all engineers believed any hazard had been mitigated. By 1980 they fixed it more.

    I plead: "please don't help us more, we've suffered enough".

    I shouldn't complain, my neighbors got several thousand from FEMA in 2011. They calculated my real estate damage at $118,500. I got $1,026.32 'cause my driveway washed out. I fixed the driveway an hour after the water subsided, and didn't ask for driveway repair. Ultimately, Small Business Administration offered a loan for $118500. There were strings attached. I had to pay with a single check to a single contractor. The loan included replacing 70 foot tall 30" diameter trees. I can't even imagine how you'd do that!
    Last edited by Willie B; 04-15-2019 at 08:15 PM.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    1,964

    Re: Flood

    Willie grab your track loader and head down the dry creek and bring home a thousand yrds . to have on hand for when you need it.Of course the feds would put you in jail for dredging the creek with out a permit.

  12. #12
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    Dec 2013
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    Mount Tabor VT
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    Re: Flood

    Quote Originally Posted by gxbxc View Post
    Willie grab your track loader and head down the dry creek and bring home a thousand yrds . to have on hand for when you need it.Of course the feds would put you in jail for dredging the creek with out a permit.
    Prison: Maybe, Hero of the neighborhood, absolutely. Neighbor 1/4 mile down the hill has 30" of water in the basement. With the floor of the tributary stream 5' higher than it was, the water table down there where it levels out is 5' higher too.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Delavan WI
    Posts
    443

    Re: Flood

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie B View Post
    To the contrary! Earth, mostly small rock 5' and smaller come from the mountain. Each big storm brings millions of cubic yards to lower elevation.

    I'm sort of at the bottom of the steepest of the mountain. From home to the Otter Creek is 1/3 mile, it only falls 50 feet to the Creek. The volume of crushed rock deposited after each storm would amaze you!

    The 2011 flood raised the floor of the mountain brook average 5' downstream from me.
    WOW! Well I am glad you are ok.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    640

    Re: Flood

    That picture perfectly conveys the fear that kind of violent power induces, glad to hear everything was ok

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Mn / Tx
    Posts
    544

    Re: Flood

    In 76 we had a flood in Little falls MN. Eleven inches of rain in less than 24 hours. The water took the path of the old stream that had been filled and built on 50 years earlier. My parents were living there when they filled the stream. so many people were surprised when you could canoe in the stream again.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
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    4,006

    Re: Flood

    Delete redirect sp?
    Last edited by Insaneride; 04-18-2019 at 02:17 AM. Reason: Supposed to be where the river flows

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
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    4,006

    Re: Flood

    [QUOTE=Insaneride;8693801]Delete redirect sp?


  18. #18
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    Dec 2013
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    Mount Tabor VT
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    6,257

    Re: Flood

    A deer camp 300 yards from home Monday at 10:00 AMName:  Nichols Camp.jpg
Views: 320
Size:  157.0 KB
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  19. #19
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    Oct 2016
    Location
    Delavan WI
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    443

    Re: Flood

    Is it still there?

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
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    Mount Tabor VT
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    Re: Flood

    Quote Originally Posted by flushcut View Post
    Is it still there?
    Yup, high and dry. It was in pretty poor condition before, no worse now.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    15

    Re: Flood

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie B View Post
    In 2011 Hurricane Irene was blown out by the time it hit VT. Still it did record breaking damage.

    Last night we had heavy rain. No big deal. High elevation still had deep snow. The phone rang before 5 AM, a neighbor.

    Our house, and garage were not at risk, but the "dry brook" was 12 feet deep. Another foot, it'd be over the floor of the sugar house. We don't make syrup anymore, but it contains tractors, wood, 14 ladders, and the Miller Bobcat. Nancy and I scrambled to move tractors, the welder, and ladders to high ground. The wood would take too long to move. It didn't rise much after that.

    I had fleeting thoughts of the disaster in 2011, wondered if I could go through that again.

    Again, the man made turn in the river failed, not catastrophically this time.

    The picture shows the barricade the Federal US Forest Service built in 1980 to turn the river 110 degrees, preventing most of the time water from coming down the old brook. It blew out instantly in 2011 when a series of beaver ponds failed further up the mountain.

    When they replaced it in 2011, they used bigger stones, but no taller.

    Name:  Engineering.jpg
Views: 581
Size:  114.8 KB
    2017 IRMA blessed me with 4 feet of water in my shop & home. Property was not in flood zone (neighbors said never seen flood for the 50 years they lived there) so I had no flood insurance. All of my tools, lathe, mill, 3 welfers, restored 1965 Sunbeam Alpint, 92 restored Capri, & 94 project Tracker was under water. you was VERY lucky.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Mount Tabor VT
    Posts
    6,257

    Re: Flood

    Quote Originally Posted by fixit32068 View Post
    2017 IRMA blessed me with 4 feet of water in my shop & home. Property was not in flood zone (neighbors said never seen flood for the 50 years they lived there) so I had no flood insurance. All of my tools, lathe, mill, 3 welfers, restored 1965 Sunbeam Alpint, 92 restored Capri, & 94 project Tracker was under water. you was VERY lucky.
    Oh 2011 was plenty bad. The "sugar house" was 24 x 40. It sat on two slabs 12' wide, 24' long. the slabs were 16' apart. this left a 16' wide bay with gravel floor. In the aftermath of Irene, this building was missing the earth it sat on. half the building was suspended in air! 100% of the contents of the very full building were damaged. FEMA assessed the damage at $118500. They couldn't help, I didn't actually live in the building.

    Small Business Administration offered a mortgage. Interest rate was good, but there were PLENTY of strings attached. I decided to go it alone. My son and I did it for $30000. Contents were mostly a total loss. A motor boat looked to be floating with only the drain plug open. there was 8 cubic feet of sand in it.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Wasilla, Alaska
    Posts
    166

    Re: Flood

    I understand your misgivings, I seen several examples of governmental "improvements" that were abject failures, and went through the same FEMA/SBA circus after the earthquake here in Alaska

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    2,200

    Re: Flood

    Seems like you got your floods about the same time we got our fires.



    Dunno which is worse. Fire, ya got nothing left. Water, ya got a mess left. Hell, it's all bad.

  25. #25
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    Dec 2013
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    Mount Tabor VT
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    Re: Flood

    Quote Originally Posted by farmersammm View Post
    Seems like you got your floods about the same time we got our fires.



    Dunno which is worse. Fire, ya got nothing left. Water, ya got a mess left. Hell, it's all bad.
    It is!
    Here we worry little about forest fire. Forest fires self extinguish. Biggest in my life locally was six and a half acres. "They" make remarks about Vermont's "asbestos forest"

    That isn't absolutely true, in about 1900 2000 acres burned 20 miles away. The fall was unusually dry. Deciduous forest dropped leaves early. Rain didn't wet the fallen leaves. It started, (nobody knows). It was at the top of a mountain. It burned to the top, then ran out of a place to go. It burned all organic component of the soil 10 or more feet deep into the ground. Educators take students there 120 years later. It is a wasteland! low growth is all that lives, a walker can't see the ground. You might climb onto a seemingly flat surface of green, and fall between stones several feet deep.

    USFS maps label it "The Burning" It is now surrounded by a thick, near impenetrable wreath of Spruce one can barely crawl through.
    In my youth Deer Camp was a couple miles away. NO deer were ever seen anywhere near, but my father was drawn to the area. I haven't been there in many years, the urge is growing.

    Flood, on the other hand, was something I never worried about. To me, flood was something that happened along the Mississippi. Raging two hour floods with many million dollar damage was a thought I'd have laughed about in 2010. In August of 2011 reality readjusted my understanding.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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