Recommendations for process on my project
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Posts
    22

    Recommendations for process on my project

    A new hobby for me is knife making and general blacksmithing. Concerning knives, I really need a good 2x72 grinder and I want to build the one designed by Jeremy Schmidt (I assume some of you are familiar with the grinder I speak of, if not, search for him on youtube and check it out).

    The grinder is made almost entirely of 3/8" material (yes, it is a tank!). I have never welded material that thick, so I am curious what the recommendation is for welding this thing up? Spray, short-circuit, multi-pass, or ???? In the video, Jeremy uses a smaller welder with no mention or apparent concern about the material thickness (other than he thinks it's too much for his machine), but he manages to stick it all together and nothing comes flying off it when he uses it.

    I have a Lincoln MP210 I purchased a couple years ago and to date all of my welding has been with FC wire on 1/8" material and a few 3/16" pieces here and there. I intend to get a bottle for this project so I can MIG it. Should have gotten a bottle a long time ago, but I don't weld that frequently, and well, life sort of gets in the way of the best intentions some times.

    I don't think this needs to be code level welding, but at the same time I'd like to weld it a little more "legit" than zapping it haphazardly and trust everything will hold without issue.

    3/8" is the limit for single pass with my machine, so should I just get the appropriate wire, crank it up and straight pass it and call it good, or should I do something else?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    central Wis.
    Posts
    4,291

    Re: Recommendations for process on my project

    With your welder I would use .035 dual shield wire. Either that or stick weld with 1/8" 7018. Spray is overrated and I doubt your machine is capable, besides that you would need a real high argon blend which wouldn't be ideal for short circuit mig on lighter material. Your innershield flux core would work but upping wire size to .045 would be more effective.
    Miller xmt304, Miller S22 p12, Miier Maxstar SD, Miller 252 w 30A, Miller super32p12, Lincoln Ranger 9, Thermal Arc 181I with spoolgun, Hypertherm 10000 ,Smith torches. Esab 161lts miniarc.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    SoCal-LA
    Posts
    9,291

    Re: Recommendations for process on my project

    There is an idiot chart under the hood. Buy the C25 gas, hook it up, buy the wire and install it, and set up per the chart to get in the ballpark. Make sure you put on the inert gas nozzle.

    That Lincoln has plenty of grunt to weld your project. Hotter is better. Just make sure your grinder is in good shape for dressing where required. Practice makes perfect.
    Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR"
    MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX3ea,Dynasty200DX,Th ermalArc400GTSW,LincolnSW2002ea., MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig4ea,MigMax1ea.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Posts
    22

    Re: Recommendations for process on my project

    Thanks guys. Practice will definitely be in order before I do any actual welding on the grinder and I'll bevel pieces where I can. Grinding the welds, definitely will (I also have some carbide burs and die grinder), so it will be made "pretty" in that sense.

    As I've heard before "grinders and paint make me the welder I ain't!"...actually though, I'm going to powder coat instead of rattle can.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Bilbao, Spain
    Posts
    821

    Re: Recommendations for process on my project

    MetalMasher.

    I was once a young newby weldor. I am now an older (but still) newby weldor, even more so compared to most of the guys here. However along the way I learned a few things, most of them reading here.

    The thing is, if you are new to welding and don't trust your welds, you will get trigger happy easily in hope of QUANTITY making up for QUALITY. That is, you will weld the snot out of your pieces to make sure the grinder stays together. WRONG. Even 3/8" material will warp if you overweld it. I would suggest you weld as little as required to keep everything together.

    Two options: try a bolt on construction, which requires some machining skills even only to make sure two bolts and threaded holes align suarely (think KMG)... or go the easy route, which is to base your design in square tube sizes (of decent wall thickness) that nest inside each other (for the tool arm). If everything is sorta bolted together, you can make up for any missalignment with washers or shims. If you weld it and screw up... you will have to cut and reweld.

    I put mine together long ago using the second method (although some parts are welded) and does what it needs to do. I just received two 50mm diameter contact wheels today that will work also as iddlers for the flat plate attachment. They will replace some nylon wheels I had turned (the get hot, the bearing loosens up and screws up the whole thing).

    Do you have a few pictures of your design to share with us?

    Mikel

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
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    Qatar
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    260

    Re: Recommendations for process on my project

    Yes, you need to be careful not to over weld it. Jeremy had a problem with that. Your machine is the same class as his (Millermatic 211 transformer), you however have TIG and MIG at your disposal. If you want to make sure your welds are in there you could stick weld the joints if you have experience with stick.

    Dual shield is also a great option, but you need to practice a bit before starting your build. If you want the Lincoln's wire this is the product number ED026804.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Miller Dynasty 280 DX TIGRunner
    Fronius Transsteel 2200

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Posts
    22

    Re: Recommendations for process on my project

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikel_24 View Post
    MetalMasher.

    I was once a young newby weldor. I am now an older (but still) newby weldor, even more so compared to most of the guys here. However along the way I learned a few things, most of them reading here.

    The thing is, if you are new to welding and don't trust your welds, you will get trigger happy easily in hope of QUANTITY making up for QUALITY. That is, you will weld the snot out of your pieces to make sure the grinder stays together. WRONG. Even 3/8" material will warp if you overweld it. I would suggest you weld as little as required to keep everything together.

    Two options: try a bolt on construction, which requires some machining skills even only to make sure two bolts and threaded holes align suarely (think KMG)... or go the easy route, which is to base your design in square tube sizes (of decent wall thickness) that nest inside each other (for the tool arm). If everything is sorta bolted together, you can make up for any missalignment with washers or shims. If you weld it and screw up... you will have to cut and reweld.

    I put mine together long ago using the second method (although some parts are welded) and does what it needs to do. I just received two 50mm diameter contact wheels today that will work also as iddlers for the flat plate attachment. They will replace some nylon wheels I had turned (the get hot, the bearing loosens up and screws up the whole thing).

    Do you have a few pictures of your design to share with us?

    Mikel
    Thanks!

    I consider myself a newbie only in that I've never been to welding school, but have been sticking metal together with my welder for a few years now. I'm comfortable with pieces up to 3/16" thick. If I may toot my own horn here a little, I am a very quick learner and have always had a knack for translating information from written word (and videos) into actual practice. Below is the very first weld I ever made in my entire life, the day I brought my welder home, plugged it in, set it to 1/8" material and had a go at these two plates of 1/8" mild steel using fluxcore wire that came with the welder:


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    I think it was pretty good for the very first time.

    I've never welded 3/8" thick (which is the thickness for this particular grinder). I know my machine can handle it for single pass, and the original designer of the grinder used a machine similar to mine in capability, but he did express thoughts that perhaps it wasn't up to snuff (possibly out of his own skill level or knowledge as opposed to the machine's actual capabilities).

    I believe that I can weld it OK, but was just more curious what the "pros" here thought concerning that thickness. I know that once you start reaching the upper end of a machine's capability, things can become a little different than what the manufacturer claims it can do. I am just erring on the side of caution and also a desire to "do it right." It's also a learning opportunity.

    I fully agree that tube or different material and bolt up construction would be perfectly functional, but I am intentionally ignoring those options. This design is very much overkill in most regards and I am perfectly OK with that. I don't know, consider it an irrational desire to build a tank.

    I didn't design the grinder, it was designed by a young man named Jeremy Schmidt. A talented designer, thinker, and problem solver in my opinion. He has plasn available (which I intend to purchase), but you can view his build on youtube at:

    [

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Brethren, Mi
    Posts
    850

    Re: Recommendations for process on my project

    That is a really good weld. The machine doesn't know how long you been running it. Not every heavy piece needs full weld, lots of 3/8 with 3/16 weld on it. Nothing on that machine should be stressing the welding at 100%.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Posts
    22

    Re: Recommendations for process on my project

    Figured since I'm looking to build that Jeremy Schmidt grinder and since all my welding has been with flux cored wire, I thought I would revisit MIG and FC processes in general. It seems some folks are advocating for FC as they say it penetrates better than solid wire MIG due to higher current density (smaller cross section of electrode wire due to it being hollow) and because it runs in DCEN, putting heat into the base metal. However, I've read articles on both Lincoln and Miller's sites. According to Miller, "Solid wire provides deep penetration in the root and usually has little spatter." "...flux-cored wire produces a rounder penetration profile with excellent sidewall fusion." Lincoln says "the type of welding polarity used affects penetration level. With most arc welding processes, DC+ (direct current electrode positive) polarity produces more weld penetration, because more arc energy is focused into the base plate. Conversely, DC- (direct current electrode negative) polarity produces less weld penetration, because more arc energy is focused into the electrode and not into the base plate."

    Now, what Lincoln just said is contradictory to what I've read from posters and does seem to support what Miller says.

    Either way, my entire point here concerns welding 3/8" material with my welder. The "idiot" plaque inside the door lists single pass thickness only up to 5/16" inch for either FCAW or GMAW processes. 3/8" single pass is only listed for the stick process with 1/8" E6011 electrodes. :-( Interestingly, the FCAW setting for single pass on 5/16" calls for 0.045 wire, yet in the FCAW setup screen on my welder, there is no option for 045 wire, only 025, 030, and 035. A little confused on that.

    So, either I get out the electrode holder and start practicing stick welding, or I figure out how to set the welder to 045 wire and trust that weld strength on 3/8" material will be enough.

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