Reply to Thread

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Emailed you the machine and engine manuals.

Re: Hobart g213 welder

I have work on Wisconsin without any manual. I only a parts manual.
I like the G213 welder it give great weld.

Dave

Originally Posted by Bigguy01

Hey🙂any one have a Hobart G-213 tjd Wisconsin operator maintenance manual. Mine is running unable to tune to load rpm not sure of carb rebuilt carb yet unable to set .help please. I am able to burn rod on it but due to low rpm 👎

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Hey🙂any one have a Hobart G-213 tjd Wisconsin operator maintenance manual. Mine is running unable to tune to load rpm not sure of carb rebuilt carb yet unable to set .help please. I am able to burn rod on it but due to low rpm 👎

Re: Hobart g213 welder

I install a 12 volt start and ring gear.

Dave

Originally Posted by forhire

I suspect the use of jumper cables was common. I looked at the schematic and I don't see any connection between the engine battery and the generator/welder. I burned some 6011 and 10018 last night without issue.

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Originally Posted by smithdoor

I installed a 12 volt start on the one had so use the pickup battery.
Just used a set of jumper cables.

But think it was a option for 24 volt in 1978.

I suspect the use of jumper cables was common. I looked at the schematic and I don't see any connection between the engine battery and the generator/welder. I burned some 6011 and 10018 last night without issue.

Re: Hobart g213 welder

I installed a 12 volt start on the one had so use the pickup battery.
Just used a set of jumper cables.

But think it was a option for 24 volt in 1978.

Dave

Originally Posted by forhire

School me on the battery requirements for the G213. If I recall the Wisconsin engine manual stated a battery is required when using the 12V regulator to prevent damage. Obviously a lot of these engines are hand crank start. Looking at photos of the machines online it appears the G213 used either one or two batteries (12V or 24V) and based on the common mount location it appears the machine didn't have a starter mounted. Often the batteries are mounted where the starter should be. So does the G213 use the batteries for the generator field winding?

This afternoon, before giving it much thought, I mounted a small motorcycle battery to replace the old battery that has been flopping around loose all this time. It's only 220 CCA but appears to start the machine without any issues. I haven't welded with it yet but I can't imagine it wouldn't work as the only scrap battery I've been using was barely up to the task.

I pocketed a scrap piece of HDPE the battery and bolted it down using a couple existing 1/4-20 holes in the frame. I still need to decide on a strap but it appears to ride fine as is. I'm thinking a velcro strap would be enough. I honestly cannot figure out where the battery was mounted originally unless the battery tray was above the starter. Even the little motorcycle battery hangs over the frame.

I guess my real questions is if I really need a full size battery or can I use this tiny motorcycle battery?

Attachment 1742969
Attachment 1742970

Re: Hobart g213 welder

School me on the battery requirements for the G213. If I recall the Wisconsin engine manual stated a battery is required when using the 12V regulator to prevent damage. Obviously a lot of these engines are hand crank start. Looking at photos of the machines online it appears the G213 used either one or two batteries (12V or 24V) and based on the common mount location it appears the machine didn't have a starter mounted. Often the batteries are mounted where the starter should be. So does the G213 use the batteries for the generator field winding?

This afternoon, before giving it much thought, I mounted a small motorcycle battery to replace the old battery that has been flopping around loose all this time. It's only 220 CCA but appears to start the machine without any issues. I haven't welded with it yet but I can't imagine it wouldn't work as the only scrap battery I've been using was barely up to the task.

I pocketed a scrap piece of HDPE the battery and bolted it down using a couple existing 1/4-20 holes in the frame. I still need to decide on a strap but it appears to ride fine as is. I'm thinking a velcro strap would be enough. I honestly cannot figure out where the battery was mounted originally unless the battery tray was above the starter. Even the little motorcycle battery hangs over the frame.

I guess my real questions is if I really need a full size battery or can I use this tiny motorcycle battery?

Attachment 1742969
Attachment 1742970

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Cool on the rig..

Fine adjust needs to be in the max range to generate full AC output.. Best to start in Minimum fine setting, and in switch in the welding mode for lees load when starting.Little details are coming back slowly,just from owning other machines..

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Originally Posted by Brand X

PS,fine voltage control is working very well,a lot of range in each gear..only one I did not try is low gear.. #2 runs 3/32 rod well

Glad to hear you have it working well. I expect my fine adjust will normalize after I've put a few hours on it. I think it just needs to wear through the oxide layer. I've been really busy on some other projects. I did find some time on Saturday to pickup a new welding rig for the old Hobart.

It hadn't run for 8 years so I picked it up cheap. Believe it or not it started right up after I got it home and put it on the charger. Gotta love diesel.

Attachment 1725816

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Cool,
the lugs are handy. Ran my LN-25 Pro with .035/45 Easb/Hobart Self-shielded flux-core, and some Esab .045 dual-shield with co2.. That worked ok but really the .035 self-shielded had the most range. It's not quite the same as having CV, but has some use. Still nice stick arc, and what it is about..Ran about a tank of gas through it, had some stumbles early on, float/seat must of had a bit of gunk in it was running a bit rich. cleared up, and was able to use a few gals without issues. Holds 3 gals or so.. It was nice to see it flowed, and ran the tank down towards the bottom.. Means the fuel pump is working correct..

PS,fine voltage control is working very well,a lot of range in each gear..only one I did not try is low gear.. #2 runs 3/32 rod well

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Originally Posted by Brand X

Lugs showed up today. Welding nicer now... I think the run time on the brushes has helped.. The machine is not as old as I was told,, Still old though.. They did not even make the Wisconsin THD until 1957

My lugs showed up also.

Based on my spec # Hobart sent me a manual that was dated '73. It was newer than I expected, but sounds right because it has the 12V system rather than a magneto.

Attachment 1725027

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Lugs showed up today. Welding nicer now... I think the run time on the brushes has helped.. The machine is not as old as I was told,, Still old though.. They did not even make the Wisconsin THD until 1957

I cleaned up some of the grim off it, and it has a nice Patina, (that's staying) GW2225 is the model..
Last thing is to try my LN-25 pro on this thing.. Runs 7018/6010 nice..

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Originally Posted by John T

Those are cool.

* bookmarked for the future

Yes,
those, and the right welding helmet would complete the rig..

Friend took a vid at start up.. The high RPM welding cable rod does not stay tight, but a piece of hose sets it to the correct welding RPM.. It's the way it came, and works well enough..

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Originally Posted by Brand X

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07HB8GCJC...ing=UTF8&psc=1

Those are cool.

* bookmarked for the future

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Sounds like you did good, forhire. If needed I can take some pics of the crankshaft end with it laying on a tape measure for scale. I just welded a piece of 1" shaft down on the frame with a hole drilled for an implement pin to prevent it from bouncing off. Of course if it bounced that high it would probably wipe out the ceramic insulators I previously mentioned. That and the unfused 120v seems to be the only Achille's heels in this machine.

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Originally Posted by Brand X

The power HZ is running about 62 hz unloaded, and fall to a bit over 58 HZ with a 13 amp draw on the 120 volt leg.. Not sure if that is correct, but close enough for drills grinders/etc.. Main thing it does work as a welding machine.

I ended up cleaning my air cleaner in the parts washer. It cleaned up real nice. I installed it, topped up the oil, and it didn't run away so I must have it right. Like you I'm running about around 62 Hz unloaded. I'd expect on a machine this size to see some fluctuation +/- 5% which doesn't worry me in the least. The manual says you can use the AC power while welding but the frequency is all over the place, even then I doubt a grinder would be bothered.

Years ago I had a 4" grinder that had the cooling fan explode, I sent it back to Milwaukee for warranty repair, but after the repair it didn't run as fast when I tested it. Later I was using it and it was going great until the fan exploded again. That's when it dawned on my to check the outlet voltage... yup it was wired to a wild leg, which is something like 208V to neutral. Crazy thing, that was my favorite grinder... when it was running on the wild leg.

I paid $75 bucks for this machine. I spent may be another $150 bucks on parts, cleaners, and etc. Out of pocket I did fine.

I'm thinking about making a handle for mine. Here is my initial design.
Attachment 1724788

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Got my air filter somewhat cleaned, but at least it's hooked up now.. Put in fresh oil in the crankcase too.. Only need to sort the other 120 volt side on this rig.. Voltage is about the same as yours now. I can run a 13 amp test saw, and grinder off of the rig, and it welds nice the little bit I did.. Fine control works I was at 3 tap and max fine for some 1/8 stainless rod i tried,, Maybe 130 amps, but need to meter it test where things are for sure..The power HZ is running about 62 hz unloaded, and fall to a bit over 58 HZ with a 13 amp draw on the 120 volt leg.. Not sure if that is correct, but close enough for drills grinders/etc.. Main thing it does work as a welding machine..

Just going to clean the sludge off the engine, and use it here, and there.. The inverter stick machines I have are excellent, but using the old tech 1945 machine is satisfying in it's own way..Maybe I will hook up my LN-25 pro feeder, and make it high tech after all.


Price is whatever some old farmer will give you for it.. I paid $500 for mine, but only because I can make payments over time.. It was the guy's fathers rig, and he was moving to Idaho the next day.. I probably would of forked out no more then $200-300 if I had to come up with cash right then.. I am guessing I am sitting on a $600 rig right now, with a chance to get a bit more out of it with the right buyer.. I know I bought a AEHD 200 Miller for $800 that was a pretty good shape old gal. That was 14 years ago, and it would sell for more then that now,, I had one of the first ranger 305 g machines, and it was a pretty nice rig.. In some ways the crank start Hobart more enjoyable to own. Not selling it either.

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Originally Posted by Brand X

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07HB8GCJC...ing=UTF8&psc=1

Thanks for the link, I added them to my cart.

I buttoned up the machine this morning. I set the timing with the light, but honestly it likely wasn't needed, I was pretty darn near dead on before I started, just by ear. I set my high and low throttle stops and adjusted the governor linkage. If you recall I had to make a new linkage and I was fretting the adjustments but the adjustments turned out to be super simple. I put on the sheet metal and installed the oil bath air cleaner... but not before tripping over it and spilling the oil on the apron in front of the shop.

Last night I really had to put the muscle to the DC lugs to get them free. The were super rusted on. This morning I zinc plated what was left of the nuts, chased the lugs with a die, and gave them a quick slather of nickel anti-seize before throwing on an old set of leads. That should keep them easy to remove.

Luckily, after all this hard work, it burns rod just fine. I have some dead spots in the fine adjust rheostat but I'm thinking it will clear up with use. I may hit it with a brush next time I have the cover off. I still need to install some fuses.

Thanks for all the help. I don't think I would have been able to turn it around so quickly without the manuals and assistance. I definitely have learned a lot. It has been fun. Now I'm itching to try it side by side the Trailblazer 300D.

What do you figure a running machine, with the current patina, is worth? I'm not looking to sell it. Just curious if I came out upside down. Of course the education was worth every penny. It's been fun.

Attachment 1724770

Re: Hobart g213 welder

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07HB8GCJC...ing=UTF8&psc=1

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Originally Posted by Brand X

Good job.and be sure to see how it welds..

I have mine running again.. Just ditched the leaking fuel bowl filter for a in-line one for now.. The tank cleaned out nice with Vinegar/bolt/nuts rinse..Just need to change the oil, and pick up a hose for the air-filter to carb.. Mine does not seem to need any carb work Also a couple of lugs to setup my welding leads.. I have all dinse, and no where to be found on this unit.. I don't think dinse was born yet..

PS, no paint just all patina

I should have it welding in the morning. I took a bit of muscle to break the DC lugs free. Once again I was wishing I had a mini-ductor. I think I have a set of leads to try it. I'll eventually put some dinse connectors on it. The original patina is kinda growing on me.

Originally Posted by mla2ofus

I've been told by ones who know to not overload the unfused 120v circuit as it leaks the smoke out very easily.

I think I'll add some fuses. I've been comparing my schematic with the later fused models and it appears to be a straightforward modification. The manual states a 12 amp limit but it's fused 15 amps. 3kW is about 13.5 amps... if my quick math is right. 15 amps is right at 125%. Not sure if it should be fused at 12 amps or 15 amps.

Originally Posted by ronsii

Sounds like it would behoove you to add one of the cheap push button breakers of whatever the output is supposed to be rated at.
Glad to hear about the broken wire... I like those kinds of fixes

That's a great idea. Quick and easy install.

Originally Posted by Brand X

Mine welds nice, just lacking on the 120 volt output..(90-91 volts 60 HZ) Really only one side outputs from what I can tell.. The welder part handle the load, and the switch part works. Not like a Miller AEAD because you still have to set the High RPM welding speed with the throttle, It just adjusts for welding load with the switch in the welding mode setting.

Looking at schematic the switch appears to simply load a couple 100 ohm resistors, one has a variable tap. Likely to help balance the generator when making AC only power. We'll see how it does after I get it timed, it took a while to find my timing light. And after I set the hi/low rpm.

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Mine welds nice, just lacking on the 120 volt output..(90-91 volts 60 HZ) Really only one side outputs from what I can tell.. The welder part handle the load, and the switch part works. Not like a Miller AEAD because you still have to set the High RPM welding speed with the throttle, It just adjusts for welding load with the switch in the welding mode setting.

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Originally Posted by forhire

I have the 12V charging system sorted out. After testing the stator coil, rectifier, and regulator, and them all testing good, I found a broken wire on the ammeter. I am very happy. I priced out the YJ-58 rectifier and the YJ-60 regulator last night and was fearing the worst.

I sent Hobart my spec number (4130C) and they supplied me with the correct manual. I have now confirmed this vintage doesn't have any fuses on the AC output.

I'm almost ready for paint.

Sounds like it would behoove you to add one of the cheap push button breakers of whatever the output is supposed to be rated at.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/5A-10A-15A-...wAAOSwPF9cbZ9d
Attachment 1724700


Glad to hear about the broken wire... I like those kinds of fixes

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Originally Posted by forhire

I have the 12V charging system sorted out. After testing the stator coil, rectifier, and regulator, and them all testing good, I found a broken wire on the ammeter. I am very happy. I priced out the YJ-58 rectifier and the YJ-60 regulator last night and was fearing the worst.

I sent Hobart my spec number (4130C) and they supplied me with the correct manual. I have now confirmed this vintage doesn't have any fuses on the AC output.

I'm almost ready for paint.

I've been told by ones who know to not overload the unfused 120v circuit as it leaks the smoke out very easily.

Re: Hobart g213 welder

Good job.and be sure to see how it welds..

I have mine running again.. Just ditched the leaking fuel bowl filter for a in-line one for now.. The tank cleaned out nice with Vinegar/bolt/nuts rinse..Just need to change the oil, and pick up a hose for the air-filter to carb.. Mine does not seem to need any carb work Also a couple of lugs to setup my welding leads.. I have all dinse, and no where to be found on this unit.. I don't think dinse was born yet..

PS, no paint just all patina

Re: Hobart g213 welder

I have the 12V charging system sorted out. After testing the stator coil, rectifier, and regulator, and them all testing good, I found a broken wire on the ammeter. I am very happy. I priced out the YJ-58 rectifier and the YJ-60 regulator last night and was fearing the worst.

I sent Hobart my spec number (4130C) and they supplied me with the correct manual. I have now confirmed this vintage doesn't have any fuses on the AC output.

I'm almost ready for paint.