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Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by E T

These are not some cheap shackles from home depot. I used to be a trucker in heavy haulage for 25 years and collected a lot of rigging equipment over the years. I have a fair collection of shackles ranging from 1 to 12 tons. The ones I'm using for this are 1/2" rated for 2 tons.
I did a bit of research and these are probably not alloy steel, but very likely quenched and tempered. The alloy 1/2" ones are rated at 3.3 tons.
But that is all academic now because I made some proper shackle mounts.



Attachment 1689806

Attachment 1689807

Attachment 1689808

They can double as recovery point on my Land Rover.


Eric

Those would double as recovery hooks for your M60 tank[emoji79]


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Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by E T

These are not some cheap shackles from home depot. I used to be a trucker in heavy haulage for 25 years and collected a lot of rigging equipment over the years. I have a fair collection of shackles ranging from 1 to 12 tons. The ones I'm using for this are 1/2" rated for 2 tons.
I did a bit of research and these are probably not alloy steel, but very likely quenched and tempered. The alloy 1/2" ones are rated at 3.3 tons.
But that is all academic now because I made some proper shackle mounts.



Attachment 1689806

Attachment 1689807

Attachment 1689808

They can double as recovery point on my Land Rover.


Eric

That is exactly what I would have done, very nice work

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by Louie1961

You keep saying tempered steel. I am willing to bet those shackles are not tempered. They are forged but not tempered, would be my guess. I am pretty sure the small, galvanized ones are just mild steel.

These are not some cheap shackles from home depot. I used to be a trucker in heavy haulage for 25 years and collected a lot of rigging equipment over the years. I have a fair collection of shackles ranging from 1 to 12 tons. The ones I'm using for this are 1/2" rated for 2 tons.
I did a bit of research and these are probably not alloy steel, but very likely quenched and tempered. The alloy 1/2" ones are rated at 3.3 tons.
But that is all academic now because I made some proper shackle mounts.



Attachment 1689806

Attachment 1689807

Attachment 1689808

They can double as recovery point on my Land Rover.


Eric

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

tempered steel to mild

You keep saying tempered steel. I am willing to bet those shackles are not tempered. They are forged but not tempered, would be my guess. I am pretty sure the small, galvanized ones are just mild steel.

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

ttoks, I took Your advice and made two proper shackle mounts.

I'll post some pics in the "what did you weld today" topic when it's all finished and painted.

Eric

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by E T

Me falling on my *** is the least of my worries mate. When the kids start playing with it, and You know what they are like, I don't want a weld to fail.
I'm leaning towards the 312 rods which I have on hand.
Are You sure about the 400 degree perheat? The shackles are 1/2" thick. 400 F seems a bit much. I did some searching on the internet and for tempered steel less than 1" I found 50 F as minimum preheat.

Eric

400F is what all engineered (meaning pre bought for the purpose of lifting) anchor's and lifting points have been preheated to my entier career, it might just being the types we use here in aus, but even the small ones get a hit with the oxy until they'll melt a 350F heat stick, but really as long as you don't overheat it by going over say 500F it will help greatly with slowing the cooling of the weld and so help in preventing cracking.

I personally would just make an anchor out of mild steel, it's plenty strong enough and isn't going to crack, and I see cracking as being the only likely failure mode for what you're making, and if you're set on using the anchors give it some pre-heat..

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by shovelon

LOL. It is funny that he did not mention that it was they that call it not by 312, but by "Lincoln's All Purpose Maintenance Filler". For years I did not know what it was. I got a huge batch of it in 1/16" tig length from an auction and thought it would be compatible to 304 and welded steamers with it. Not until an old salesman happened by and told me what it was. By that time it was discontinued.

I thought you'd appreciate that little bit of humor

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by ttoks

As a disclaimer, my experience with cast anchors is purely in an industrial setting, so this is probably way overkill.

with that said, the most common problem I've run into with them is cracking due to lack of pre heat, and once cast anything cracks it's lost 99% of it's strength, and any stress loading will take that last 1% over time, what its welded with (meaning specific rods, as long as its ductile and you're not trying to weld it with 12018 or something), but I would suggest some nice dry 7018 rods if stick welding, or just weld it with mig which is inherently low hydrogen.

Honestly I'd just stick some bits of mild steel together instead.

But I am biased, I've seen cast anchors fail mid lift quite a few times, the vessel dropped on the Ichthys LNG project in darwin being the biggest, and what I'm suggesting is probably way overkill for a hammock, but I would pre-heat to about 400 degree's if I were using cast anchors for anything, the consequences in this case are that you land on your *** one day while sipping a beer and enjoying the sun, but still.

Me falling on my *** is the least of my worries mate. When the kids start playing with it, and You know what they are like, I don't want a weld to fail.
I'm leaning towards the 312 rods which I have on hand.
Are You sure about the 400 degree perheat? The shackles are 1/2" thick. 400 F seems a bit much. I did some searching on the internet and for tempered steel less than 1" I found 50 F as minimum preheat.

Eric

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by MinnesotaDave

Lincoln even made a little video on it

LOL. It is funny that he did not mention that it was they that call it not by 312, but by "Lincoln's All Purpose Maintenance Filler". For years I did not know what it was. I got a huge batch of it in 1/16" tig length from an auction and thought it would be compatible to 304 and welded steamers with it. Not until an old salesman happened by and told me what it was. By that time it was discontinued.

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by shovelon

312 all the way. Whenever I have solidification cracking issues with 309 I solve it with the higher performance 312. It's no wonder Lincoln marketed 312 as their "All Purpose Maintenance Filler".

Lincoln even made a little video on it

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by E T

When I chill in the thing with a cold beer the load will be static. But when the kids start using it as a swing that will change to dynamic.


I do have a box of 312 rods. It should give a very ductile and crack resistant weld. I was just wondering if it was the better option for welding tempered steel to mild.


Eric

312 all the way. Whenever I have solidification cracking issues with 309 I solve it with the higher performance 312. It's no wonder Lincoln marketed 312 as their "All Purpose Maintenance Filler".

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by Louie1961

I'd just use 7018, and not worry about it. your body weight is not going to crack those welds.

When I chill in the thing with a cold beer the load will be static. But when the kids start using it as a swing that will change to dynamic.


I do have a box of 312 rods. It should give a very ductile and crack resistant weld. I was just wondering if it was the better option for welding tempered steel to mild.


Eric

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by Meltedmetal

I'd probably just drill a series of holes in the 3/8" mild steel & turn it on edge and move the shackle for adjustment.

I thought about cutting two schackle mounts from the same 3/8 plaat and welding those to base plates, but that is more work.
Welding on a strip with holes on edge is an option but I already cut and drilled the 3/8 plates for what I have in mind.
I used square tube for the frame and was planning to clamp the schackle mount to the uprights with 4 M8 bolts. This way I can adjust it to any height I want/need.

Eric

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

I'd probably just drill a series of holes in the 3/8" mild steel & turn it on edge and move the shackle for adjustment.

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by Louie1961

I'd just use 7018

Working on the water all my life. A lot of our derricks used 10-ton anchors. We would weld a mild steel pad eye to the back of the anchor to attach the crown buoy wire rope to, so the anchor scow could pick the anchors for us. We used a rose bud to preheat the anchor. Welded the pad eye with 7018, and wrapped the pad eye with insulation for a slow cool down.

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

I'd just use 7018, and not worry about it. your body weight is not going to crack those welds.

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by rexcormack

Wouldn't the anchor "shackles" the op is talking about be forged steel instead of cast?
My guess is he is talking about small anchors like for a small sailboat or ski boat.

My bad. You're probably right. forged not cast.
And for the record. I'm not talking about anchorchain schackles, but anchor-shackle like in D-shackle but with a slightly different form.

Eric

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Wouldn't the anchor "shackles" the op is talking about be forged steel instead of cast?
My guess is he is talking about small anchors like for a small sailboat or ski boat.

Re: Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Originally Posted by E T

Hi guys,

I'm building a hammock stand so I can relax in the shade in this hot summer.
I'm making adjustable mounting points for the hammock and for those I was thinking of welding some old two ton anchor schakles to 3/8 mild steel plate.

As far as I know the shackles are tempered cast steel. Heavely galvanized. I will grind that off and make a bevel on both sides.
What is the best rod to weld them to the mild steel plate? 7018 or 312L-16? And with or without preheat?


Eric

As a disclaimer, my experience with cast anchors is purely in an industrial setting, so this is probably way overkill.

with that said, the most common problem I've run into with them is cracking due to lack of pre heat, and once cast anything cracks it's lost 99% of it's strength, and any stress loading will take that last 1% over time, what its welded with (meaning specific rods, as long as its ductile and you're not trying to weld it with 12018 or something), but I would suggest some nice dry 7018 rods if stick welding, or just weld it with mig which is inherently low hydrogen.

Honestly I'd just stick some bits of mild steel together instead.

But I am biased, I've seen cast anchors fail mid lift quite a few times, the vessel dropped on the Ichthys LNG project in darwin being the biggest, and what I'm suggesting is probably way overkill for a hammock, but I would pre-heat to about 400 degree's if I were using cast anchors for anything, the consequences in this case are that you land on your *** one day while sipping a beer and enjoying the sun, but still.

Welding anchor shackle to mild steel.

Hi guys,

I'm building a hammock stand so I can relax in the shade in this hot summer.
I'm making adjustable mounting points for the hammock and for those I was thinking of welding some old two ton anchor schakles to 3/8 mild steel plate.

As far as I know the shackles are tempered cast steel. Heavely galvanized. I will grind that off and make a bevel on both sides.
What is the best rod to weld them to the mild steel plate? 7018 or 312L-16? And with or without preheat?


Eric