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Thread: Another electrical shock / safety question:

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    Question Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Beginner on a Hobart Handler 140 but I have an electrical background (electronics tech in the USN). I am very safety conscious and have a healthy respect for electricity. I always glove-up and turn the machine off every time I need to make an adjustment. Then I see a guy in this Youtube video handling the metal bare-handed while welding (time 1:26-1:40) and I don't understand how he not taking a shock. I have to ask:

    - Would you feel safe doing this?

    - Do many of you Mig like this?




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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    I can't see your video, but I do all the time. I wear gloves to avoid sunburn. Shock is rare, I only avoid being in a place where I'll be shocked. I consider welder shock to be unpleasant, not life threatening.

    My opinion. I'm not saying it should be your opinion.
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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Nothing to worry about, I do it all the time.
    You are welding with low voltage DC, pretty rare to get shocked with mig - can't remember ever having it happen.

    Now with AC stick welding I've been shocked several times when damp - mostly an annoyance.
    DC stick welding you can get zapped too - I just haven't yet.
    Tig is easy to get zapped with due to high frequency start and stabilization.


    Also unnecessary to shut off a machine to make adjustments to it. It needs to run for the fan cooling anyway.
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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Road trip, the skin on a human body has a natural resistance to around 50V. Thus, unless your hands are wet you can safely tough lower voltage items w/o getting shocked. Most welding equipment welds at a voltage much lower than 50V.

    In Telecom, 48VDC is commonly used to power switching and cell site equipment. Most folks can safely handle both wires simultaneously w/o getting shocked.
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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quote Originally Posted by scsmith42 View Post

    In Telecom, 48VDC is commonly used to power switching and cell site equipment. Most folks can safely handle both wires simultaneously w/o getting shocked.
    True, but the ringer pulse can light you up. ask me how I know
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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quote Originally Posted by MinnesotaDave View Post
    Nothing to worry about, I do it all the time.
    You are welding with low voltage DC, pretty rare to get shocked with mig - can't remember ever having it happen.
    Also unnecessary to shut off a machine to make adjustments to it. It needs to run for the fan cooling anyway.
    The kind of info I'm looking for. Thx MinnesotaDave and everyone who has replied.

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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    The reason the guy in the video didn't get bit is he wasn't making himself part of the electrical path from the gun/stinger and the ground/ earth. If you want to experience it just spit in your hand and hold a 7018 rod in the stinger w/ that hand and touch the work piece with the other hand. You are now part of the electrical path!!
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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quote Originally Posted by frieed View Post
    True, but the ringer pulse can light you up. ask me how I know
    So can a lawnmower ignition coil, like when the plug is fouled/shorted, so you take it off and hold on to the spark plug wire.
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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Agree with what was said above...low voltage (16-28v generally), DC not AC, not making himself part of the circuit. The other thing to remember is the gun is only energized while you pull the trigger on most models. So no need to turn the machine off really. Wearing gloves to prevent shock in this case would be like wearing gloves when changing a car battery to prevent shock.
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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quote Originally Posted by frieed View Post
    True, but the ringer pulse can light you up. ask me how I know
    Quote Originally Posted by Oldendum View Post
    So can a lawnmower ignition coil, like when the plug is fouled/shorted, so you take it off and hold on to the spark plug wire.
    One of the unfortunate ones to experience both
    ...and I've been shocked numerous times by 120v and 240v AC when I used to run propane. Digging is dangerous when people don't put power down as deep as code
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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldendum View Post
    So can a lawnmower ignition coil, like when the plug is fouled/shorted, so you take it off and hold on to the spark plug wire.
    Been there too. Cursing always follows.

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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quote Originally Posted by RoadTrip View Post
    Beginner on a Hobart Handler 140 but I have an electrical background (electronics tech in the USN). I am very safety conscious and have a healthy respect for electricity. I always glove-up and turn the machine off every time I need to make an adjustment. Then I see a guy in this Youtube video handling the metal bare-handed while welding (time 1:26-1:40) and I don't understand how he not taking a shock. I have to ask:

    - Would you feel safe doing this?

    - Do many of you Mig like this?



    No, I dont mig like this- or do any sort of welding like that. Id be more worried about no hand and eye protection.

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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quote Originally Posted by frieed View Post
    True, but the ringer pulse can light you up. ask me how I know
    Especially if you are stripping the wire with your teeth
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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quick tacks with a Mig welder - just position the nozzle, close your eyes, bump the trigger, move on.

    Not a big deal.

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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    If this bothers you, you should check out Allen's channel. The guy is a maestro as far as I am concerned, but his welding without gloves or a hood kind of makes me worried for him LOL

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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quote Originally Posted by kize View Post
    Id be more worried about no hand and eye protection.
    I use eye protection with everything. I had a chief in the Navy who, if he caught us without glasses, would say:
    "They're only your eyes. Go ahead and f**k 'em up!"

    I think of this line every time I use the wire wheel on my grinder.

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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    You can really feel it on HF start on a TIG, but that's low current. Higher frequency really increases the ability take multiple paths to ground. Don't be one of those paths. Get up into radio frequencies and you don't even need to make contact to get burnt. DC is zero frequency.

    I always always wear gloves, but just to limit burns and cuts. I usually just use those stretchy disposable aramid yarn ones that are rubber coated, and switch to heavy leather stuff only when I'm at very high amps.
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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quote Originally Posted by bigb View Post
    Especially if you are stripping the wire with your teeth
    I thought I was the only one dumb enough to get zapped like that.
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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    If you hold onto a rod in one hand and the ground with bare hands you will get zapped. Your hand doesn't have to be wet. One of the 1st things learning welding is the voltage won't kill you. The teacher made everyone do this. Several years later I asked him if he still did it and he said no because he got zapped really bad one time. The reason you don't get zapped holding a piece is the same reason multiple welders can be used on the same weldment. Electricity takes the shortest path and you aren't part of that circuit.

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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Being wet dosent do much, but when you're sweaty 65+ volts of a stick welder will get you pretty good.

    Clean water is an insulator, add salt and you can flow lots of current even at low voltages.

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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quote Originally Posted by Chad86tsi View Post
    You can really feel it on HF start on a TIG, but that's low current. Higher frequency really increases the ability take multiple paths to ground. Don't be one of those paths. Get up into radio frequencies and you don't even need to make contact to get burnt. DC is zero frequency.

    I always always wear gloves, but just to limit burns and cuts. I usually just use those stretchy disposable aramid yarn ones that are rubber coated, and switch to heavy leather stuff only when I'm at very high amps.
    If you put the high frequency to something like an ungrounded aluminum hand rail of a certain size the person holding the handrail may not be able to remove his hands from that rail, because his hands are locked onto it and tearing the tendons in his arms. Of this I am sure.


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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    There is a thread I have going in the welding processes forum on repairing a Century 80 flux core machine. The welder over-heated last summer during a big project. After the unintentional thermal event I noticed a shock from the unit when plugged in, not even on. It still welded so I left it alone (not really a smart idea). I had to get through my project and that required a cross-country trip to some cabins to finish the job there also. I just kept on keepin' on with what I had how I had it.

    When I opened up the machine and started working on it I found the hot wire from the input cable had melted in to the wire connection that goes to the torch. The shock I was getting was the hot 120v line back-feeding through the secondary to the work clamp.

    Aside from that predicament (a melt down causing a problem) - I have never had a shock from welding with equipment in good maintenance.

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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    If you do get shocked from welding equipment. Get a digital multi-meter and try to measure the voltage. test both AC and DC volts. The voltage amount and whether its AC or DC. Will tell a repairman where to look for the problem, if it is a problem.
    Test at the two contact points you were shocked from.
    Like the measurement is 40 VAC This could be an open ground. On some welders the case will float about 40VAC above ground, if the case is not connected to earth ground. Some TIG welders split the OCV to ground so neither weld terminal is to high. above ground.

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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    Quote Originally Posted by 2strokeforever View Post
    Being wet dosent do much, but when you're sweaty 65+ volts of a stick welder will get you pretty good.

    Clean water is an insulator, add salt and you can flow lots of current even at low voltages.
    Actually water forms a capacitor with your body and whatever is charged. That is why it is dangerous. It can cause your body to charge in a different way than it would if it were grounded by your feet to the floor.

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    Re: Another electrical shock / safety question:

    It is rubber shoes maybe socks the list goes on.
    But remember it luck on not getting shocked.

    I treat all electrical as live and will kill.

    I have work with 480 volts.
    Even welding power I treat as it can kill.

    I work with power safely since 1960's

    Work safe
    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by RoadTrip View Post
    Beginner on a Hobart Handler 140 but I have an electrical background (electronics tech in the USN). I am very safety conscious and have a healthy respect for electricity. I always glove-up and turn the machine off every time I need to make an adjustment. Then I see a guy in this Youtube video handling the metal bare-handed while welding (time 1:26-1:40) and I don't understand how he not taking a shock. I have to ask:

    - Would you feel safe doing this?

    - Do many of you Mig like this?




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