Help with rusting stainless posts

[psacustomcreations]

Got it. Dropping off an art piece now. I will send it after lunch

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[walker]

Next time use 316L and don’t clear coat. This time you are going to have to remove the clear, then use one of the many chemicals for cleaning and (not normalizing, but I can’t think of the right word) stainless steels. Afterward don’t re clear. If you can remove the cables you can use an inline body file and 80 grit or so sandpaper, then use the chemical to treat it.

[walker]

The word is passivation, look for a chemical to pass I ate the SS after you work it.

[MetalMan23]

I just had a friend who's been doing cable rails for years have the same problem, pretty sure he uses 316, he says not much can take being right next to the ocean

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[MetalMan23]

Thanks psa,

I'll be using 316 from now on I guess, I really hope this customer doesn't stop using me for cable rails, it was kind of a new thing for me, I guess I'm learning.



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[ezduzit]

The photos give the appearance that the stainless posts have been worked using tools previously contaminated by having been used on steel.

[MetalMan23]

The photos give the appearance that the stainless posts have been worked using tools previously contaminated by having been used on steel.

That's also a possibility, I wasn't as careful as I should have been to prevent scratching on my table,

I need to make a stainless or aluminum Fab table to work with stainless on. Also there's a chance I used abrasives not used exclusively for stainless

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[ezduzit]

...there's a chance I used abrasives not used exclusively for stainless...

That is almost certainly where the problem developed.

[psacustomcreations]

Thanks psa,

I'll be using 316 from now on I guess, I really hope this customer doesn't stop using me for cable rails, it was kind of a new thing for me, I guess I'm learning.



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No Problem. I hope the acid helps.

[l0w n slow]

Thanks psa,

I'll be using 316 from now on I guess, I really hope this customer doesn't stop using me for cable rails, it was kind of a new thing for me, I guess I'm learning.



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I do not understand , I wouldn't switch materials . 304 is quite a bit cheaper then 316 is just overkill . Use the right drill bits . And don't contaminate the stainless and it won't rust .

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[BD1]

Contamination was pretty common in our pipe shop. Now everything is dedicated for Stainless Steel only.
Cutting and grinding wheels are for Stainless Steel. A few $$ more but worth it. Same with using Stainless Steel wire brush or wheels. All are stamped Stainless Steel
These little things make the difference.


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[Kelvin]

Generally, any abrasives on any stainless steel are going to be inviting problems due to condensation and crevice corrosion. What happens, at a microscopic level, is that you get galvanic corrosion between the dissimilar metals in the alloy (iron, chrome, nickel) in the crevices or microscopic scratches whenever they get wet with any kind of electrolyte, and even rain or dew will be an electrolyte if there's any CO2 dissolved in it. Sandpaper, wire wheels, etc are bad juju...you want a polished finish (think: jeweller's rouge) to try to fight crevice corrosion.

[walker]

Whenever I work SS I put a sheet of aluminum on the table to protect the SS from the steel.

[Brett]

So perhaps this is because I used 304 stainless, perhaps it's the way I drilled the holes, perhaps it's the finish on the stainless, anyway, I'm in trouble and I need to figure out how to fix this pretty fast,

I clear coated the posts after fabrication, I thought that would help.

I would prefer to not have to replace everything here and lose a bunch of money.,

Any ideas? Could I clean it well and coat with a 2k clear?

Clear powder coat?

If I used 316 would it have made a difference?

I've seen other cable rails that are rusted out as well after years, the problem with mine is that it's only been a few months,

Hey MetalMan23,
Your problem is simply that you have used 304 in an external , marine environment.
Yes 316 is the only alloy to use in this application (well maybe 2205,317 and 31803) , it also where ever possible should be gloss.
There's not much you can do . Except rack this one up to experience.
The hard part is you probably got a lot of pressure from the client to be economical and its not always easy to stand up to clients , the good news it gets easier with a few more years under your belt and the more grey hairs you have the more the client will be willing to listen to your point of view .
The tarnish seems to be localized at the holes . That could be contamination during fab but lets face it unless your using cobalt or Nicad drill bits they are all HSS , we have no dramas with HSS bits contaminating .
I suspect its coming from the wire , what is the wire made from? if its gal piss it off . there are split grommets available for this application , we have used them but only in commercial applications to avoid fraying from clowns standing on the wire , it will however form a physical barrier , that would be from a gal wire to the proper alloy post.

As to the clean Oxalic is good but so is any quality polish and elbow grease.
Do not clear powder coat ... no .
I have never clear coated with a proprietary paint but my gut feeling is your just throwing good money after bad .
Im sorry but I do not have a cheap fix for you..

Brett

[Brett]

I do not understand , I wouldn't switch materials . 304 is quite a bit cheaper then 316 is just overkill . Use the right drill bits . And don't contaminate the stainless and it won't rust .

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That is very poor advice .
304 is not suitable for this application and environment.
Brett

[Welder Dave]

Already posted the cable was 316.

[Country Metals]

I have done quite a few projects like this before. And the right answer is to passivate or almost a mirror polish. Both work well at resisting oxidation. I passivaye as I hate spending the time to polish. It also does everything including the drill holes. A #4 brush finish is still not suitable for this application.

316 is a must for this. That 2% more nickel goes a long way.

Clear coat is crap, that's like saying I wear a hat to protect my head because I shave all my hair off.

When passivating, you must have nice clean welds or a good passivating run will eat your welds away and make it seem it's your first job out of votech.


The pictures you post makes me believe you used a steel wire wheel, steel contaminated flap disc, or a steel contaminated scotch brite pad to clean the burrs off the drill holes. Only use a dedicated stainless wire wheel that is kept clean when not in use. Not the horror freight ones either, they barely count as stainless.

The fastest way I have fired people is they will stop a flap disc on the steel table then attempt to use it on stainless. I have fired 3 people so far that did this twice in 10 minutes after being told not to do it. Your employees can cost you a fortune in rework from 5 seconds of a bad decision.

I also spray paint the handles of all my stainless wire brushes so I know if it is left out it becomes steel no matter what.


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[davec]

I have done quite a few projects like this before. And the right answer is to passivate or almost a mirror polish. Both work well at resisting oxidation. I passivate as I hate spending the time to polish. It also does everything including the drill holes. A #4 brush finish is still not suitable for this application.

316 is a must for this. That 2% more nickel goes a long way.

Clear coat is crap, that's like saying I wear a hat to protect my head because I shave all my hair off.

When passivating, you must have nice clean welds or a good passivating run will eat your welds away and make it seem it's your first job out of votech.


The pictures you post makes me believe you used a steel wire wheel, steel contaminated flap disc, or a steel contaminated scotch brite pad to clean the burrs off the drill holes. Only use a dedicated stainless wire wheel that is kept clean when not in use. Not the horror freight ones either, they barely count as stainless.

The fastest way I have fired people is they will stop a flap disc on the steel table then attempt to use it on stainless. I have fired 3 people so far that did this twice in 10 minutes after being told not to do it. Your employees can cost you a fortune in rework from 5 seconds of a bad decision.

I also spray paint the handles of all my stainless wire brushes so I know if it is left out it becomes steel no matter what.


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Bingo. Why is this so hard? No matter what you do in the shop to minimize mild steel contamination, it is almost impossible to be perfect. Heck, did your supplier deliver it on a SS truck? Was it stored on SS racks? Of course not. The only real way to address this is to first use 316 in seaside (salt) environments. Inland, 304 is fine. And Second, passivate or electropolish the final product, prior to installation. That is what the process is for!!! Get estimates before-hand and price it in. It is your reputation on the line. This is well-known and there is no reason to really debate it. Do it! I guarantee all the cable railing components are at least passivated in the factory. Ask them.

[smithdoor]

That happened with cable/wire and tubing but can be fix.

I would buy make bushings for the cable/wire to thought the post.

Dave

So perhaps this is because I used 304 stainless, perhaps it's the way I drilled the holes, perhaps it's the finish on the stainless, anyway, I'm in trouble and I need to figure out how to fix this pretty fast,

I clear coated the posts after fabrication, I thought that would help.

I would prefer to not have to replace everything here and lose a bunch of money.,

Any ideas? Could I clean it well and coat with a 2k clear?

Clear powder coat?


If I used 316 would it have made a difference?

I've seen other cable rails that are rusted out as well after years, the problem with mine is that it's only been a few months,

[ezduzit]

316 is somewhat more corrosion resistant than 304, but lots of 304 stainless is used on yachts, in a saltwater environment, without trouble, however it is usually polished.

[ronsii]

Just like HF tools... 304 is popular because it is cheaper anytime you will have chlorides exposure 316 would be the best choice... it really comes down to you get what you pay for...

[Brett]

Already posted the cable was 316.

Ah , missed that one Dave

Brett

[John T]

there are split grommets available for this application ,

Brett

Those are pretty handy.

[albrightree]

Just a quick google : https://stainlesscablerailing.com/


They don't appear to offer anything in 304, all stainless is 316 and passivated.

Nice website, lots of design, and cad stuff, pricing estimates, lots of helpful stuff.

They offer the "Stellar Solution" (citrus surfline of product for passivation, rust removal , and maintenance of stainless cable rail, and posts

Hope it works out well for you.

[MetalMan23]

So I just got another stainless job, this one is nowhere near the ocean but it is all #4 brushed finish, some bar, tubing rail, and horizontal round bar pickets, now having been through our previous conversation

Should I use 316 on everything?

The stainless is coming polished from my supplier, I'm not doing it myself, except for any areas that need welding and grinding,

I really feel like doing a sample of each alloy and letting it sit outside and spray it with salt to see what happens.



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