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Thread: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

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    Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Every so often I decide to do a project with TIG just for the hell of it to practice. (im not very good but I can weld without dipping most times now)

    My main issue is almost always rod sticking to puddle. I've tried aiming for the leading edge, as well as aiming further inward toward the center of the arc but this often will result in dipping.

    1/16" seems to run fine. Once i step it up to 3/32 it gets iffy. Usually its gonna stick, not a lot but enough to throw you off while you're welding. Still happens even if I crank it up to 200 amps which the 17 air cooled torch cant handle for long anyhow.

    This is all mild steel btw on a SW200.

    I try to keep my torch maybe 15-20 degrees off perpendicular. Tilting it a little more helps sometimes but not much.
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    What colour of tungsten are you using?
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Zapster (Steve) will tell you 1/16th filler is all you ever need for anything in his view. But if you want to make the 3/32 filler work, make sure you keep the end of your filler inside the gas envelope (i.e, not far from the tungsten) between dips. You also may have lucking stepping up a size in tungsten
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Basically if it sticks you aren't carrying a hot enough puddle to need the larger size, in my opinion.

    At 200 to 230 amps on steel I've used 3/32" and 1/8" for heavier steel projects, the 3/32" melted off nicer most times without cooling the puddle too much.
    Here is one thread where I used 200 amps, 1/8" thoriated and 3/32" filler.

    https://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthrea...highlight=#top

    This isn't always the case though, with an open root a larger filler rod is easier for me, even though it's much lower amps.
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Quote Originally Posted by Louie1961 View Post
    Zapster (Steve) will tell you 1/16th filler is all you ever need for anything in his view. But if you want to make the 3/32 filler work, make sure you keep the end of your filler inside the gas envelope (i.e, not far from the tungsten) between dips. You also may have lucking stepping up a size in tungsten
    Zap also says doesn’t matter if u keep the rod in or out of the gas stream. He says he put the rod behind his head in and out of dipping and no difference

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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBravest View Post
    Every so often I decide to do a project with TIG just for the hell of it to practice. (im not very good but I can weld without dipping most times now)

    My main issue is almost always rod sticking to puddle. I've tried aiming for the leading edge, as well as aiming further inward toward the center of the arc but this often will result in dipping.

    1/16" seems to run fine. Once i step it up to 3/32 it gets iffy. Usually its gonna stick, not a lot but enough to throw you off while you're welding. Still happens even if I crank it up to 200 amps which the 17 air cooled torch cant handle for long anyhow.

    This is all mild steel btw on a SW200.

    I try to keep my torch maybe 15-20 degrees off perpendicular. Tilting it a little more helps sometimes but not much.
    ??... move arc to rod, never not seen it melt even at 100 amps, either move rod to arc or arc to rod. if you say 100 amp arc on top of 1/16" rod and
    its not melting then no way you at 100 amps

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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    So it sounds like i should in fact just use 1/16.

    Truthfully Iím only trying to use the other stuff because I bought it and wanted to use it up...

    When I bought the machine is just said let me buy some of everything in various sizes. So now i have a few tubes.

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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBravest View Post
    When I bought the machine is just said let me buy some of everything in various sizes. So now i have a few tubes.
    OR, use the heavier stuff for the lay wire technique. Its not as pretty as dabbing, but it works well. Stick the rod in the puddle and leave it there. Push the rod in a little if you need to, to keep it in the puddle. Then just run your arc over the rod, maybe even weaving side to side a bit.
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Quote Originally Posted by WNY_TomB View Post
    ??... move arc to rod, never not seen it melt even at 100 amps, either move rod to arc or arc to rod. if you say 100 amp arc on top of 1/16" rod and
    its not melting then no way you at 100 amps
    in TIG you never attempt to melt the rod with the TIG arc, regardless of which one is moving. The rod is always melted by the puddle, even in laywire technique.
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    I prefer to use 1/16 rod for most things also. Sometimes it helps to let the puddle form up a little bit before you get moving.

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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    You also might want to let the puddle get a bit bigger -- and/or maybe back off the torch a bit to allow you to dip into the middle of the puddle, then move torch forward. If filler is sticking, either puddle wasn't big/hot enough or you're dipping into the very (shallow) edge of the puddle, and/or you're trying to melt too much of the filler in one dip, etc. Bottom line: There isn't enough heat in the puddle to keep it AND what you're adding melted. Remember that when you add filler, you're chilling the puddle because it takes heat to melt the filler, and that heat comes out of the puddle. No biggie -- you can always re-melt the puddle where it stuck, but yeah, it's easier if it doesn't stick.

    When all else fails, give it the gas and try to go faster!
    Last edited by Kelvin; 08-30-2020 at 01:25 PM.

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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    I don't think anyone has mentioned torch angle. If your torch is angled to far towards the filler you will have a harder time preventing filler from elting before it reaches the puddle.
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    i usually have rod ahead or covering joint and tig torch leaning forward a little in direction of travel. i add or push rod into puddle if needed but always some rod melting cause its there. i watch puddle make sure enough amps, usually 100 amps is plenty unless welding over 1/4" thick or trying to make a bigger weld.
    .
    never had problem melting rod. i use bigger than 1/16 if i am needing to push a alot of rod into puddle and bigger rod less length needed. obviously making a
    3/8" fillet weld be pushing a lot of 1/16 rod to make the 3/8" bead. like dont want to use 10" of rod to make a inch of weld

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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Quote Originally Posted by WNY_TomB View Post
    i usually have rod ahead or covering joint and tig torch leaning forward a little in direction of travel. i add or push rod into puddle if needed but always some rod melting cause its there. i watch puddle make sure enough amps, usually 100 amps is plenty unless welding over 1/4" thick or trying to make a bigger weld.
    .
    never had problem melting rod. i use bigger than 1/16 if i am needing to push a alot of rod into puddle and bigger rod less length needed. obviously making a
    3/8" fillet weld be pushing a lot of 1/16 rod to make the 3/8" bead. like dont want to use 10" of rod to make a inch of weld
    Sorry, looked at the thread then came back and posted later. Don't know why I thought about melting. Anyways sounds like you are dipping right at the leading edge of the puddle maybe. Try dipping further into the center of the puddle. You can create a puddle and move the tungsten back slightly when feeding rod to prevent dipping if that helps.
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Sometimes the puddle will rise to meet your tungsten if you running a little bit cool ; i.e. when your close to edge/end you don't want burn through. If your using a lincoln SW200 find some settings from one of Jodies tips and tricks videos on tig pulse. The pulse might help with your timing (some might consider it a cheat, but any tool that helps) If you have about 5lbs of wire, I'm sure you'll have it figured out after about 4 lbs.

    What type of weld is it ? Pictures help.
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Quote Originally Posted by motolife313 View Post
    Zap also says doesnít matter if u keep the rod in or out of the gas stream. He says he put the rod behind his head in and out of dipping and no difference
    Beat me to it ...
    But I have a feeling most times he is really movin...
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    When tig welding you use the rod to fill and manage heat. If the rod is to large it will cool the puddle to much and can stick in the puddle.
    So if you have the option size the rod to the heat in the puddle.

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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Quote Originally Posted by bcguide View Post
    When tig welding you use the rod to fill and manage heat. If the rod is to large it will cool the puddle to much and can stick in the puddle.
    So if you have the option size the rod to the heat in the puddle.
    Ummm ...

    Ah forget it.

    Next...
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Quote Originally Posted by bcguide View Post
    When tig welding you use the rod to fill and manage heat. If the rod is to large it will cool the puddle to much and can stick in the puddle.
    So if you have the option size the rod to the heat in the puddle.
    Quote Originally Posted by John T View Post
    Ummm ...

    Ah forget it.

    Next...
    no the bloke actually has a good point, you can control the heat carried by the weld pool with the filler rod, but it is a more advanced technique, I use it for the root run of pipe, especially smaller diameter pipe where you have to speed up as the part heat soaks, cramming rod and moving faster will quench the pool and keep it from overheating and falling out (overhead) or falling in (flat) using a size up in rod (say going from 3/32 to 1/8) can make things easier if your running hot.

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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    +1 on that. I'll use 3/32 on 1/2" pipe roots going fast. I've seen blokes use 1/16" and just about fill up the pipe with in fall before they get around.

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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Quote Originally Posted by ttoks View Post
    no the bloke actually has a good point, you can control the heat carried by the weld pool with the filler rod, but it is a more advanced technique,..
    yeah.. definitely an advanced technique.

    for the OP,
    I'd say just more practice with the foot pedal (for heat control)
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Joint geometry and heat soak come into it.

    On butt welds, especially open butt welds, there's enough spare heat to make use of 3/32 filler. On fillet welds on plate, for example, there really isn't enough heat to go around- 200 amps is bare minimum on say 1/4" plate. In that case, you get filler rod sticking and chilling the puddle too fast, no matter how good your technique IMO.

    I recently bought a pack of 3/32 to try instead of 1/16" for mild steel balustrade work (I like to TIG it rather than MIG it) and it just didn't work. Went back to 1/16".

    Might be different on stainless though, since the puddle runs a bit better for the same amps. I can't say I've tried 3/32 stainless, I use 1/16" always.

    On aluminium, 3/32" is generally a better choice all round, unless you're doing really thin stuff.

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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBravest View Post
    So it sounds like i should in fact just use 1/16.
    If you don't want to learn proper technique that's an option....but why limit yourself?

    Why not just learn to use different size filler rods properly?

    I'm far from an expert, but I don't have any problem using 3/32 or even 1/8 filler on mild steel....I just use them when they're appropriate for the work. Different size filler rods are just another tool in the toolbox.
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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)


    BrooklynBravest


    Quote Originally Posted by BrooklynBravest View Post
    Every so often I decide to do a project . . . 1/16" seems to run
    fine . . . to 3/32 it gets iffy . . .
    'Just read the entire thread' . . . boring, boring, boring . . .

    If you want to learn how to weld big [3/32] - start by welding
    small -
    master .045, than graduate down to .035 . . .

    Do this - and 3/32 is a Cake Walk . . .

    hth


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    .
    Last edited by OPUS FERRO; 09-02-2020 at 01:43 AM. Reason: . . . punc . . .

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    Re: Should I just stick to 1/16" Filler Rod? (Rod sticking)

    Personally I use .045 for everything carbon steel wise. I've used all other common diameters but I just like that size for steel. 3/32 for alli.

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