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Thread: metal pipe play helicopter

  1. #26
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Quote Originally Posted by OPUS FERRO View Post

    37ford4dr




    Any stick, on pipe this small is 'last choice' - as noted, your product is
    poor - and will do 'next to nothing' to advance your welding skills.

    Dressing [grinding] on pipe joints this small only makes things uglier.
    With proper joinery and MIG - it could have looked cast . . .

    Conversely - big kudos for original design - for the Kiddies - at an age
    when they will keep the memory of their Grandfather for life . . .

    hth


    Opus



    ps - Tear Drop's - make me weak in the knees . . .




    .
    That is not true, you can certainly ARC weld pipe that small. I have seen a lot of marine engine mounts and work stations that were welded as long as 75 years ago out of schedule 40, 80, and schedule 120 that were most certainly done with an ARC welder right in the marina. It was done with 7016 rods, and it looked great. I am sure they beveled the pipe to some degree, but far from impossible.

    Sincerely,

    William McCormick
    If I wasn't so.....crazy, I wouldn't try to act normal, and you would be afraid.

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  3. #27
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Quote Originally Posted by 37ford4dr View Post
    interesting observation, I knew I could do it with the MIG and it would look really good and be pretty fast, TIG would just take too long.
    I didnt realize that the stick welding was the last choice ( to start with) but I can tell you I certainly am living that observation and reality at this point. it was an effort getting good fitments of the tubes to each other. I look at these fun projects as just challenges to push my abilities and to learn new things, after all it just a kids toy to play in. thanks for the observations, bob

    Assuming all methods are done correctly, TIG welding in my experience can only be beaten by MIG for speed if you are doing very large objects requiring high amperage, or if something is fixtured in an assembly line. But if you look at MIG welds compared to TIG welds on pipe, in an assembly line they are not perfect by any stretch of the imagination. They are accomplished by picking the design to be MIG welded. TIG excels at small hard to weld joints just like that, because you can stop reposition and get it perfect, just keep the gas flowing until you re-start welding. All roll cages were TIG welded for many years and I would not trust my life to anything else. You just have to become proficient at TIG welding.

    Sincerely,

    William McCormick
    If I wasn't so.....crazy, I wouldn't try to act normal, and you would be afraid.

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  5. #28
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Quote Originally Posted by William McCormick View Post
    Assuming all methods are done correctly, TIG welding in my experience can only be beaten by MIG for speed if you are doing very large objects requiring high amperage, or if something is fixtured in an assembly line. But if you look at MIG welds compared to TIG welds on pipe, in an assembly line they are not perfect by any stretch of the imagination. They are accomplished by picking the design to be MIG welded. TIG excels at small hard to weld joints just like that, because you can stop reposition and get it perfect, just keep the gas flowing until you re-start welding. All roll cages were TIG welded for many years and I would not trust my life to anything else. You just have to become proficient at TIG welding.

    Sincerely,

    William McCormick
    thats an interesting observation, the hand position on all these welds was difficult for me. I am really good and fast with Mig welding .... and i am really slow with TIG welding but I bet if went the TIG route to begin with I would have no do overs, no grinding and by the end of it my TIG welding would have gotten faster. I have to make something for the other grand kids.... maybe a boat perhaps i will use all TIG welds on that project. i am still dreaming it up in my head. thanks bob
    bobs77vet/37ford4dr

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  7. #29
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    we have lights. i am working through calibrating the gauges and figuring out if i will use potentiometers to adjust the gauges or just a fixed resistor to center the needle.....i keep pegging the gauges in my attempts to calibrate them

    the two unlit lights will be connected to a momentary switch that has two positions so when you hold it it lights up


    [URL=https://app.photobucket.com/u/bobs77vet/a/2b1f5560-77c7-46bd-9e2a-a1c3a1bb9164/p/4f618a4d-a1ae-42e6-9ee1-a5d239b56b92][/UR
    bobs77vet/37ford4dr

    Eastwood digital TIG200
    HH190
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    Lincoln weldpak 100
    sears/craftsman (lincoln) 50a 240v buzz box
    O/A rig Harris gauges
    nexion cut 50 dx
    chicago electric (HF) 240v spot welder

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  9. #30
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Awesome project you have there. Glad you stuck it out with the 6013. I'm almost finished with a 10lb. can of 5/64" fleetweld 37(6013). I learned to weld stick with 6011 and 6013 on an Lincoln AC-225. I still enjoy using welding rod, not the best choice for every job, but definitely has its uses.
    Here are a few pix of a frame I made with 3/4" schedule 40 black iron. They were coped with a grinder, so they were not the tightest fit up. I didn't remove the black finish before welding. The biggest problem is getting the puddle started so it separates from the slag. You need to run it hot enough do that, but not to hot to burn through. With the 5/64" 6013 , 54 amps was good. Using 3/32" 6013, 68 amps ran very smooth when the joints were tight.


    Name:  008.jpg
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    3/32" 6013 downhill 68 amps

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    5/64" uphill 54 amps

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    5/64" downhill 58 amps

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    5/64" uphill 54 amps weave to fill big gaps

    Many people seem to dislike 6013, but a one time it was one of the most widely used welding rods on the planet. Many airframes were welded with Lincoln Planeweld 1 (6013), and Planeweld 2(10013) .

    Here are the pages from my old study book "New lessons in arc welding" this is the 1957 edition.

    Name:  planeweld1.jpg
Views: 126
Size:  137.0 KB
    Last edited by albrightree; 1 Day Ago at 05:23 PM.
    Airco 250 ac/dc Heliwelder Square wave
    Miller Synchrowave 180 sd
    Miller Econo Twin HF
    Lincoln 210 MP
    Dayton 225 ac/dc
    Victor torches
    Snap-On YA-212
    Lotos Cut60D

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  11. #31
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Name:  planeweld22.jpg
Views: 128
Size:  164.0 KB
    Airco 250 ac/dc Heliwelder Square wave
    Miller Synchrowave 180 sd
    Miller Econo Twin HF
    Lincoln 210 MP
    Dayton 225 ac/dc
    Victor torches
    Snap-On YA-212
    Lotos Cut60D

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  13. #32
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Name:  planeweld22.jpg
Views: 126
Size:  164.0 KB

    This was the aircraft version of 6013

    Name:  Fleetweld37.jpg
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    this was the standard version of 6013

    Name:  fleetweld47.jpg
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    this eventually became 7014 (not 6014) fleetweld 47


    Hope you find some good seats , and a good joystick design. thanks for posting great pix


    regards
    Airco 250 ac/dc Heliwelder Square wave
    Miller Synchrowave 180 sd
    Miller Econo Twin HF
    Lincoln 210 MP
    Dayton 225 ac/dc
    Victor torches
    Snap-On YA-212
    Lotos Cut60D

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  15. #33
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Quote Originally Posted by albrightree View Post
    Awesome project you have there. Glad you stuck it out with the 6013. I'm almost finished with a 10lb. can of 5/64" fleetweld 37(6013). I learned to weld stick with 6011 and 6013 on an Lincoln AC-225. I still enjoy using welding rod, not the best choice for every job, but definitely has its uses.
    Here are a few pix of a frame I made with 3/4" schedule 40 black iron. They were coped with a grinder, so they were not the tightest fit up. I didn't remove the black finish before welding. The biggest problem is getting the puddle started so it separates from the slag. You need to run it hot enough do that, but not to hot to burn through. With the 5/64" 6013 , 54 amps was good. Using 3/32" 6013, 68 amps ran very smooth when the joints were tight.


    Name:  008.jpg
Views: 123
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    3/32" 6013 downhill 68 amps

    Name:  010.jpg
Views: 122
Size:  58.9 KB
    5/64" uphill 54 amps

    Name:  011.jpg
Views: 123
Size:  183.2 KB
    5/64" downhill 58 amps

    Name:  014.jpg
Views: 123
Size:  92.5 KB
    5/64" uphill 54 amps weave to fill big gaps

    Many people seem to dislike 6013, but a one time it was one of the most widely used welding rods on the planet. Many airframes were welded with Lincoln Planeweld 1 (6013), and Planeweld 2(10013) .

    Here are the pages from my old study book "New lessons in arc welding" this is the 1957 edition.

    Name:  planeweld1.jpg
Views: 126
Size:  137.0 KB
    Thats some nice welding on that frame, and some good information from that old textbook

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  17. #34
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    admittedly my welds are not that nice looking...good job on those. thanks for the text book reference i like reading stuff like that

    thanks bob
    bobs77vet/37ford4dr

    Eastwood digital TIG200
    HH190
    Lincoln Invertec 155s
    Lincoln weldpak 100
    sears/craftsman (lincoln) 50a 240v buzz box
    O/A rig Harris gauges
    nexion cut 50 dx
    chicago electric (HF) 240v spot welder

  18. #35
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Quote Originally Posted by 37ford4dr View Post
    thats an interesting observation, the hand position on all these welds was difficult for me. I am really good and fast with Mig welding .... and i am really slow with TIG welding but I bet if went the TIG route to begin with I would have no do overs, no grinding and by the end of it my TIG welding would have gotten faster. I have to make something for the other grand kids.... maybe a boat perhaps i will use all TIG welds on that project. i am still dreaming it up in my head. thanks bob
    I woukd have welded it with stick too, probably 6010 or 6011 bein as how thats what i have here, maybe even give it a lash with 7018. I not very good with MIG, I dont know how to TIG, and the fluxcore wire I have is way too heavy for it. So there it is for me, I stick weld it, and it would look about like yours does.

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  20. #36
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Nascar roll cages are Mig welded. Top fuel dragsters and funny cars are Tig welded. Even Jr. dragsters require Tig welding of the drivers compartment. The rest can be Mig. Originally Mig was introduced to be faster than Tig welding but don't think they had short circuiting transfer for awhile. Lincoln had Aircrafter bullet welders that used a foot pedal for stick welding.

  21. #37
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    That's quite a nifty project for the kids. I'll bet they will love it. For your next project how about mocking up one of these. Controls are close to those in real copters, and you can hook it up to "fly" copters and planes on a simulator in the basement when there's bad weather outside.

  22. #38
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    so lets run with that......how do simplify that for little kids, and for me to make....the age is 3-10 yrs old, perhaps just two pedals and the center joy stick? and how do i make the center joy stick have a 360* movement?
    bobs77vet/37ford4dr

    Eastwood digital TIG200
    HH190
    Lincoln Invertec 155s
    Lincoln weldpak 100
    sears/craftsman (lincoln) 50a 240v buzz box
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    nexion cut 50 dx
    chicago electric (HF) 240v spot welder

  23. #39
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Ball Joint maybe weld a rod on it.
    DIY CNC Plasma table USB BOB Price THC
    Hypertherm 65
    Everlast PowerTig 255 EXT
    Miler 180 Mig
    13" metal lathe
    Mill/ Drill
    ECT, ECT,

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  25. #40
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Quote Originally Posted by acourtjester View Post
    Ball Joint maybe weld a rod on it.
    Thats a great idea ! I always seem to have one in the shop for a vehicle I don't own anymore.

    Northern(Hydraulic) Tool used to sell Go-Kart pedals, haven't browsed the catalog in a while.

    Maybe put a USB charging port on there, I seem to be installing them everywhere lately.
    Airco 250 ac/dc Heliwelder Square wave
    Miller Synchrowave 180 sd
    Miller Econo Twin HF
    Lincoln 210 MP
    Dayton 225 ac/dc
    Victor torches
    Snap-On YA-212
    Lotos Cut60D

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  27. #41
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    I like that, thanks, a ball joint or heim joint bolted to a fixed bracket.....I need to think this through a little bit.

    how do i make it self centering.....with springs going out north/south/east/west?
    Last edited by 37ford4dr; 18 Hours Ago at 03:53 PM.
    bobs77vet/37ford4dr

    Eastwood digital TIG200
    HH190
    Lincoln Invertec 155s
    Lincoln weldpak 100
    sears/craftsman (lincoln) 50a 240v buzz box
    O/A rig Harris gauges
    nexion cut 50 dx
    chicago electric (HF) 240v spot welder

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  29. #42
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Quote Originally Posted by 37ford4dr View Post
    so lets run with that......how do simplify that for little kids, and for me to make....the age is 3-10 yrs old, perhaps just two pedals and the center joy stick? and how do i make the center joy stick have a 360* movement?
    By the time the little kids grow up a bit more, perhaps they will be ready to "fly."

  30. #43
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Quote Originally Posted by 37ford4dr View Post
    I like that, thanks, a ball joint or heim joint bolted to a fixed bracket.....I need to think this through a little bit.

    how do i make it self centering.....with springs going out north/south/east/west?
    You could use one of those rubber disc joints like some of the older cars used, that would be pretty simple to make.

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  32. #44
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    Re: metal pipe play helicopter

    Quote Originally Posted by 12V71 View Post
    You could use one of those rubber disc joints like some of the older cars used, that would be pretty simple to make.
    what years/models and for that part?? and for waht application i cant visualize this part. thanks bob
    bobs77vet/37ford4dr

    Eastwood digital TIG200
    HH190
    Lincoln Invertec 155s
    Lincoln weldpak 100
    sears/craftsman (lincoln) 50a 240v buzz box
    O/A rig Harris gauges
    nexion cut 50 dx
    chicago electric (HF) 240v spot welder

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