CK stubby gas lens on Aluminum

[3zman]

Just tried welding 1/4" aluminum with a stubby gas lens. I had heard about "gas lens" and "stubby" but had never tried one. Managed to get my hands on the stubby kit for free and I thought I would try it out. CK Kit #SGL-KTM. In the event that this might be useful to someone, I thought I would post a result. I used the 3/32 setup out of the kit. Photo represents first attempt at inside corner. My impressions were that a very clean weld was produced but I have achieved similar results using what I would call the "normal" TIG torch configuration that I have been using for years. Not sure of the actual current used, it didn't seem like I was near the max. It just seemed "easier" and, of course, you could get into smaller spaces. I would be interested in the experience of others using this configuration.

Torch 17
Welder HTP221
3/32 La/W electrode
#7 cup
Max current 220A
Balance 65
Frequency 120
Post flow 10 sec.
Pre flow .5 sec
Filler Rod: 3/32" 5356
No preheat
Material Prep: Cleaned with red Scotchbrite and blew off with dry air.
.

[shovelon]

You are getting similar results that I get, but I use a #8 cup, and 1/8" -2% lanthanated tungsten. The weld looks good but also looks undersized for 1/4" base metal. But if that size works for you then I go for it. Most times a 1/4" fillet requires a 1/4" throat, which overrides the leg size.

I like gas lenses for the smooth flow and reduced gas consumption. Also the gas lens kind of works as a heat shield/exchanger to deflect heat from the torch, but then also pull heat from the torch body to pre-heat the inert gas.

[John T]

1/4” Aluminum I’d be using 1/8” tung. & filler rod

Thats just me.

That weld almost looks like undercut
I can’t see it that well on the phone.

Looks very small though

[2strokeforever]

Could just be me, but I found the big gas lens dont work very good on outside corner joints

[3zman]

Thanks for the inputs. I agree with the use of the 1/8" Tungsten and normally that's what I would use for 1/4" and normal torch config. I had been welding 1/8" and just didn't bother switching over. I was surprised that the 3/32" electrode held up (didn't overheat) but I didn't do that many beads and these were just 4"X2" practice pieces. Closer examination of the weld did not indicate undercutting and I will add that prior to laying the inside corner bead I had done the outside corner.

For completeness attached outside corner weld done prior to inside corner so I guess statement about preheat inaccurate with regard to inside corner weld.
Again, many thanks for the feedback.

[albrightree]

Nice welding. If your using pure tungsten, then definitely use 1/8" electrode, with the other types it won't make that much of a difference in short runs. I think its more important to use 1/8" filler so you can fill the throat out. They don't look undercut, just a little concave, with lots of fine ripples. Using the larger filler rod/wire would improve depth of throat, and consistency. At least for me it does. YMMV

good luck

[3zman]

I'll try the 1/8 filler. When doing the outside corner it seemed like I couldn't apply enough material fast enough.

Thanks

[shovelon]

Could just be me, but I found the big gas lens dont work very good on outside corner joints

There are small nozzles for gas lenses too. I have a #4 and hardly use it. What size do you use?

[BillE.Dee]

You did a good job on the welds. It will surprise you when you realize the little bit of difference in the 3/32 to the 1/8 filler will make in filling. Also, did you happen to cut and etch just for your own satisfaction? When I get a break (which is often because I'm trying to retire...again), I do weld material that I've been working with and cut them because I can. All the best to you and enjoy.
gramps

[Gamble]

10sec of post flow is way tooo much. 3-4seconds is enough

[shovelon]

10sec of post flow is way tooo much. 3-4seconds is enough

Dang you are cheap!!!!

[Gamble]

Dang you are cheap!!!!

ya damn right lol
As long as my tungsten welds good I don't care how many colors it has. I'd also rather regrind it than have to refill a tank more often. Most of the parts I make have a 7 parts, average 3 tacks each = lots of wasted gas
Thats why I hate welders like the diversion, sw200 and HF. Welders without post flow control I would run out of gas in a week or two when it normally lasts me 3-4 months.

[shovelon]

ya damn right lol
As long as my tungsten welds good I don't care how many colors it has. I'd also rather regrind it than have to refill a tank more often. Most of the parts I make have a 7 parts, average 3 tacks each = lots of wasted gas
Thats why I hate welders like the diversion, sw200 and HF. Welders without post flow control I would run out of gas in a week or two when it normally lasts me 3-4 months.

The new HFProTig205 does have adjustable post flow. It came at a price as they lowered the DC pulse max from 200 to 50. I agree the SW200 and Diversion can go through gas fast.

[Gamble]

The new HFProTig205 does have adjustable post flow. It came at a price as they lowered the DC pulse max from 200 to 50. I agree the SW200 and Diversion can go through gas fast.

For $999 they could of left it at 200pps and added all the necessary features. Now they are just getting greedy

[shovelon]

For $999 they could of left it at 200pps and added all the necessary features. Now they are just getting greedy

Agree. Warranty sucks too.

[Munkul]

IME Aluminium isn't fussy on gas coverage... just needs enough to cover the tungsten and arc. I don't get any better results between a regular no.5 cup and a no.7 gas lens (which is my go-to for stainless, and pretty much stays on all the time)

I don't like the idea of too-short a post-gas time. For the sake of a second or two of gas every time you run a bead, I'd rather keep my tungsten clean.

Watercooled torches will cool the tungsten faster so you can get away with less post-gas.

[3zman]

The reason I run a 10 second post flow was my experience some time ago running the 3/32 tungsten on 1/4 Al (standard torch config). The Tungsten turned blue with a post flow of 5 seconds. I eventually switched to a 1/8 electrode and kept the post flow at 10. The point of gas consumption is valid (I use an 80 cubic foot Ar bottle - the larger ~120 is now too heavy for me to safely handle (geezer factor)) but I am fortunate that the local hardware store carries them for me. With respect to the #7 stubby cup, it's just the default in the kit. I used the #7 in the standard torch configuration also.

The recommendations from this forum (shovelon and others) really help, are greatly appreciated, and get me on track quickly. I have ordered 1/8" 5356, will switch to the 1/8 electrode (stubby) and will post the results when I get the material.

Thanks again.

[Munkul]

With 220 amps max, i can't see how a bigger tungsten will help? The 221 is a modern machine and will look after the tungsten point just fine, on 3/32. How will a bigger tungsten add any value?

I do agree with the 1/8" filler, definitely a good idea on 1/4".

I'd drop the frequency to 50hz on that thick inside joint, it will wet out better and you'll be surprised at how much hotter it will run. Save the high frequency for when you want to run narrow beads.

[3zman]

I'll try the 50Hz, thanks.

[shovelon]

With 220 amps max, i can't see how a bigger tungsten will help? The 221 is a modern machine and will look after the tungsten point just fine, on 3/32. How will a bigger tungsten add any value?

I do agree with the 1/8" filler, definitely a good idea on 1/4".

I'd drop the frequency to 50hz on that thick inside joint, it will wet out better and you'll be surprised at how much hotter it will run. Save the high frequency for when you want to run narrow beads.

True. Too high freq on inside corners will hobble arc, but it can help with cleaning on outside corners creating a more focused arc. I like 80 to 100 freq as opposed to 150 to 200 htz.

[Munkul]

Absolutely agree with the higher frequency on outside joints after a while you get used to what frequency is good for what.

My go-to frequency is 80hz. I just like it. Runs well on 1/8".

Inside joints on 1/4" - 50hz or lower. My machine will let me run at 30hz, which sounds horrific but it makes a huge wide puddle and puts loads of heat in.

Outside edges, narrow delicate work etc - 120hz+.

[3zman]

Ok, I got my 1/8" 5356, switched to a 1/8" stubby gas lens and did a few of the same welds with the same parameters as before. As advised it did make running both inside and outside corner welds easier. I did not change the frequency from 120Hz to a lower value - in my quest to switch to 1/8" I simply forgot. My biggest problem with these 4"X2"X1/4" test pieces is tacking them into position. There has got to be an easier way of doing this. Anyway results were good, here are a few pics. Thanks again.

[3zman]

Sorry about duplicated pics - couldn't figure out how to delete.

[3zman]

80 Hz for completeness.

[shovelon]

That looks really good.