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Thread: Torque Amp

  1. #1
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    Torque Amp

    Ive been using this to torque my hydrolic sylinder nuts (bolts) to 556 ft pounds or there about. I was using the wrong torque but, thanks to you guys, I built this torque amp. Stole it from Samms $556.95 thread from another member. I will give him credit when I remember who it was . Plus, I dont have the math together at the moment but , I used 100 ft/lbs at the torque meter to get approx 556 ft/lbs. I will go back to the original cylinder when Im done to correct it from 90 ft/lbs to 500+ when Im done with the last cylinder (one more).

    I used er70s mig wire twisted into tig wire. I coulda used er70s FCAW but I wanted Tig practice. I used 70s because doing a search here, I came up with 70s, 309 and I think uetec690? Er70s was easiest to get but had to twist 6 strands together. Not worth it, shoulda took the time/traffic to get tig rod. Oh well. Hasnt broke on me yet (2 nuts), my friends beet it to the limit last weekend and I got one more plus the re-work to do and its fugly. Hope someone can use this someday.

    I used 6010 (practice) to weld the two plates together and TIG (practice) for socket (CR-V) to platen. If it breaks, I will just fix it.

    Math/link to come.

    Oh , and yes, I used a fon camera because its harder to judge my fugly welds
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  2. #2
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    Re: Torque Amp

    I forgot to mention for anyone interested in the math, 1.25ft torque tool, 4 ft xtension, 100ft/lbs at the gauge and around 556 ft/lbs(close) actual torque. Forgot the math???

  3. #3
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Based on these links (and my own formulas) you would only have 420 ft/lbs.

    Wrench setting = 100
    Original length = 1.25 ft (from the center of the grip)
    Overall length = 1.25' + 4' = 5.25 ft

    http://www.norbar.com/calculators/to...alculator.aspx
    http://www.norbar.com/Calculators/To...alculator.aspx

    Your wrench needs to be set approx 132 ft/lbs to get the desired 556 ft/lbs.

    Dave J.
    Last edited by MinnesotaDave; 03-21-2013 at 12:33 PM.
    Dave J.

    Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~

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  4. #4
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Thanks MinnesotaDave for correcting me and the links. Ive been getting lazy with math lately. Yes 420 ft/lbs and Im ok with 420 ft/lbs.

    speeddr2000 shared this link http://www.engineersedge.com/manufac...e_wrench_1.htm that gave me the idea.

    Heres a the formula in case the links get lost. I think they are a different variation of your links.

    Y= (T x L) / (L + E) where Y is actual torque, T is torque reading, L is length of torque tool, E is xtension length

  5. #5
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Quote Originally Posted by Insaneride View Post
    Y= (T x L) / (L + E) where Y is actual torque, T is torque reading, L is length of torque tool, E is xtension length
    Close.

    Y is torque reading at the wrench, and T is the actual torque exerted onto whatever object is being torqued.

    Your welcome in advance.
    1st on WeldingWeb to have a scrolling sig!



  6. #6
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Yep, you are correct Oscar.

  7. #7
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Torque amplification depends on the rigidity of the arm.

    If the arm is wobbly, the torque is reduced. You're probably in the ballpark, but you ain't truly there
    "Any day above ground is a good day"

    http://www.farmersamm.com/

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    Re: Torque Amp

    Quote Originally Posted by farmersamm View Post
    Torque amplification depends on the rigidity of the arm.

    If the arm is wobbly, the torque is reduced. You're probably in the ballpark, but you ain't truly there
    I used double flat strap. No wobbly.
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    Last edited by Insaneride; 11-02-2020 at 04:46 PM.

  9. #9
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Holy crapoly................the join date on my thingy shows how far back I go. Goes to show ya................ya can ban the best, but ya can't put 'em down

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    Re: Torque Amp

    TWELVE FRIGGIN' YEARS Y'ALL BEEN DEALIN' WITH MY CRAP I'm humbled
    Last edited by farmersammm; 11-02-2020 at 08:56 PM.

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    Re: Torque Amp

    Mods come and go............but The Farmer rocks on

  13. #12
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Sammm, I believe I've been banned as many times as you have. The last time you were banned, I was banned rite after you and for the same reason sort of. From your new join date I can tell it was August of 2018 because August is when we have the best old car show in the West and your new join date is 2018. I'm not even a farmer and barely passed FFA and nobody fails that course. I wanted to weld but I woulda had to take another year of FFA.

    Anyway, does anybody know of a simple method to check calibration of a torque wrench?
    I have an idea to use a digital torque tool to compare to an under test tool. Kinda like hooking the two together to see if they correlate. I will try to get a pic of what I'm talking about but I haven't got the digital torque tool figured out.

  14. #13
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Quote Originally Posted by Insaneride View Post
    Sammm, I believe I've been banned as many times as you have. The last time you were banned, I was banned rite after you and for the same reason sort of. From your new join date I can tell it was August of 2018 because August is when we have the best old car show in the West and your new join date is 2018. I'm not even a farmer and barely passed FFA and nobody fails that course. I wanted to weld but I woulda had to take another year of FFA.

    Anyway, does anybody know of a simple method to check calibration of a torque wrench?
    I have an idea to use a digital torque tool to compare to an under test tool. Kinda like hooking the two together to see if they correlate. I will try to get a pic of what I'm talking about but I haven't got the digital torque tool figured out.
    In the past I would rig two together and then alternate a few of them just kind of a 'check' as mine aren't the best usually I will test a clicker to one of my beam wrenches... and they are close enough for what I do

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    Re: Torque Amp

    That's exactly what I was thinking. I only have a couple so I couldn't alternate for comparison but I was thinking if the two readings matched then they must be good enuf for what little I use them for. However, if they don't match then one is wrong so I got a fifty fifty chance of getting the rite torque. ��

    I think there was a thread about a homemade tool that could check weight or something. It was a farmer tool I think from Canada.

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  18. #15
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Quote Originally Posted by Insaneride View Post
    That's exactly what I was thinking. I only have a couple so I couldn't alternate for comparison but I was thinking if the two readings matched then they must be good enuf for what little I use them for. However, if they don't match then one is wrong so I got a fifty fifty chance of getting the rite torque. ��

    I think there was a thread about a homemade tool that could check weight or something. It was a farmer tool I think from Canada.
    Since torque can be measured in foot/pounds would be very simple to make a 'test bed' with a known weight... either from the supermarket or your bathroom scales and an arm of 2-3-4 or any other length of feet...

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  20. #16
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    Re: Torque Amp

    That sounds like what the farmer was doing but his was cumbersome for some farm stuf.
    Thanks for the explanation ronsi. Do have a pic or could you point me the direction to make one? Tia.

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  22. #17
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Quote Originally Posted by Insaneride View Post
    That sounds like what the farmer was doing but his was cumbersome for some farm stuf.
    Thanks for the explanation ronsi. Do have a pic or could you point me the direction to make one? Tia.
    I doubt I have any pics of the setup I tried.... but here is an even simpler one

    Name:  twr-test-simple1.jpg
Views: 488
Size:  26.6 KB

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  24. #18
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Quote Originally Posted by ronsii View Post
    I doubt I have any pics of the setup I tried.... but here is an even simpler one

    Name:  twr-test-simple1.jpg
Views: 488
Size:  26.6 KB
    That's genius

    And that little vice is adorable.

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  26. #19
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Quote Originally Posted by MinnesotaDave View Post
    Based on these links (and my own formulas) you would only have 420 ft/lbs.

    Wrench setting = 100
    Original length = 1.25 ft (from the center of the grip)
    Overall length = 1.25' + 4' = 5.25 ft

    http://www.norbar.com/calculators/to...alculator.aspx
    http://www.norbar.com/Calculators/To...alculator.aspx

    Your wrench needs to be set approx 132 ft/lbs to get the desired 556 ft/lbs.

    Dave J.
    I saw the pics, that does not look like it is 5.25 feet long overall. But if the bar he made was 2.75 feet long it will amplify whatever pressure put upon it by 2.75 times. Since the torque wrench is 1.25 feet long it will amplify whatever pressure is put on it by 1.25 times causing whatever pressure put on the end to both devices to be amplified by 3.4375 times. So if you needed 556 pounds of torque you could divide 556 by 3.4375 and you would need 161.7454 pounds applied at the end of the wrench. You would have to set the wrench to (161.7454 times 1.25) which equals 202.1818-foot pounds of torque to allow 161.7454 pounds at the handle.


    Sincerely,

    William McCormick
    If I wasn't so.....crazy, I wouldn't try to act normal, and you would be afraid.

  27. #20
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    Re: Torque Amp

    I am going to correct myself here I was fighting myself in that last post I was figuring two things simultaneously. 556 divided by four is 139 that is the force your hand has to put on the 1.25-foot wrench welded to the 2.75 homemade bar to create 556 foot-pounds of torque. if the torque wrench is 1.25 feet long the pressure it exerts is 1.25 times greater than 139 and you get 173.5-foot-pounds needed on the torque wrench indicator.

    Edited and yet this does not check out right because 173.5 times 2.75 is only 477.125 weird stuff. What do you think Dave?



    Sincerely,

    William McCormick
    Last edited by William McCormick; 11-04-2020 at 08:51 AM.
    If I wasn't so.....crazy, I wouldn't try to act normal, and you would be afraid.

  28. #21
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Replied to wrong person.
    Last edited by William McCormick; 11-04-2020 at 08:30 AM. Reason: I meant to reply to Dave

  29. #22
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Quote Originally Posted by MinnesotaDave View Post
    Based on these links (and my own formulas) you would only have 420 ft/lbs.

    Wrench setting = 100
    Original length = 1.25 ft (from the center of the grip)
    Overall length = 1.25' + 4' = 5.25 ft

    http://www.norbar.com/calculators/to...alculator.aspx
    http://www.norbar.com/Calculators/To...alculator.aspx

    Your wrench needs to be set approx 132 ft/lbs to get the desired 556 ft/lbs.

    Dave J.
    If the bar was 5.25 feet long overall the force you would have to put on the torque wrench welded to the homemade bar with your hand would be 105.9048, 556 divided by 5.25 feet. 1.25 times that would be 132.381 needed on the torque wrench indicator.

    Edited: And yet at four feet, we need 139 pounds to make 556-foot pounds of torque. Very weird.

    Sincerely,

    William McCormick
    Last edited by William McCormick; 11-04-2020 at 09:05 AM.
    If I wasn't so.....crazy, I wouldn't try to act normal, and you would be afraid.

  30. #23
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    Re: Torque Amp

    The closer you are to the center of the bar the folcrum for lack of a better term the greater inaccuracy you get from just using the ratio of the second lever.

    Sincerely,

    William McCormick
    If I wasn't so.....crazy, I wouldn't try to act normal, and you would be afraid.

  31. #24
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Quote Originally Posted by William McCormick View Post
    I am going to correct myself here I was fighting myself in that last post I was figuring two things simultaneously. 556 divided by four is 139 that is the force your hand has to put on the 1.25-foot wrench welded to the 2.75 homemade bar to create 556 foot-pounds of torque. if the torque wrench is 1.25 feet long the pressure it exerts is 1.25 times greater than 139 and you get 173.5-foot-pounds needed on the torque wrench indicator.

    Edited and yet this does not check out right because 173.5 times 2.75 is only 477.125 weird stuff. What do you think Dave?



    Sincerely,

    William McCormick
    Not sure what you're getting at as you're wandering around a bit.
    But just using these two forms of the formula should answer your questions.

    The force of your hand on the wrench is not part of these equations as that's a separate issue.

    If you are getting errors, you may be inappropriately combining the equations with applied force of your hand, or just getting an "order of operations" type error.

    Name:  20201104_074155.jpg
Views: 465
Size:  67.5 KB
    Last edited by MinnesotaDave; 11-04-2020 at 09:49 AM.
    Dave J.

    Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~

    Syncro 350
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    Tried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.

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  33. #25
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    Re: Torque Amp

    Good observation William MCcormick. I measured the amplifier yesterday and center to center is 48". Or to be exact 47-7/8". The torque wrench is 15" from center of socket drive to the line on handle or fulcrum.

    How does that work for your calcs?

    Samm did say it was wobbly but in the ball park. I do remember putting in extra torque because my wrench only goes to 150 ft/lbs. I didn't set the wrench to max because the spring gets really tight and I my broke my last torque wrench using at max.
    Last edited by Insaneride; 11-04-2020 at 10:39 AM.

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