The new Multimatic 200 arrived

[user 9328330]

Heck yeah man, come on down! And absolutely bring as many welders as you'd like to compare it with, as the Multimatic is the only small welder I've run and so I have nothing else to compare it with.

As far as the duty cycle goes, it's a moot point for me anyway as the work I do with it doesn't involve a lot of continuous arc time. I've used it for a lot of manlift railing repairs, small gauge-thickness repair work, building a leaf-blower cage that fits inside a dump trailer, etc. If I need a lot of staying power, I use a different machine. But on jobsites with 110V power and the 'right' kind of work, the Multimatic keeps me from having to start my Trailblazer, drag 1/0 leads around, and/or lug the Suitcase 12RC around.

Hope to see you this summer. I'm sure Stick-Man could give you directions, too.

[pedaldude]

I know the duty cycle of my Maxstar 150stl is conservative. I've run it flat out for minutes straight on 1/8" until I couldn't hold the torch anymore despite stick gloves over my tig gloves, pausing only long enough for the torch handle to cool down and to grab a couple more rods to feed.

I've emptied a whole bottle of argon a couple times too, finish welding tubing that I've tacked. Only stopping long enough to go to the next weld and flip the hood back down.

I don't know the amperage draw of the three machines but all else being equal, that's one of the most important things I look for in a portable welder. I had a Lincoln Invertec I never used and sold because it drew enough current to trip breakers the Maxstar wouldn't when out of the shop. I didn't miss HF or pulse more than I thought I would with the little Maxstar. I see them used on occasion too, usually 1/2 to 1/3rd their new price, sometimes with tanks and other sundries.

I had been wanting to get a Hobart Trek for a while but missed out on the close out deals when they went out of production.

[Drooopy]

DSW, i can say for sure that the mig arc on the Multimatic flat out trumps the Tweeco. Dont get me wrong, the Tweeco welds well. The Miller is just better.

[Brand X]

I still think the old Passport Plus made a better portable dual voltage mig, if nothing else due to the lighter weight.

The Multimatic 200 is a bit lighter. Problem with the passport plus (Compared to the older blue passport) is the voltage has a notched pot layout. Meaning you get close on the voltage but not as precise as the older model. I would thinK even though the Multimatic has a notched pot,with it's digital layout -= a non issue The new machine has a bit more WFS then the last one. Still not enough for full output using 5356 wire in the size the spool gun supports.. I love the real pelican case on the old one, but I think the newer plastic one going to be just fine too..(Just does not look as good) Never used the 200 yet, but owned a blue one, and watched my friend weld 1/8 aluminum using 120 volt power on the plus model.. (sweet locking welds) We had a C-300 Powerwave, and MM-350 P to compare it too.. The older Passport was a great machine on CO2/120/.030 wire volt power. Worth owning for that alone.. My 141i Tweco is a much better C-25/.023 machine.. Very close to the passport on CO2, but a tiny bit bit behind there.

With all the discounts/timing, I believe the multimatic can be had for $1350.00 Pretty appealing at that price point.. Going to see what what my friend can do by working the Airgas system.. Machines that sit for a while get blown out sometimes.. That's how I got great deals in the past.. Last one was a Esab 2200i AC/DC for $1500.00 It sat next to the Multimatic 200 for a year or two.. I am thinking close to a grand with the factory $250 rebate.. Don't think I will do the Lincoln when I can get this one..

[GromitInWA]

What's the best deal that people are seeing on the Multimatic 200 with TIG kit and aluminum spool gun right now? I want to get the $500 rebate so it looks like I need to order the base unit, TIG kit and spool gun all separately, since I think that the base unit and TIG kit ordered together count as a single SKU. Pricing everything separately through CyberWeld comes to $1869.50 (assuming the $500 rebate), whereas as a TIG kit assuming the $250 rebate, it comes to $2021.


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[Revlis]

Any updates? "upon further review" sorta stuff?

I'm on the fence right now as I can go either way a Lincoln MP210 or a Multimatic 200. I'm leaning towards Miller because I trust the brand and the warranty a little bit more than Lincoln, but I have NO solid reasons to go one way or another. With Millers rebates, and the gear I need to get set up the Miller is still more costly but only a bit.

So, yeah anyone have a source for some actual experience with the Multi-Matic good or bad?

[GromitInWA]

FWIW I spoke went into the local welding store where they had the Lincoln on display. They did not have a Multimatic on display. The guy there told me that (1) Miller is coming out with a new machine presumably in response to the Lincoln. (2) The Lincoln will be going up in price by a few hundred $s.
Unless any of this is corroborated, I would take all this with a wheelbarrow full of salt though...


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[AKweldshop]

FWIW,
The Lincoln 210mp only has 175amps for tig and stick. It won't keep a 6010 lit to save it's life, just so everyone knows.

The Lincoln also can function without a remote for tig.... that's nice.

[GromitInWA]

Additional thought for Revlis: the Multimatic had been out for a while (2 years?) so it is more proven than the MP210. The fact that we're not seeing "Multimatic sucks" threads indicates that it is solid. I believe that were some issues with certain welding sticks or wire (can't remember) but a software update fixed it.

I recall reading and seeing some videos of feed problems with the MP210 and the LWS confirmed that the feeder has been "redesigned". I emailed Lincoln asking if the firmware is updatable but never received a reply. Other than that, I've not seen any "Lincoln sucks" threads but the machine has only really been out 4 months or so

Personally I'm probably going to get the Lincoln with the aluminum spool gun because I don't need TIG capability yet, so the initial purchase price ends up being less than the Multimatic since I'd have to get the spool and TIG kit for the full rebate to kick in.

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[Revlis]

Additional thought for Revlis: the Multimatic had been out for a while (2 years?) so it is more proven than the MP210. The fact that we're not seeing "Multimatic sucks" threads indicates that it is solid. I believe that were some issues with certain welding sticks or wire (can't remember) but a software update fixed it.

I recall reading and seeing some videos of feed problems with the MP210 and the LWS confirmed that the feeder has been "redesigned". I emailed Lincoln asking if the firmware is updatable but never received a reply. Other than that, I've not seen any "Lincoln sucks" threads but the machine has only really been out 4 months or so

Personally I'm probably going to get the Lincoln with the aluminum spool gun because I don't need TIG capability yet, so the initial purchase price ends up being less than the Multimatic since I'd have to get the spool and TIG kit for the full rebate to kick in.

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Thank you for the input. I'm still waffling however, as Tig is something I intend to do a lot of I keep leaning towards the Multimatic and its reportedly solid lift-Tig performance. The Lincolns two years or so newer design, Duty cycle, and price point though are awfully tempting. I hadn't really thought about the lack of "multimatic sucks" threads as an indicator though I should have and it is encouraging.

I also think we are right on the edge of a new Multi-process Miller. It makes sense, the Multimatic is a few years old and it's facing the MP210, so if I wasn't in a hurry, I'd take a wait and see position, find out what Miller is bringing to the table and at what price point. If nothing else it would likely mean better pricing on the Multimatic.

Pretty sure I'm going to pick up a multimatic though, partly due to the mostly positive press, and partly due to warranty and history. I'm new, this will be my first, but I'm thinking buy a solid dual voltage multi-process to start, then as my Tig skills develop, buy a dedicated hardcore Tig/stick machine. That and the rebates help close the financial gap...

But then the Lincoln looks really damn solid, better Amperage, better Duty Cycle (per Lincoln specs), half the money almost... Makes me wonder if the Miller is really twice the welder?

[soutthpaw]

The Millermatic really had no competition when it was bought out. it was at a price point that it probably sold well. The Lincoln upped the game a bit. If you plan to weld in the upper range of the machine, low duty cycle will drive you nuts.

[Revlis]

The Millermatic really had no competition when it was bought out. it was at a price point that it probably sold well. The Lincoln upped the game a bit. If you plan to weld in the upper range of the machine, low duty cycle will drive you nuts.

Seems as though no matter what I do (other than wait) I'm likely to be driven nuts (short drive). I say this cause I think a Lincoln purchase now will become a regret in a few months or so if when Miller releases a new machine to compete. Same thing with the Multimatic, along comes an update and makes it irrelevant.

SO... maybe I just grab the cheaper one, and move on for now.

Yeah, middle name is waffle.

Regarding Duty cycle though, I have no idea how much heavy stuff I'm going to be welding, but obviously a machine with a higher working range is better... Still contemplating just packing it in and buying proper separate machines. Miller 211 or similar, and some flavor of Tig/stick.

BAH, first world problem for sure, but trying to settle on which welder to make my first is getting frustrating. Got an electrician coming to put in a couple of 240s and couple more 120s in the garage, so that's some progress.

[Drooopy]

I dont know much about the Lincoln, so I cannot help you there.

As for the multimatic, I have been putting mine through its paces recently and love it. It is great size wise for throwing it in the back seat of the truck. Had it on a job last week stick welding some pipe wrench adapters in the morning on 110V long extension cord. Ran 3/32 7018 and 6010 5P+ with no problem at all. That afternoon was running it hard with flux core plugged into 220 on a 6500W Honda generator. 1/4" to 3/8" lap joints as fast as I could weld and reset for a couple hours. Wasn't production level duty cycle or hear, but was definitely exceeding the listed duty cycle by at least double. Was at the limits of the machine, but for non-critical welds, no issues at all.

Great example of a machine doing exactly what it is designed to do. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Only done tig a few times with it, and I am no pro at tig, but has a nice stable arc and the pedal seems nice and linear.

[Revlis]

I dont know much about the Lincoln, so I cannot help you there.

As for the multimatic, I have been putting mine through its paces recently and love it. It is great size wise for throwing it in the back seat of the truck. Had it on a job last week stick welding some pipe wrench adapters in the morning on 110V long extension cord. Ran 3/32 7018 and 6010 5P+ with no problem at all. That afternoon was running it hard with flux core plugged into 220 on a 6500W Honda generator. 1/4" to 3/8" lap joints as fast as I could weld and reset for a couple hours. Wasn't production level duty cycle or hear, but was definitely exceeding the listed duty cycle by at least double. Was at the limits of the machine, but for non-critical welds, no issues at all.

Great example of a machine doing exactly what it is designed to do. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Only done tig a few times with it, and I am no pro at tig, but has a nice stable arc and the pedal seems nice and linear.

Alright, good to hear... The longer I sit on this, the more I lean towards the Multimatic, I'm getting the sense that it is a niche machine, but for around the shop, hobby use, and light duty stuff I end up right or wrong, getting a good feeling about the multimatic.

Or...

[hrdhatdivr]

This is great machine pick up carry right into job indoor .has adapter for 110 v. No wire switching . And on 110 it is pretty good machine. Must have for those quick in and out jobs. Would highly recommend

[ManoKai]

@ tbone550 - ran my buddy's new Multimatic 200 yesterday in MIG mode with C25 and .035 on a 6" piece of 1/4" angle. Really liked the arc characteristics and the Bernard gun. The autoset functions suggested 17-18V @ 175ipm. Ran with it, although my gut was telling me 20-21V @ 375ipm. After the burnin, consulted the Miller app and indeed for solid with C25 the app recommended the higher voltage and WFS settings. Then, ran both 3/32 and 1/8 ESAB Atomic Arcs in SMAW mode. Again, nice beads. The 7018s were a tad more difficult to start, but based on the fact that the section was not shiny clean of primer didn't surprise me.

They are just 'numbers' and perhaps the "200" is geared a bit different. Has your experience with the "200" shown the autoset parameters to be a good starting point for GMAW? Didn't invest the time to rip MIG on the 1/4" piece with the higher Miller app settings but would like to give my buddy some additional insight as he's just starting out welding.

Thanks in advance for your assistance.

[user 9328330]

@ tbone550 - ............. - Has your experience with the "200" shown the autoset parameters to be a good starting point for GMAW? Didn't invest the time to rip MIG on the 1/4" piece with the higher Miller app settings but would like to give my buddy some additional insight as he's just starting out welding.

Thanks in advance for your assistance.

Hey ManoKai,

Sorry for the delay, I only just now saw this. My opinion of the factory Auto-Set function is that it's always a little 'cold' for my liking, more noticeably as material thickness increases. Even in short-circuit I prefer my MIG beads to have a relatively flat appearance with good tie-ins. The factory settings look too humped for my preference. Are you sure about those numbers on the 1/4" Auto-Set? If I remember right, the only difference on the Auto-Set between 3/16" and 1/4" MIG is about 25 IPM on the wire and the V stays the same. And I had thought the 1/4" recommendation was 20.5V and 275 ipm. On further thought, I'll bet the difference is that you were using C25 and I use C100 with this machine -- I've never even hooked mine up to C25 or looked at those settings. Anyway, I only use mine on 110V and don't trust the MIG on 1/4" thickness. So I'll switch to a 3/32" 7018 if what I'm welding is 1/4". Multi-pass if necessary.

I originally ignored the Auto-Set and used the manual functions to set my welding characteristics. Later I learned it was faster to use the Auto-Set, but crank it up a material thickness (or two depending on position).

I agree with you on the Bernard gun. I have a larger Bernard that I hate so much I've relegated it to FCAW duty in the hopes it'll burn up. But the small gun packaged with the Multimatic is a gem, and I'd replace it with another just like it if it were damaged beyond repair.

[mfldmike]

I'm kinda of torn between the Multimatic and the Lincoln 210 MP. I've had the Multimatic in the past and it was a great machine, (save for the stick problems) which I understand has been fixed with a Firmware update. So far the main differences I see, besides the obvious amperage differences in the processes, are as follows:

Multimatic has gas Solenoid on TIG side, Lincoln does not.

Multimatic can go down to 5 amps TIG Lincoln's lowest is 15 amps.

Multimatic has (Fan on Demand) Technology, Lincoln runs all the time.

Multimatic is a lot lighter than Lincoln.

Lincoln has Inductance control Multimatic does not.

Lincoln has Arc Force control, Multimatic does not.

Lincoln need a foot pedal for lift TIG functionality...Multimatic does not.

So right now with the "Build With Blue" promotion, the Multimatic is $1500 as a bare-bones unit and the Lincoln is $999. You get all the above features for that and (imho) a better MIG gun.

I like the looks and the price of the Lincoln but I understand the early models have had Drive Feed Roller issues akin to Multimatic's SMAW issues. I know the Multimatic has been out for 2 years but being from Wisconsin, there is a certain loyalty to Big Blue.

So...is it worth it??


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[Silicon-based]

The Lincoln does not need a foot pedal for lift-arc TIG. This was covered in the main 210MP thread.

The Lincoln gun is very nice. I haven't used the Multimatic so I can't compare them directly.

The Lincoln does have significantly more power on 230V than the Miller, but at the cost of 10 lbs. of extra weight.

They are both fine machines, really boils down to what you will be using it for.

John

[ManoKai]

I

Hey ManoKai,

....Are you sure about those numbers on the 1/4" Auto-Set?....

May have AutoSet for 3/16" thickness versus 1/4". Don't recall. Even still, the welds were a tad convex and "coldish". Will have to invest more time on the "200" rig. She's really:really nice at the existing price point.

Nevertheless, decided to rip my first piece of RED gear and will be procuring a Lincoln 210 MP in Aug'15 from my LWS.

Mahalo loa nui for your feedback. Go Dominion!!