For The Can I TIG With My Welder People.

[aametalmaster]

That setup "tig rig" is exactly how its done in the refinery i worked at for 10 years. The welder had his own rig and just tapped it into whatever engine drive and argon bottle that was sitting there and welded the joints. Then he moved on to the next one. I think most were Weldcraft W-17 if i remember right...Bob

[MWalden]

This is exactly the setup I am currently putting together to learn Tig. Good thread!

[tig_21]

what happens when you have to weld aluminum?....

[SR20steve]

true that, but there's a big difference between passing xrays and being code compliant. I'm not a big fan of scratch starting, but it works well enough.

Passing x-ray IS code compliant thats the reason they are xraying your welds....what other tests need to be performed? We x-ray and hyrdro test, the end....every weld we do is in accordance with some code....

[TozziWelding]

what happens when you have to weld aluminum?....

You use the Syncrowave, or hook the HF-251 box up to the engine drive

[Canoe2fish]

You use the Syncrowave, or hook the HF-251 box up to the engine drive

Stupid question...as long as the engine drive had AC capabilities...right?

[TozziWelding]

AC and Hi Freq for aluminum unless you want to play with helium and DC+...............

[Canoe2fish]

thats what I thought - I was scratching my head wondering if there was some revolutionary new equipment out there...

[Guinness]

I'm doing this with my 1978 Miller Thunderbolt AC and TC-150 DC converter, VisArc II torch etc. Is anyone familiar with the VisArc line of torches? I need consumables for it, and a manual .

[MikeGyver]

what happens when you have to weld aluminum?....

lol you buy a real tig welder

[joshuabardwell]

I know you can't do alum without HF.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm 99% sure you also can't do aluminum on DC.

[MikeGyver]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm 99% sure you also can't do aluminum on DC.

You can, it's not very common because it's more of a specialized process. Search the forum and you see some of it.

[TimmyTIG]

Touch filler rod to work piece, strike filler rod against tungsten. Arc gets struck off the side of the tungsten on the filler rod, rather than the tip against the base metal.

The way I do it... set your cup down on the pipe with your tungsten just about where you'll have it while welding, then take your wire and strike it quickly against the tungsten and the work at the same time. POW!!!! you got fire, just make sure you turn the gas on first.

[zapster]

This needs to be a stickey so stuck it is.

...zap!

[jtcnj]

Thanks for this post, I used it to set up my scratch start rig a while back.

I have started experimenting using the filler rod to start the arc on t-joint fillets where I am resting the cup in the joint with a short electrode extension, making it is difficult to scratch close to the joint.

I am having mixed results: looking for steady travel uniformity by sliding the torch, but it is harder to see the puddle without increasing travel angle too much.

Also, with no foot pedal I am used to varying the arc length a little as needed, as opposed to resting the torch on the work. I am wondering if varying travel angle can be used effectively to vary the arc length without losing proper gas coverage or balling up the filler rod.

Any tips for the no foot pedal guys would be appreciated, and yes, I would like to upgrade to a "real" tig machine eventually.....(why do I just know some smart #ss is gonna reply "buy a machine with a foot pedal")

[Guinness]

The way I do it... set your cup down on the pipe with your tungsten just about where you'll have it while welding, then take your wire and strike it quickly against the tungsten and the work at the same time. POW!!!! you got fire, just make sure you turn the gas on first.

Somebody should make a video of this.

[TimmyTIG]

like they always say, It's like striking a match. You have to do it fast, if you just float that wire down there it's gonna get stuck on the tungsten, you gotta whip it.
Of course, I'm talking about welding on pipe, if you're doing a T joint it's gonna be tougher to get the right motion on the wire cause you can't come at it from the side.

[polarred21]

So these new "lift tig" machines.....

what is the difference between "scratch start" and "lift arc"....and "lift arc"...and still won't work for aluminum correct?

[joshuabardwell]

what is the difference between "scratch start" and "lift arc"....and "lift arc"...and still won't work for aluminum correct?

With scratch start, the output amperage is always present on the electrode. You touch, or scratch, the tip to start the arc, and you snap out to break the arc, similar to stick welding. With lift start, the machine puts a very low-voltage sensing current on the electrode. With the sense current, the machine detects when you have touched the work piece. As soon as you break that contact, the machine then puts the output amperage on the electrode.

The main difference between the two is that, with scratch start, the electrode is "hot" while it is touching the work piece, so there is more contamination of the electrode. You have to re-grind it more often. Also, with lift-start, there is sometimes a switch on the gun that lets you cut off the arc. This means that you can stop welding without removing the shielding gas coverage from the weld (post-flow), whereas with scratch-start, when you "snap out" to break the arc, you lose shielding gas coverage.

I have only TIG welded aluminum once, so I'm not an authority at all, but from what I read, pedal is usually used for aluminum because of the way aluminum soaks up heat. You need to be very hot at first to establish the puddle, but as soon as the work piece heats up, you need to back off. The other thing is that aluminum requires AC, and I don't know if anybody makes an AC TIG machine that doesn't come with a foot pedal. AC TIG machines are pretty high-end, as welders go.

[MWalden]

Scratch start tig works very well with mild steel, at least it does for me, and is what I have been learning with.


These I built with my scratch start rig consisting of an Airco Bumblebee 250 AC/DC machine, a WP17v tig torch and argon bottle with flow meter.

[polarred21]

Really nice fabriaction here. Using AC or DC?

[MWalden]

Really nice fabrication here. Using AC or DC?

DCEN, about 65 amps I think it was, 3/32" diameter 2% thoriated tungsten, WP17V air cooled torch, 3/32" ER70-S2 filler.

[huck65]

I just found this thread and always have wanted to learn TIG. I have a Lincoln ranger 250 that I can use as a power source. My question is, I have found a good deal on a Lincoln Tig module wih a peddle, bottle, basicly a complete set up. Is all that neseccessary since I still won't be able to weld aluminum.
This is more of a hobby for me and if I can learn to scrath start I would be content especially if having a module and peddle won't allow me to weld anything I couldn't weld with a scrath start set up.

[MWalden]

I just found this thread and always have wanted to learn TIG. I have a Lincoln ranger 250 that I can use as a power source.

My question is, I have found a good deal on a Lincoln Tig module with a peddle, bottle, basically a complete set up. Is all that necessary since I still won't be able to weld aluminum.

This is more of a hobby for me and if I can learn to scratch start I would be content especially if having a module and peddle won't allow me to weld anything I couldn't weld with a scratch start set up.

I assume you mean a Lincoln High Frequency Arc Starter/Stabilizer (tig module)?

Having the Lincoln High Frequency unit will give you the ability to arc start without having to use scratch start. Scratch start contaminates the tungsten rather quickly when you are learning.

This unit will be to your advantage allowing you to keep a cleaner tungsten longer and will also have pre and post flow control for the shielding gas.

I am not familiar enough with the Lincoln Ranger to know if it has remote control of the heat setting. If not, the foot peddle will not do much, if anything at all, and you will have to manually adjust heat.

That won't be much of an issue welding steel though.

[killdozerd11]

I didn't see this thread until zap stuck it from another thread

I have about the same setup as Tozzi except i'm running it off the TB302
lift start but after using it on body panels i got a pedal controller that terry suggested

You start hot but i have to keep breaking the arc because it is over heating the sheet metal panels i need to throttle back once it's hot enough to puddle the silicone bronze i'm using and it's 3/32 and i needed 1/16 but the LWS was out so i have to really heat the rod more than the base metal which is 16 GA and 20 Ga

Running 70 amps using 1/16 2 % thoriated