Chip briquetter

[forhire]

I stopped by the hydraulic shop and he said the flat SAE connectors should be the pressure side and the threaded ports would be the return. He said to hook it up. Now I need to build some hoses.

[JeffKiper]

did a small press for a shop a few years ago. We made a knuckle press for the stroke action. Simple 3 point press http://thelibraryofmanufacturing.com/presses.html.

I am an automation guy so the plc programming , photoeye, sensors and all came from old machines.

The machine shop did the calculations and machine design. They said it was around 20 tons on the 2" ram. The ram stroke was 10". I had the press just stroking constantly with a small dwell once the cylinder was extended. they had the shavings fed from a screw conveyor dropping into the press. I monitored the system pressure to see when we made pressure they ment me had a full die and needed to empty the slug.

[dbotos]

Anything over 90% compression sounds pretty good. How efficient will it be for doing mass quantites of chips? Seems like you need a hinged mold to pull the briquettes out easily or an ejector pin to push them back up and out.

Wonder if those extra ports are for some kind of partial extension mode...

[forhire]

The machine shop did the calculations and machine design. They said it was around 20 tons on the 2" ram. The ram stroke was 10". I had the press just stroking constantly with a small dwell once the cylinder was extended. they had the shavings fed from a screw conveyor dropping into the press. I monitored the system pressure to see when we made pressure they ment me had a full die and needed to empty the slug.

That's basically what I'd like to do. I like the idea of cycling the cylinder and monitoring the pressure to tell when the puck is a full size. It may not really be necessary with the granular chips but the band saw shavings are so light they would certainly take a couple fillings. Keep an eye on the thread... I may need some help when it comes time to automate. I'll likely throw a manual valve on it just to test everything before I started scrounging parts. My power unit came off a press and it does have a couple fancy electric valves... with lots of wires. I'll snap some photos and write down the model numbers tomorrow.

Anything over 90% compression sounds pretty good. How efficient will it be for doing mass quantities of chips? Seems like you need a hinged mold to pull the briquettes out easily or an ejector pin to push them back up and out.

Wonder if those extra ports are for some kind of partial extension mode...

There is only once "extra" port and it was factory sealed. I had to use a breaker bar on it. Some of these cylinders have pressure sensors mounted to them, I suspect that is what it's for. I'm planning on using a flat plate in a slot. When it is extracted the puck will be pushed ahead of it and when it closes for another cycle it will push the puck out. If that makes sense. I'm going to get the power unit out of the basement where I can hook it up and see what the cylinder dimensions are extended and retracted before I start designing the machine in cad.

I was very happy with the compression density. Thanks again for the formula help. It's great to be able to establish some real numbers. I'm kinda itching to see what I can do with the big cylinder.

[JeffKiper]

Instead of a big cylinder the shop I did onr for used that knuckle. So the cylinder foce was very little. (Note "very little" = low cost to them) they went to a local hydraulic repair shop and looked at the cylinders that had been repaired and noy picked up. They figured it was less then 0.10 on the $1.00 for all the purchased parts this way.

[forhire]

Instead of a big cylinder the shop I did onr for used that knuckle. So the cylinder foce was very little. (Note "very little" = low cost to them) they went to a local hydraulic repair shop and looked at the cylinders that had been repaired and noy picked up. They figured it was less then 0.10 on the $1.00 for all the purchased parts this way.

I like the knuckle idea. The use of a smaller cylinder would mean improved cycle time and as you mentioned lower build costs. I already had the cylinder... and the hydraulic unit... so I'll see how it goes. If I don't like it as a briquetter... I'll convert it to a shop press.

[jones6780]

Are you thinking of using the hydraulic cylinder to actuate a knuckle press? How are you going to extract the briquet when compressed?

[forhire]

Are you thinking of using the hydraulic cylinder to actuate a knuckle press? How are you going to extract the briquet when compressed?

Not at this time. JeffKiper got me thinking about a knuckle press design... and it's always great to have good, proven ideas to draw from. If I was starting from zero I might go that route. Maybe Jeff will chime in and explain how the puck is ejected. I wonder if he has any photos. Based on his description above in post #27, I suspect the knuckle allows full extension for ejection. Just like in the direct push version, you stop short of the bottom of the cylinder when compressing, retract a little, then open the bottom of the cylinder and push it out before fully retracting.

[zapster]

Unless they are Stainless... Brass...Bronze... Copper...
All chips go straight into the dumpster.


...zap!

[forhire]

Unless they are Stainless... Brass...Bronze... Copper...
All chips go straight into the dumpster.

I turn way too much aluminum to dumpster it... scrap return is factored into the operating costs. I only scrap the granular turnings. The rest of the chips get sorted and the local Boy Scout troop picks them up as part of their annual scrap metal drive. Looking around the shop... they missed two trash cans of band saw shavings.

[forhire]

I've been thinking of doing a vertical design similar to this. I think the vertical will take up less space. I also like the simplicity of the loading mechanism. This will work well with the granular chips which represent at least 90% of my scrap.

[dbotos]

That's a nice design with the funnel feed and retracting base block. R&D = ripoff and duplicate.

[forhire]

So you see the basic plunger. What kind of steel would be ideal?

[JeffKiper]

I was thinking AR400 or 4145 hardened. Those chips are abrasive.

that was way before I took any pictures of projects. I barely take pictures now. If or when you get ready automated this and need some help on electrical side PM me

[jones6780]

Cool video, simple except for the automation.

[dbotos]

So you see the basic plunger. What kind of steel would be ideal?

Free. I would just start with plain old stuff you've got laying around. You might be surprised how much life you get out of it. I had to design/make a jet catcher for a special application on our waterjet and we thought we were going to have to use expensive carbide wear plates, but we just threw some pieces of A36 on it and that's been working great. You could always put some hardfacing on the end and grind it flat if it needs something a little tougher.

[forhire]

Today has been an expensive day. I started out by having all the hoses built and buying enough oil to load up the power unit. I then had to pull the power unit out of the basement, which involves an old chain fall... and removing a few treads from the stairs. Once I had the power unit in the shop I played with the solenoid valves and verified they worked. They worked great off 24V DC. It appears the by-pass can be adjusted... but I didn't fiddle with anything. More in next post.

[forhire]

I then loaded the tank with oil. I opted to lift the motor assembly and dump full pails into the tank rather than attempting to fill it through the little filler. This was one of the easy tasks of the day. I also verified my lifting bracket could still lift the whole power unit when full of oil... right now it's on a pallet and I don't want to drain it before lifting. It lifted just fine even with over 200 lbs of oil in it. I then went to work hooking up all the hoses. The only gotcha was the previously un-used B port on the bottom was blocked by the filler cap. A few more fittings to get around it. Once all the hoses were on I went to work on wiring the motor. It was wired for 460V so I re-wired it for 240V. I used the nifty phase sequence indicator that I bought at the flea market a couple weeks ago... FOR A DOLLAR!... to make sure I would have the motor turning the right directions. I then powered it up and started playing with it. It went in and out no problem. Now the bad news in the next post.

[forhire]

Here's the BAD news. It appear this is an accumulator. I assumed it was 6" stroke with an additional 1/4". Not so at all. It only has a 4" stroke. Note the little 4 written about the size in the earlier photos. And because the tandem cylinder in back runs the center piston... the center only moves 1/4" in or out. I was sold the cylinder as being a 6" stroke. Not sure where they came up with that number.

I guess I'm either looking for another cylinder or changing the design to something else. I guess I'm glad I hooked it up before I got to far into it. It was just and expensive education.

At least the power unit works well and now I understand the solenoids.

[forhire]

did a small press for a shop a few years ago. We made a knuckle press for the stroke action. Simple 3 point press http://thelibraryofmanufacturing.com/presses.html.

Being that I'm back to the drawing board. This looks more interesting.

Any idea how to calculate the mechanical advantage of the three point press?

[forhire]

Ok, I think it's the Principal of Virtual Work. The example in my text book shows a Toggle Vise ABC with the formulas. Now I need to figure out what I'm looking at.

Any math whizzes in the house?

[JeffKiper]

http://www.minster.com/products/pres...atalog/185.pdf
look at the botom image on page 2

[forhire]

http://www.minster.com/products/pres...atalog/185.pdf
look at the bottom image on page 2

In the diagram the input is 4T and 20T compression. That's 5x! I'd like to be able to run some numbers.

It appears because the arms are equal tangent I can use the reduced formula Q=0.5*P*tan(angle), see the above diagram. At nearly straight, say 170 degrees, the combined angle of 85, with and input of 10T, the solution would be 57.15=0.5*10*tan(85). Well putting 10T into this machine, with my current hydraulic unit I'd require a 5" cylinder to input the 10T.

The biggest issue I see with this design, is that all the force multiplication happens at the point where the arms are straightest. I still need about 2" of travel to eject the puck. More to puzzle.

[JeffKiper]

What about a removable bottom like they had in the video?
So if you put 10 t into the knuckle you would get 57t

[forhire]

What about a removable bottom like they had in the video?
So if you put 10 t into the knuckle you would get 57t

The removable bottom is the plan but I still need something to push it out once the bottom is retracted. At nearly straight, say 179.9 degrees the tonnage is crazy high, like 5729 tons, with a 10 ton input. So, I think what I need to do is to design some are arms and play with the travel and angles.