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Thread: The last word on 7014?

  1. #51
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    FB, I really appreciate your reply, and apologize for all the trouble you went to to compose it. For the sake of succinctness, however, I wasn't really looking for a "yes" or "no" answer; I was looking for "the truth" about 7014's strengths and weaknesses. As a beginner, it was frustrating to read some people saying their daddies built battleships with it, and others (many others) saying it was best for thin sheet metal, and should never be used where strength is important. But you're absolutely right - the rod choice isn't everything that determines how well a weld holds; there are many other factors as well.

  2. #52
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    Why not use 7010?

  3. #53
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    Nice thread revival... lol. Most of the posters from 2011 have long stopped posting, or passed away!
    Murphy's Golden Rule: Whoever has the gold, makes the rules.

  4. #54
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    Where live the E7014 was used on farms and known as the farmers rod.
    But some welders did like for welding too.

    Most of fab shops where I live in 1960's used E6011, E6013 and E7024. They stock 1/8 and 5/32" and little 1/16" of E6013
    They use very little E7018

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by Ruark View Post
    After reading several web sites and searching this and other forums, I still haven't come up with a definitive conclusion about 7014, at least from the perspective of an AC-only welder. I have read comments like:

    "I would never use 7014 for any weld where strength was important."

    "7014 is just as strong as 7018/7018AC, and doesn't need to be stored in an oven."

    "7014 is a medium-penetration rod, the same as 7018."

    "7014 is a light-penetration rod, used mostly with sheet metal."

    "I've used 7014 on our farm equipment for many years, and have never had a weld failure."

    Both Lincoln and Hobart's web sites say 7014 is "ideal for applications requiring light penetration and faster travel speeds."

    Miller's site doesn't even mention it: "Common electrodes used for general work include 6010, 6011, 6013, 7018 and 7024, each of which has specific properties."

    Lincoln's site says 7014 is good for "Maintenance and repair welding, sheet metal and fillet welds, and heavy sections."

    It would be useful, especially for us beginners, to hear from some of the more knowledgeable members of this forum on the subject, even if they disagree, and maybe we can reach some consensus. One gets the impression that 7014 is some kind of "orphan child" of the electrode world.

  5. #55
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    After reading several web sites and searching this and other forums, I still haven't come up with a definitive conclusion about 7014, at least from the perspective of an AC-only welder.
    It would be useful, especially for us beginners, to hear from some of the more knowledgeable members of this forum on the subject, even if they disagree

    Quote Originally Posted by Welding Fool View Post
    Why not use 7010?

    1) It doesn't work well on AC only welders

    2) It doesn't work well on Low OCV welders.

    3) It doesn't work well with most smaller inverters.

    4) Not always available as other welding rods, one of my welding shops only carries it in 50lb. boxes.

    7010, 8010 is great for 300 amp engine driven pipeliners, but not so much for learners on a AC buzzer, or a cheap lunch box inverters.
    Airco 250 ac/dc Heliwelder Square wave
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    Miller AEAD-200

  6. #56
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    In my opinion 7018 is the best all around welding rod for steel there is an AC version but there are a lot of reasonable DC capable small welders. I learned the hard way teaching myself but over time I do stick welding with 7018. I feel a lot of rural farmers have gone to mig and that's great too. Most field welding requires vertical and overhead welding and for stick that's 7018. If you have big heavy flat welding to do I guess 7024 might be useful. Some do nice work with AC stick wire but that's the exception not the rule.

  7. #57
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    E7018 is low hydrogen rod.
    For work best it need to per heat to over 250 .

    I have use a lot of E7018.
    Most work does not need E7018 it main purpose is a good xray and do not heat the rod is loss all it xray and has a lot of gas bubbles.
    Other rods do not have this problem

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by Eelspike View Post
    In my opinion 7018 is the best all around welding rod for steel there is an AC version but there are a lot of reasonable DC capable small welders. I learned the hard way teaching myself but over time I do stick welding with 7018. I feel a lot of rural farmers have gone to mig and that's great too. Most field welding requires vertical and overhead welding and for stick that's 7018. If you have big heavy flat welding to do I guess 7024 might be useful. Some do nice work with AC stick wire but that's the exception not the rule.

  8. #58
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    6013 is often referred to as the farmer rod not 7014. 7014 is a much better rod for general welding but not as strong or designed for high stress welds like 7018. It's almost to the point of annoying reading that 7018 has to be in an oven to produce sound welds. While it used for X-ray quality welds for 95% of general welding it is still the strongest rod by a country mile even if it has been left in an open box nowhere near an oven. CEP did break tests of all the common rods and even 7018 that had been left in an open box for month's was still the strongest rod. Keep it dry and preferably in a sealed rod keeper and it will serve you well. No need what-so- ever to need a rod oven unless you are doing critical code work. 7014 should weld OK on an AC buzz box.

  9. #59
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    Where live E7014 was call farmer rod
    Why would use E7018 if not doing Xray quality welding.

    A36 is what most use are welding the Min Yield is 36,000
    E60XX Min Yield is 50,000
    E70XX Min Yield is 57,000

    Either E60XX or E70XX will work great for everyday welding.

    If selling a job it is E7018 most will think a better rod and just per heat the rod. No point in in try something other rods. But for your own work use a rod that simpler to use.

    I had license so did everything by the book.

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by Welder Dave View Post
    6013 is often referred to as the farmer rod not 7014. 7014 is a much better rod for general welding but not as strong or designed for high stress welds like 7018. It's almost to the point of annoying reading that 7018 has to be in an oven to produce sound welds. While it used for X-ray quality welds for 95% of general welding it is still the strongest rod by a country mile even if it has been left in an open box nowhere near an oven. CEP did break tests of all the common rods and even 7018 that had been left in an open box for month's was still the strongest rod. Keep it dry and preferably in a sealed rod keeper and it will serve you well. No need what-so- ever to need a rod oven unless you are doing critical code work. 7014 should weld OK on an AC buzz box.
    Last edited by smithdoor; 05-25-2022 at 11:57 PM.

  10. #60
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    The 1st thing you need to do before welding anything is determine what type of load it is, static or dynamic. Static is like a table that just sits there. Dynamic is like a table that has 1000lbs. dropped on it from 10 ft. above. 7018 is for dynamic loading and 7014 is for static loading. Tensile strength isn't really that big a part of the equation. Most rods for dynamic loading also work for static loading but rods designed for static loading shouldn't be used on dynamic loaded weldments. If you only have 1 rod in your arsenal 7018 is the rod of choice. 6010/6011 are also for dynamic loads. 7024 is a more heavily coated iron powder rod like 7014 and was the go to production rod until flux-core came along. It was used extensively for things like oilfield tanks that just basically sat there. Burned many pounds of it back in the early 80's. 7018 isn't a hard rod to use. It takes a little practice like anything else but once you get used to it out of position welding is much easier than other rods with heavy coatings.

  11. #61
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    I agree

    I did not use E7014 as about same pen (med pen rod) as E7018 .
    If was being paid by hour I never use E7014 or E7024.

    Today I use would fluxcore easier no per heat.

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by Welder Dave View Post
    The 1st thing you need to do before welding anything is determine what type of load it is, static or dynamic. Static is like a table that just sits there. Dynamic is like a table that has 1000lbs. dropped on it from 10 ft. above. 7018 is for dynamic loading and 7014 is for static loading. Tensile strength isn't really that big a part of the equation. Most rods for dynamic loading also work for static loading but rods designed for static loading shouldn't be used on dynamic loaded weldments. If you only have 1 rod in your arsenal 7018 is the rod of choice. 6010/6011 are also for dynamic loads. 7024 is a more heavily coated iron powder rod like 7014 and was the go to production rod until flux-core came along. It was used extensively for things like oilfield tanks that just basically sat there. Burned many pounds of it back in the early 80's. 7018 isn't a hard rod to use. It takes a little practice like anything else but once you get used to it out of position welding is much easier than other rods with heavy coatings.

  12. #62
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    I never used 7014 til a year or so ago I found some Joe had in the shop, I had some time to kill not having a whole lot to do so I tried em out on some scrap we had layin around...I think they were 5/32. I wasnt crazy about them at all. Maybe because Ive always used 7018 and thats what Im used to useing if Im stick welding. If I am buyin the rods I wouldnt waste the money on em...just my opinion...what anyone else wants to use is their busness

  13. #63
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    I agree
    We get paid good money for our work.
    I believe in only best and the way the manufacturer recommends for my work.

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by old miner called Pop View Post
    I never used 7014 til a year or so ago I found some Joe had in the shop, I had some time to kill not having a whole lot to do so I tried em out on some scrap we had layin around...I think they were 5/32. I wasnt crazy about them at all. Maybe because Ive always used 7018 and thats what Im used to useing if Im stick welding. If I am buyin the rods I wouldnt waste the money on em...just my opinion...what anyone else wants to use is their busness

  14. #64
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    They have a place, just not Your place.

  15. #65
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    I guess the last word on 7014 would be.... fourteen?

    Edit; is this a trick question? This won't be on the test, will it???
    Sent from my Lincoln Buzzbox using Tapatalk

  16. #66
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    i believe its
    6013 is rutile flux less than 25% iron powder mixed in
    7014 is rutile with 25 to less than 50% iron powder
    7024 is rutile is 50% iron powder mixed in
    .
    higher iron powder more drippy and harder to use out of position, 7014 is rated out of position or all positions (barely but it faster welding),
    since has iron powder tends to run hotter amps (compared to 6013)
    .
    6013 is often used for dab dab welding on 16ga (usually 3/32" or less thickness) at about 75 amps.
    dab welding is about 3 seconds and stop arc usually wait at least 3 seconds and repeat, hard to describe it (pulse welding?)
    repeated hot tacks ?, youtube has many videos showing stick welding 1/16" thick with 3/32 rod at 70 to 80 amps dab dab
    welding requires easy to restart arc rod, sometimes they weld normally again over dab dab weld if concerned about strength.
    its not high strength, in so much they want something to weld 16ga tubing often hand railing without burning holes through it.
    ......before watching videos i would have said its impossible to easily stick weld 16ga tubing but videos show it is possible.
    they also weld stainless 16ga tubing (hand railing) with 308-16 or rutile flux stick rod using dab dab although they might use
    2mm rod (5/64") at about 50 or 55 amps
    .
    some 6013 is rutile flux with some cellulose mixed in, sort of combined 6013 / 6011 with advantages of both but since mix is closer
    to 6013 its labeled 6013 not 6011

  17. #67
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eelspike View Post
    In my opinion 7018 is the best all around welding rod for steel there is an AC version but there are a lot of reasonable DC capable small welders. I learned the hard way teaching myself but over time I do stick welding with 7018. I feel a lot of rural farmers have gone to mig and that's great too. Most field welding requires vertical and overhead welding and for stick that's 7018. If you have big heavy flat welding to do I guess 7024 might be useful. Some do nice work with AC stick wire but that's the exception not the rule.
    The thing about "farmers", and welding, always amazes me.

    Does the average farmer do any worse work than I see here occasionally, or on the 4x4 sites?

    And For God's Sake..................what is a "rural" farmer???? Is that like.........opposed to a "metropolitan" farmer??

    Until I started losing my eyesight, I considered(maybe unfairly so) my work to be on par with most job shops in the area. And, I'd just about guarantee that I'm not the exception to the rule. There's a lot of very good fabrication/repair that goes on in these "rural" parts of the country.

    Disparaging is the refuge for the incompetent. If you're on your game, you really don't need to slam anyone else. You don't care, you just go about your daily business.

    IMHO of course.

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  19. #68
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    I can tell why so think E7018 is a great everyday welding rod.

    The two main reason for using E7018
    1) Doing working that maybe Xray

    2) Doing welding for other E7018 so helps sells jobs.

    There is a third reason is the challenge of Welding with E7018.

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by farmersammm View Post
    The thing about "farmers", and welding, always amazes me.

    Does the average farmer do any worse work than I see here occasionally, or on the 4x4 sites?

    And For God's Sake..................what is a "rural" farmer???? Is that like.........opposed to a "metropolitan" farmer??

    Until I started losing my eyesight, I considered(maybe unfairly so) my work to be on par with most job shops in the area. And, I'd just about guarantee that I'm not the exception to the rule. There's a lot of very good fabrication/repair that goes on in these "rural" parts of the country.

    Disparaging is the refuge for the incompetent. If you're on your game, you really don't need to slam anyone else. You don't care, you just go about your daily business.

    IMHO of course.

  20. #69
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    There are for sure a lot of exceptional weldors on farms. There are also farmers who could really benefit from a welding course just the same as a lot of DIYers. I think a lot people in all circles don't realize welding takes a lot of practice. They think they can buy a welder and just go about welding anything and everything. Welding requires a lot of skill and having to learn that skill looking through a small dark lens makes it that much more difficult. Some think hiring an experienced weldor is too expensive but in reality it could work out less expensive having a lasting repair or project built. Not much different than people who think it's too expensive to hire a skid steer so rent a smaller one for a day or two at $250/day or more plus delivery and pick up fee's. They mess around for 2 days to do a poor job that an experienced operator could do much better in a 1/4 of the time. Hire a skid steer at $75/hr. for 4 hours costs $300. Even if takes an additional hour, they're saving over $100 and get a superior finished project. I've never understood why weldors often get a bad rap for not being too smart and are just way too expensive.

    On the subject of 7018, it is just plain a good rod to use for just about anything that needs to be welded. It's the best if you're not sure what type of steel it is, it has low temperature strength and isn't really that hard to use. Try hot tacking with a rod other than 7018 it will most surely break. Hot tacking is when you put a small hot tack on your 2 pieces and then whack 1 piece with a hammer to put in proper alignment. 7018 will stretch a little when hot (not red hot)and still hold. 7014 forget it. However on a project with a lot of welding that isn't under a lot of stress, most weldors would use a rod like 7014/7024 for higher deposition rates. 7018 isn't that much more expensive and is a superior all purpose rod. 6010/6011 is the other rod most weldors would have on hand. They are good for dirty, rusty, painted, galvanized steel and give excellent penetration on joints that may be hard to prep for good penetration.
    Last edited by Welder Dave; 05-31-2022 at 03:11 AM.

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  22. #70
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    Disparaging is the refuge for the incompetent. If you're on your game, you really don't need to slam anyone else. You don't care, you just go about your daily business.

    IMHO of course.[/QUOTE]



    There it is right there Sam...mind your busness stay in your own lane

  23. #71
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    Forums like this are a really good way to get some sound advice on how to improve your skills even if you have a lot of experience. There's always new stuff to learn and better techniques when it comes to welding. Everybody had to learn at some point. I'd never be close in 10 lifetimes to having the skill someone like Ttoks has. There's also things I've learned from people brand new to welding that I would have never thought of. I try to pass on what I've learned. I consider it a compliment if someone asks for my advice on something. Some people don't like to pass on their knowledge, they feel threatened or something. CEP was fantastic at doing and trying things to help people learn. He is very missed. You'd really had to offend him to get a negative response. Even then he'd just shrug it off.

  24. #72
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    I am with Welder Dave,, my "go to" rod is 7018,,
    I have 7014, but, other than some shelf type application, I will not use it.

    7014 when used out of position (meaning other than flat) seems to make a weld bead that "looks" correct while welding.
    Then, when the flux is removed, there is a big void where the metal is only bonded to one part.

    That flux is tremendous at hiding the welding results during welding.
    I can not remember having a weld void with any type rod,, other than 7014,, in my last 30 years of welding.

    I have 20 pounds of 7018 on a shelf in the house,, when I have used 10 pounds, I find a good price on some more.

  25. #73
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    I agree too for a sales tool and Xray work you can not go wrong.
    When I was doing a lot stick welding I would buy 250 pounds at a time.

    The work I did could xray years later to follow all the rules for E7018.
    After the North Ridge earthquake the went back and Xray most welds in the earthquake area.
    The good news for me I use mostly E7018 since 1970's. None of my work failed the test.

    The downside to (E7018) rod it is slower and doing quoted work it is not the best.

    But doing work by hour I like (E7018) rod . The customer is paying for my work and doing the best job.

    Why use by hour work fluxcore like E71T-11 and E71T-1 with CO2 witch is very fast and is just good as E7018.

    As far as all other work most rods will work too.

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by SweetMK View Post
    I am with Welder Dave,, my "go to" rod is 7018,,
    I have 7014, but, other than some shelf type application, I will not use it.

    7014 when used out of position (meaning other than flat) seems to make a weld bead that "looks" correct while welding.
    Then, when the flux is removed, there is a big void where the metal is only bonded to one part.

    That flux is tremendous at hiding the welding results during welding.
    I can not remember having a weld void with any type rod,, other than 7014,, in my last 30 years of welding.

    I have 20 pounds of 7018 on a shelf in the house,, when I have used 10 pounds, I find a good price on some more.

  26. #74
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    Quote Originally Posted by SweetMK View Post
    That flux is tremendous at hiding the welding results during welding.
    I can not remember having a weld void with any type rod,, other than 7014,, in my last 30 years of welding.
    +1

    7014 seems to make about 5 gallons of slag for every 1 teaspoon of steel deposited in the weld puddle. I've never seen so much slag with any other rod!

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  28. #75
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    Re: The last word on 7014?

    Try E7024 it has most.
    But both E7014 and E7024 is a production rod for higher speed welding/deposit rate .

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by StandarDyne View Post
    +1

    7014 seems to make about 5 gallons of slag for every 1 teaspoon of steel deposited in the weld puddle. I've never seen so much slag with any other rod!

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