Thermal Arc Fabricator 181i mig/tig/stick

[waferhead]

Fabricator 211i will be 115vac/230vac single phase , June 1st.

Basically a CIGWELD 200i with auto-line?
Can't seem to find the manual, here's the sales flyer.
http://apacdev.thermadyne.com/IM-Upl...20Brochure.pdf
It might very well do 110v already, but in most place on the planet 220v is std power outlets, so 110 capability wouldn't make the feature list.
Anywhere other than North Americal, 220/460v would make more sense for a medium duty unit.

Any more specs/features other than a little mo powa?
(OK, looks same frame size as the 252i, 33lb spools etc)

Last i checked my LWS was STILL having no joy getting me the (factory) TA euro connector to bolt into a US spec181i.
My Spoolgun/torch swap world be a 10 second quick change.

[Brand X]

Last i checked my LWS was STILL having no joy getting me the (factory) TA euro connector to bolt into a US spec181i.
My Spoolgun/torch swap world be a 10 second quick change.

I can't remember if the 181 takes the four pin contactor plug or not? I looked at it, but I did not pay attention to that feature, I have my Tweco Eliminator torque assist gun hooked up with a adapter to my Lincoln feeder (Which adapts to my Thermal-arc with a Lincoln 14 pin to Miller 14 pin adapter), which is the exact same setup as the Thermal 181i. Mine was made by Binzel

Either feeder is live so I can grab either gun. I have them both setup for steel right and it's a killer setup.


http://weldingdirect.com/adkitaircool3.html

[burnit2]

Actually, CigWeld is a Thermadyne company. Machines are marketed differently due to marketing differences with the USA. Same with the Thermadyne European and Asian Markets. Lincoln does the same thing. It's all about what people are used to. The new 252 is being made in New Hampshire and is Loaded with industry leading features. Both the 181i and 252i offer inductance control to dial out spatter and to run Stainless Steel like units that cost 5X more.; Cool stuff, Check them out on Thermadynes Website.

[Brand X]

. Both the 181i and 252i offer inductance control to dial out spatter and to run Stainless Steel like units that cost 5X more.; Cool stuff, Check them out on Thermadynes Website.

Some machines around the price of have more advanced SS welding. Inductance is one thing and Slope for SS welding is another. The ones that are 5 times as much, have pretty neat features, like advanced pulse settings.

[waferhead]

When I said "Cigweld 200i" I meant it ~literally.
The color and the stickers are likely the only external difference, other than the probably new 110/220 auto line inverter board.

I'm just curious if that's the ONLY difference.

I'll probably want that 4" spool adapter sooner or later, I'll see if my LWS can get them...

The 181i has an 8 pin remote socket.
Can do wire speed, volts and amps (depending on mode) remotely if you are so set up.
I assure you, just having wire speed on my spoolgun has saved many laps back over to the welder...
Adding volts adj too will be trivial.

FWIW, I burned some stick the other day with my SW just to test it out after getting power to it,
...Used the TIG torch as a clamp I didn't have a clamp for stick or a place to hook up..
For giggles I used HF start on stick. Worked GREAT, fired right off and laid decent beads on nasty rusty scrap.

It should be possible to do a lift start on the 181i so you aren't running around with a hot stick if you add a finger switch.
(the welder doesn't know/care if it's not a TIG torch)

[knucklehead]

The Fabricator 252 has really sparked my interest but on the Miller thread the guy said they are coming out with a AC/DC Fabricator which sounds really sweet. I might take a ride down to Awisco and check these things out. I still want a Dynasty though,just can't get that machine out of my head.

Just a heads up, the other Fabricator models will NOT be AC/DC....sorry DC only...

[knucklehead]

Looks like a 10 pin on the Spool-gun. Wonder if that means is the Miller 30A will be a direct plug in? Lot's of stuff interchanges with MIller-Thermal. WC-24, and the 30a works on my Thermal 14 pin.. (Arcmaster 400 MST)

The 181i has an 8 pin connector so unfortunately the Weldskill gun is the only one that works with that unit....however the 252i thats out will accept a 30A spoolgun with a trigger cord adapter from Tweco. You will need the adapter to run the 30a gun( it has a resistor that is needed for the 252i to sense that you have the spoolgun plugged in).

[knucklehead]

He is wrong,unless it's OK to put a made in Malaysia sticker on something made in China.. Generally most Reps don't know jack.

Hello, the 181i is made in China...the 252i is made in West Lebanon NH.....FYI>>>

[knucklehead]

That's right. I personally say the label on the machine. "Made in Malaysia".

The 252i and the 211i are coming of the assembly line in the USA. It is made of domestic and imported parts. The Thermadyne rep that I dealt with said it and both will be labeled "Made in USA".

The 211i is also made in China....not sure why those units said Malaysia...the only units produced in Malaysia are Fabricators(transformer based powersupplies) WIre feeders and older Powermaster 500 powersupplies....

[Brand X]

Hello, the 181i is made in China...the 252i is made in West Lebanon NH.....FYI>>>

Just not all the 181i because the two I looked at had made in Malaysia stickers on them. They might be now, but some of the earlier units had made in Malaysia on them. I figure if it comes out with the same quality control as the Chinese tigs, then it's fine..I will stick with my 400 MST for mig welding I want to do. They seem to show up cheap on Ebay, and are some of the finest multi-process machines built. Also I think I like the Little Esab for small like Migs. I am sure it will burn in 3/8 better then the 181. Setup correctly for .035 solid wire (new liner) it's got more top end..

[knucklehead]

The gas valve part# for the European 181i version is listed as W7004908. my local Airgas is trying to put together a package for me, as all the parts are bog std TA/TWECO #s.

He was quite convinced the 181i had the gas valve in them already for some reason...
(the US version manual shows it as well, perhaps they left it in after all... does the US firmware support it?)

The 252 appears to electrically support 2 gas valves, 1 for TIG, 1 for MIG, but only MIG is installed due to alleged lack of room.
I have no idea if the software can be set to run the second valve for TIG/argon.

The 181i Euro version comes equipped as follows:
TWECO Weldskill 180A MIG torch WS180XE-10-3035 (same torch w/Binzel connector)
"Euro"(Binzel) outlet adapter W7004924
Gas solenoid valve assy W7004908 (may be installed already)
Control plug, 8 pin U0A706900
(plug for 8 pin control port, allows remote current/wire speed/voltage control, depending on mode)

Other than the Binzel torch/adaptor, the US version appears identical from the parts breakdown.

Indiana Oxygen basically said "we don't sell that", we'll see if Airgas can look up/order TWECO/TA catalog parts.

The only thing that still concerns me is if the gas valve works for TIG AND MIG modes.
I have no interest in using a manual valve for TIG, that's ridiculous from a gas usage standpoint.

The 181i does have a gas valve but ONLY for the Mig Gun and the Spool gun use....the tig torch that Thermal sells has a gas valve in the handle and the gas hose goes right to the flowmeter on the bottle.....Thermals torch has an on/off switch with a gas valve built into the handle....

[waferhead]

The 181i does have a gas valve but ONLY for the Mig Gun and the Spool gun use....the tig torch that Thermal sells has a gas valve in the handle and the gas hose goes right to the flowmeter on the bottle.....Thermals torch has an on/off switch with a gas valve built into the handle....

...and that's a real shame, since the unit can do pre and post flow etc, and the Euro fitting can provide gas, HTP and ESAB use that method for some spoolgun setups. (And using a euro connector for a TIG torch is perfectly sane)

There is a DIP switch on the mainboard to configure something, but it's undocumented of course...

OTOH you need to switch bottles anyway for TIG unless you have been MIGing aluminum.

Looks like I can get the required "not procurable in the USA" 181i Euro fitting and output guide from England, ~13 Pounds or thereabouts +shipping.

I have ~given up on my LWS, they don't even seem capable of actually doing anything.

[longevity-inc.com]

I like the little Esab mig welders as well, from design to performance, our welders were impressed at the show. Thermadyne did have a large gathering around the 181 however and marketed well in my opinion.

Simon

[CherryBrosRC]

I bought one for a cheap and easy mobile spool gun outfit (aluminum fence and railing) but have been using it mostly for galvanized steel (flux core wire). I love it. It is light and I have a TIG torch behind the seat just incase.

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[waferhead]

I bought one for a cheap and easy mobile spool gun outfit (aluminum fence and railing) but have been using it mostly for galvanized steel (flux core wire). I love it. It is light and I have a TIG torch behind the seat just incase.

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How does it do on aluminum?

Enough power for spray?

[CherryBrosRC]

I was very surprised at how hot the machine runs. Heat hasn't been an issue. We have two other spool guns one on a Lincoln 255 and another on a MillerMatic 200, it is very comparable. In all honesty we have only used it on 1/8 inch wall aluminum tube and channel but It blasted a hole right through it until we turned it way down, it has a great chart inside full of setings for different techniques and materials. I should have listened to it. It amazes me that the thing can hang with most of our 200amp class mig machines but is lighter than our Lincoln SP-135s (that have set in the corner since we got this).
I was able to get one with the spool gun, tig torch and bag for just under 1100 and don't regret it one bit. My two cons are that it draws about 34 amps when the MIG is cranked up so it limits your generator selection but the stick and tig process draw less. And it is my least favorite TIG setup.
If you think you might be interested you should demo one.

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[Brand X]

My two cons are that it draws about 34 amps when the MIG is cranked up so it limits your generator selection but the stick and tig process draw less.

That is the one issue that made me stay with separate units. The Thermal 161s is excellent with using input power, (both on 120/230), and the Esab 200 unbelievable in how it works. I was able to pretty much run full output (.030 solid wire/C-25 gas) using my Thermal-arc Scout 170/ It's only a 4k generator too. Perfect arc starts too. You cannot tell the difference between being plugged into the wall. I just don't think the 181i could get anywhere near that performance. 200 might with PFC. The little Scout is a great unit too. No reason to plug the 161s into that one, unless you need some extra reach or less noise.

[Brand X]

I will say the 181' is much better for Aluminum then the Esab. You could do a few tacks/beads with the Esab, but not much more. (no spool-gun)

[dubl_t]

Thanks everybody for the info on here.....except now I'm REALLY confused

I desperatly wanted the Caddy 200, so sold my lil' Lincoln, only to stumble into a Fabricater at the LWS yesterday which I'm researching now.

Brand X,
where'd you buy your Caddy in PDX? When I checked, Airgas would have to order it.

Thanks, Tom.

[Brand X]

I checked, and their cost was something like $950.00 That means over $1,000.00 easy. I ordered on-line and got it shipped for $850.00. That deal dried up, and it looks like $950 is the cheapest on-line. I would probably get a 181 is I had to spend any more then I did. Too much value in that machine. Still, I love the little Esab for what I am doing.. I'm really happy about how it uses input power, and that was a issue for me. Might not be for someone else..

[stefuel]

I was about to pull the trigger (no pun intended) on the 181i until I discovered here that it was only DC. My old S.A.M mig welder finally bit the big one and I have been looking for a replacement. I have always wanted to move into tig and work with aluminum. This machine cought my eye because of it's multi-process ability and it's small size. The replacement machine will be in my home hobby/workshop which is quite small so everything in one package helps a lot. I don't care to much about stick but tig, mig and plasma along with AC/DC is a must. Any suggestions???

[Sparky#1]

I was about to pull the trigger (no pun intended) on the 181i until I discovered here that it was only DC. My old S.A.M mig welder finally bit the big one and I have been looking for a replacement. I have always wanted to move into tig and work with aluminum. This machine cought my eye because of it's multi-process ability and it's small size. The replacement machine will be in my home hobby/workshop which is quite small so everything in one package helps a lot. I don't care to much about stick but tig, mig and plasma along with AC/DC is a must. Any suggestions???

I hope you're willing to spend some $$$$ or just buy separate machines.

[CherryBrosRC]

I was about to pull the trigger (no pun intended) on the 181i until I discovered here that it was only DC. My old S.A.M mig welder finally bit the big one and I have been looking for a replacement. I have always wanted to move into tig and work with aluminum. This machine cought my eye because of it's multi-process ability and it's small size. The replacement machine will be in my home hobby/workshop which is quite small so everything in one package helps a lot. I don't care to much about stick but tig, mig and plasma along with AC/DC is a must. Any suggestions???

I don't know of an a small AC/DC multiprocess at least not in this price range. Maybe a Chinese machine that does that, I'm not sure...
These machines (181i) are very nice and fit a niche but they don't do everything. I am not very fond of the lift start TIG and use my Maxstar for mobile DC TIG. The real beauty in this machine for me is how stinking mobile it is. To have a .035 gassless fluxcore MIG and SpoolGun outfit in this amp range is like a dream come true for me. The fact that I have a TIG torch, Argon 90 bottle and a viable stick option without loading my Bobcat 225 nt on the truck is a nice bonus, you never know what you might encounter in the field. It doesn't weld pipe rods worth a darn (6011) though everything else Ive tried works well.
I can only say nice things about it. If you get a chance to demo one I think you will be surprised by it. It will not take the place of stand alone inverter TIG / Stick and it isn't AC but it is a heck of an option for MIG and spool gun. I was able to get the whole package for around $1200 (macine, bag, TIG torch, and spool gun). I smile a little every time I put the strap on my shoulder

If you need AC a better option might be a used rectifier MIG and seperate TIG/Stick.

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[dubl_t]

It doesn't weld pipe rods worth a darn (6011)

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Cherry, did you mean 6010?

Also, have you used the spoolgun yet?

Thanks, Tom.

[CherryBrosRC]

I meant to say 6010-6011. 6013's and 7018 work fine. I have used thespool gun. It sounds and sprays a lil different than the rectifiers but it has a sweet result. I prefer to use it over my miller spoolgun but my brother likes the miller so it works out, lol. You can call the Thermal Arc 1-800 # about the rods they are eager to help.

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