P&H Tig

[ewallace]

I just came across a P&H Tig welder very cheap. The machine is AC only! Does anyone know where to find info on these welders? Can you succcesfully weld Thin mild steel on AC with a tig?

[Franz]

What color is the machine?
Does it have a large cast aluminum foot pedal with a ceramic block resistor?
I need the foot pedal if there's a spare laying around.

[ewallace]

It is a big yellow machine with P&H Chemetron on the front. On the little plate on the front that gives the amperage for each setting, it as a column for AC and the amps and a column for DC, but DC is all blank. Yes it does have a cast aluminum foot pedal.

[Franz]

That's a later vintage than mine.
The schematic for the machine should be glued inside one of the side panels. I don't think the machine is AC only, but the easiest way to confirm that would be to open it up and look for the rectifier, probably sylenium, and reactor.
P&H machines are GREAT, BUT, the older units will suffer damage if they are dropped. Definitely test drive before plunking down cash. They produce a very nice TIG arc, and some of them will actually give you decent arc performence on stick as well.
The hi freq tends to screw up when the points get crapped up, and it is usually fixable by cleaning and resetting the points.
Yellow machines are the last production by P&H, so the machine could be late 60s to early 70s. No support is available from the manufacturer, but that's not a problem since those machines work forever as long as you open them up and blow the dust accumulation out every year.

[ewallace]

Should't there be an AC/DC switch on the panel?

[Franz]

Can't say for sure on a yellow machine, never got close to one.
On the older machines there are 2 large rotary switches, one for range, and one for AC/DC/DCRP.
It's possible they made some AC only models for customers who wanted them for Aluminum TIG welding.

[ewallace]

On the right side of the panel there is a hole with a plug that looks like it would take a big rotary switch. I weld 90% aluminum anyway, but I would like to weld some thin (1/16) mild steel. Will it give me a satifactory weld? Can a rectifier be added? By the way, some one had the bright idea to pull all the sheetmetal and paint it inside and out so no shematic.

[Franz]

Definitely sounds like it was an AC only machine, probably custom built for a customer.
Adding just a rectifier won't give you the same DC you'd get with the recitifier and reactor.
I really can't answer how the machine will weld steel with AC, having never done so. Best answer would have to be light it up and see for yourself.

Given the age of the machine, and limitations, how much does the seller want? That would definitely be a deciding factor given the lo prices industrial AC/DC machines are bringing since the advent of inverters.

[ewallace]

500$ with all attachments

[Sberry]

You do have the power to run that monster I take it?

[Franz]

Here, the market with torch, regulator, and water cooler would be $200- at best. The machine is primarily built to be an aluminum TIG machine, and it doesn't have the bells and whistles the later machines do. Since inverters have arrived the old boxes have very little value.

Some adjustment to value may be made for your geographicle area.
The last P&H I bought was complete as listed above, and I paid $75- for it. That was an AC/DC machine, and it can suck 120 amps out of the power line at max current.

[ewallace]

Tried the old dinaour P&H. I was suprised, after laying down the first aluminum bead I was ready to roll my Syncrowave in the lake. Franz, can you send some of those $200 welders, you can't get a used welder of any kind in Texas for 200.

[Franz]

I could send em, but the freight would kill ya.

[axehind]

I looked at a P&H stick welder a few months back. Ernie on the welding newsgroup turned me away from it. He said it's impossible to get them fixed or get parts for them.

axehind

[ewallace]

Yea the freight would be a little rough.

[Franz]

I guess I better not tell you guys about the Thunderbolt I sold for $20- last summer, or you'll get all upset.

[Old Welder]

What color is the machine?
Does it have a large cast aluminum foot pedal with a ceramic block resistor?
I need the foot pedal if there's a spare laying around.

I have the welder to go with it if your interested.

[duaneb55]

Welcome to the forum Old Welder.

You do realize you just responded to a 5 year old thread right?

[Old Welder]

And got a response in 7 minutes, imagine that.

[duaneb55]

Gotta love time warp!

[dougspair]

...That foot pedal looks exactly like mine.....even cracked in the same place...likely from some clown dropping it on the concrete floor in the past...
My machine was made in 1956...300 amps Ac/Dc @60%, hi-freq...works quite well....as good as the newer lincoln and millers...minimum current maybe 3- 5 amps...I can weld the soda cans, and razor blades..runs SMAW pretty well, but not quite as nice as my SAE 200 or the Lincoln 'aircraft' gen-sets...pulls about 90 amps at 240 with max load on it...I can run 1/4" 7018 or even 1/4" 7024 ....or clear down to 1/16" 6013...
Bought this machine and several other Lincoln 225 AC/DC tombstones and 4 gen-sets in 1980....from a guy closing up a shop....I used the P&H for all my TIG work for over 10 years running a welding shop, two TIG torches...225 and 400 amp units, welder has water tank and pump built into base on big wheels......never any problems...just blow out the dust now and then...
I'm guessing the early Lincoln and Miller pedals with big resistor might replace your broken unit...

I just found this thread from searching Google for P&H welders...looks like they stopped making them in the 1960's, now mostly make the big mining stuff...and overhead bridge cranes...well known for the quality and durability of the bridge cranes...they last a long time...like the welders..

[dougspair]

...Oh...lest I forget....you're not likely to get a good weld on steel with AC...it's usually just for TIG on Aluminum or Magnesium....and...
Even though I've got a good background in electrical/electronics...I'd shy away from tryting to convert a AC only machine to D.C. Could get to be a big job and $$$ real quick...perhaps look for an old Lincoln 300/300....?

[dougspair]

...My P&H has schematic on inside of a hinged cover on the back...maybe after it stops raining..I'll go see if I can get a picture of it for you who are interested...

[worntorn]

I have an old 1950s P+H 400 amp straight AC machine. It came to me set up for stick welding and that's all I've ever used it for. Prior to using this machine I figured all of the nicest stick machines were DC output. This old AC P&H is as nice or nicer than any DC welder I've ever used, including a very good newish 500 AMP Miller DC.

The P+H spent most of it's life in a truck body fabrication shop being used for construction of aluminium Gravel Truck boxes. They had it set up for TIG.
A friend of mine worked at this company for a year or two. He said this machine was the crew favourite out of 8 or ten various heavy duty Tig setups there. When the company closed up he scooped the old P+H, but the Tig setup was taken by others. I got the machine from him in a trade.
What is required in order to set a machine like this up for TIG?
Is it feasible to use a machine like this for Tig welding .065 wall 304 SS tubing? My current understanding is that DC is best for SS however it can also be tig welded on AC.

Glen

[denrep]

Worntorn - Does the machine have high-frequency, gas control, and remote control capabilities? Or is it just a basic transformer-type welder?

Good Luck