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Thread: Help the Shop Teacher!

  1. #76
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by gijoe985 View Post
    Well, it passed all of the code inspections.

    I'm really just along for the ride on all of this. I am given what I am given and trying to make it all work. I'm glad to have your guys' opinions though. There is no other support for me here in the district.
    That's all well and good. If you can't see the possible dangers of arcing across that setup or having it get damaged in some other way, nothing will convince you otherwise. Hopefully you don't prove me right on this one.
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  2. #77
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    In an education facility, your usually not going to have the oxy acetylene header system charged and in service when your teaching any type of electric arc welding.
    Jason
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  3. #78
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    If you didn't already inherit a library with your welding shop, Lincoln Electric has quite a collection of books:
    https://www.jflf.org/SearchResults.a...show=15&page=2
    There's a whole series on just shop projects as well as an "Instructor Pack" for teachers.

  4. #79
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    Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by gijoe985 View Post
    One of my proposed safety protocols was going to be that you could not stick weld if the oxy hoses were hooked up. The oxy hoses would be stored in a cabinet and not brought out unless the person was in fact oxy welding.

    Would that work?

    (I still need to decide if we need to modify half to tables to be metal or firebrick by default.)
    When using the oxy acetylene system, no electric arc welding is taking place. No exceptions.
    Vice versa, when teaching any type of electric arc welding, the oxygen/acetylene header system is completely shut down and bottles are shut off and disconnected from the header system.
    Jason
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  5. #80
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by snoeproe View Post
    When using the oxy acetylene system, no electric arc welding is taking place. No exceptions.
    Vice versa, when teaching any type of electric arc welding, the oxygen/acetylene header system is completely shut down and bottles are shut off and disconnected from the header system.
    Yep.
    People who don't teach may not understand that kids do stuff like:
    "I wonder, if I touch the rod there will it spark? Maybe over here?"
    "Maybe if I weld and get the tip hot, I can melt it into stuff and make holes."
    ...etc...
    Dave J.

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  6. #81
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    When I was in school 25 years ago our welding booths were separate from the oa area by a short brick wall with welding booths on the back side and more than once people would get a surprise while welding when someone would hold a unlit torch up to the cracks in the divider panels. While keeping the hoses etc locked away will help your piping and regulators are still subject to damage and shenanigans. I doubt you’ll want to leak test the system for each use
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  7. #82
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Yeah, the metal shop that just got taken down had 16 ac welding booths and 12 oxy stations.... I've got 8 booths total... But that's better than 0...

  8. #83
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by MinnesotaDave View Post
    Yep.
    People who don't teach may not understand that kids do stuff like:
    "I wonder, if I touch the rod there will it spark? Maybe over here?"
    "Maybe if I weld and get the tip hot, I can melt it into stuff and make holes."
    ...etc...
    This was exactly my thought. Kids do stupid stuff, plain and simple. They torch hoses are the least of my concerns, it's the metal piping and regulators that are the safety issues. Even without that, who would expose their regulators to direct weld spatter?
    Miller xmt304, Miller S22 p12, Miier Maxstar SD, Miller 252 w 30A, Miller super32p12, Lincoln Ranger 9, Thermal Arc 181I with spoolgun, Hypertherm 10000 ,Smith torches. Esab 161lts miniarc.

  9. #84
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by MinnesotaDave View Post
    Yep.
    People who don't teach may not understand that kids do stuff like:
    "I wonder, if I touch the rod there will it spark? Maybe over here?"
    "Maybe if I weld and get the tip hot, I can melt it into stuff and make holes."
    ...etc...
    I'm not dealing with kids in my college class, they're adults. But, all my processes I teach are completely under control by me, meaning nothing starts without my allowing it. Eg; all the tips and gas nozzles for our mig welders are removed from the guns and locked up. The rod oven holding our 7018 electrodes is also locked up (we only use 7018 rod). The flint strikers for our oxy fuel set ups are locked up. Nothing gets started, without me unlocking something to allow the students to commence the process they are currently learning. It's the way it has to be and they understand that and it helps install respect for the teacher/instructor. Sure, the students could dig out stub rods from the trash or use a cigarette lighter to light a torch etc, but when you have your students respect (I'm a Jman in the trade with multiple certs) and they understand the shop rules, they follow them. They follow the shop policies because they have respect for their instructor.
    Jason
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  10. #85
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by snoeproe View Post
    I'm not dealing with kids in my college class, they're adults. But, all my processes I teach are completely under control by me, meaning nothing starts without my allowing it. Eg; all the tips and gas nozzles for our mig welders are removed from the guns and locked up. The rod oven holding our 7018 electrodes is also locked up (we only use 7018 rod). The flint strikers for our oxy fuel set ups are locked up. Nothing gets started, without me unlocking something to allow the students to commence the process they are currently learning. It's the way it has to be and they understand that and it helps install respect for the teacher/instructor. Sure, the students could dig out stub rods from the trash or use a cigarette lighter to light a torch etc, but when you have your students respect (I'm a Jman in the trade with multiple certs) and they understand the shop rules, they follow them. They follow the shop policies because they have respect for their instructor.
    Yep, adults are a completely different animal than a 9th grader.
    Dave J.

    Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~

    Syncro 350
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    Tried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.

  11. #86
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by MinnesotaDave View Post
    Yep, adults are a completely different animal than a 9th grader.
    Look at how mature all the adults on this site act.

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  12. #87
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by psacustomcreations View Post
    Look at how mature all the adults on this site act.

    Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
    Dave J.

    Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~

    Syncro 350
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    Thermal Arc 161 and 300
    MM210
    Dialarc
    Tried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.

  13. #88
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    For the OP shop teacher: Miller Electric has a free online access program for welding teachers.

    https://openbook.millerwelds.com/

    Could be of use to you?

    Don't forget to order your welding rods and stuff from the Lincoln school portal. Rods for about $1 per pound is tough to beat.
    Dave J.

    Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~

    Syncro 350
    Invertec v250-s
    Thermal Arc 161 and 300
    MM210
    Dialarc
    Tried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.

  14. #89
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by M J D View Post
    This was exactly my thought. Kids do stupid stuff, plain and simple. They torch hoses are the least of my concerns, it's the metal piping and regulators that are the safety issues. Even without that, who would expose their regulators to direct weld spatter?
    Wether you like the oxy fuel header system or not, there's a reason many education facilities have them. Insurance companies like them. When you weight in the pros and cons of the header system, insurance companies believe they are the safest way to teach oxy fuel to students with the least amount of liability and risk involved for everyone. We had a header system in the welding school I attended and I liked it, we never had any issues.
    Jason
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  15. #90
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by snoeproe View Post
    Wether you like the oxy fuel header system or not, there's a reason many education facilities have them. Insurance companies like them. When you weight in the pros and cons of the header system, insurance companies believe they are the safest way to teach oxy fuel to students with the least amount of liability and risk involved for everyone. We had a header system in the welding school I attended and I liked it, we never had any issues.
    Did you stick weld right next to the regulator? If so , I would seriously question your teaching capability.
    Miller xmt304, Miller S22 p12, Miier Maxstar SD, Miller 252 w 30A, Miller super32p12, Lincoln Ranger 9, Thermal Arc 181I with spoolgun, Hypertherm 10000 ,Smith torches. Esab 161lts miniarc.

  16. #91
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    I dont have an oxy acetylene header system in the school I teach at. I think you should re read the posts. Your missing details.
    I said, the welding school I attended, had a header system in place. I was a student in the welding school I attended, I wasn't the teacher at the welding school I attended. We never had any issues or destroyed any regulators while stick welding with regulators on the wall in our booths.
    I'm now teaching but not in the same school that I attended prior to starting my career.
    Looking at the OP's photos of his booths, his regulators appear to be approximately 2-3 feet above his work tables, the tables look movable. The bricks are 10-12" tall. You really thing your going to destroy your regulators with weld spatter and sparks when they're 3 feet above your work table which can be moved in the booth?
    Jason
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  17. #92
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by snoeproe View Post
    When using the oxy acetylene system, no electric arc welding is taking place. No exceptions.
    Vice versa, when teaching any type of electric arc welding, the oxygen/acetylene header system is completely shut down and bottles are shut off and disconnected from the header system.
    This would imply you as the teacher
    Miller xmt304, Miller S22 p12, Miier Maxstar SD, Miller 252 w 30A, Miller super32p12, Lincoln Ranger 9, Thermal Arc 181I with spoolgun, Hypertherm 10000 ,Smith torches. Esab 161lts miniarc.

  18. #93
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by snoeproe View Post
    I'm not dealing with kids in my college class, they're adults. But, all my processes I teach are completely under control by me, meaning nothing starts without my allowing it. Eg; all the tips and gas nozzles for our mig welders are removed from the guns and locked up. The rod oven holding our 7018 electrodes is also locked up (we only use 7018 rod). The flint strikers for our oxy fuel set ups are locked up. Nothing gets started, without me unlocking something to allow the students to commence the process they are currently learning. It's the way it has to be and they understand that and it helps install respect for the teacher/instructor. Sure, the students could dig out stub rods from the trash or use a cigarette lighter to light a torch etc, but when you have your students respect (I'm a Jman in the trade with multiple certs) and they understand the shop rules, they follow them. They follow the shop policies because they have respect for their instructor.
    This as well
    Miller xmt304, Miller S22 p12, Miier Maxstar SD, Miller 252 w 30A, Miller super32p12, Lincoln Ranger 9, Thermal Arc 181I with spoolgun, Hypertherm 10000 ,Smith torches. Esab 161lts miniarc.

  19. #94
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Quote Originally Posted by snoeproe View Post
    I dont have an oxy acetylene header system in the school I teach at. I think you should re read the posts. Your missing details.
    I said, the welding school I attended, had a header system in place. I was a student in the welding school I attended, I wasn't the teacher at the welding school I attended. We never had any issues or destroyed any regulators while stick welding with regulators on the wall in our booths.
    I'm now teaching but not in the same school that I attended prior to starting my career.
    Looking at the OP's photos of his booths, his regulators appear to be approximately 2-3 feet above his work tables, the tables look movable. The bricks are 10-12" tall. You really thing your going to destroy your regulators with weld spatter and sparks when they're 3 feet above your work table which can be moved in the booth?
    From the picture, I see 2 blocks from the table to the bottom of regulators, that would be about 18". Raise the weldment some, and yes you would be in a "spatter zone".
    Miller xmt304, Miller S22 p12, Miier Maxstar SD, Miller 252 w 30A, Miller super32p12, Lincoln Ranger 9, Thermal Arc 181I with spoolgun, Hypertherm 10000 ,Smith torches. Esab 161lts miniarc.

  20. #95
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    There is nothing wrong with a manifold system when done properly. The one the op posted looks very nice the problem comes with welding in direct proximity along with any grinding etc that goes along with welding
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  21. #96
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    So, we won't be grinding in the booth. We'll have a table outside for that.

    I will note that the two booths I happened to picture were the ADA booths which do have taller tables.

    Perhaps I can make a box to go around the regulators? With a lexan shield over it? If I put a facilties ticket in, the maintenance guys might be able to make me something (I can do it too, but remember, I'm also in charge or setting up an automotive program and a woods program. )

  22. #97
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    Re: Help the Shop Teacher!

    Dave- shoot me an email. jedwards-hoff@gsd200.org


    So, what do you guys think, I'm thinking of starting the kids off with 6013? Then perhaps 6011 (which I have tons of) and 7018? Just running lines. Nothing more for a while.

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