Tig Gas Flow Tester Question

[lugweld]

Read the link I posted. You are tilting at windmills.

[shovelon]

Read the link I posted. You are tilting at windmills.

I read it. Most welders normalize free flow pressures at 3 psi or less. Those pressures may indicate a one or 2 cfh difference max. 10 cfh is unheard of. In particular tig machines don't have the downstream obstructions like mig welders do which is why mig welders tend to use flow gauges as opposed to flowmeters recommended for tig welders.

I stated earlier that the OP can remove the hose from the back of the machine and check the flow at the end of the input hose. If it reads the same as the flowmeter the problem is machine or torch. At that point a call the warranty phone # may be in order. Perhaps they get you and bingo back to square one.

[lugweld]

Cite your source. You have a terrible history of stating things that just ain't so.\So, cite your source on the 3psi free flow. When you have a restriction, whether it be up stream or down stream, the gas that exits the restriction exits at a lower pressure when gas if free flowing. There are numerous restrictions in a TIG setup. First after the regulator and tubing itself, a gas connection, thenyou have the solenoid. Then you have the gas lines from the solenoid to the front of the unit. Then you have the DINSE connector itself. Then you have the torch and the torch handle, where the cable connects and necks down to what? 1/8" copper line? What's the internal diameter on that. Then you have the gas hole in the torch head (maybe 3/32"). Then you have the collet, and the collet body and the holes in the collet body the gas has to flow through.

Again, Cite your source.

Your comment about MIG having greater restriction and using flow gauges proves you are wrong on this. According to the Victor info: Applications with LESS than 2 psig typically use flow gauges. Applications with more than 2psig should use flow meters according the the Victor information. So, your statement about MIGs having more restrictions and is why they typically use flow gauges smells awfully suspect.

Another point you fail to consider. Free flow pressure at the TIG nozzle is not the same as a measure of back pressure, depending upon where the restrictions is found, even the length of the torch (friction) place a part in creating back pressure or a restriction.

[shovelon]

Cite your source. You have a terrible history of stating things that just ain't so.\So, cite your source on the 3psi free flow. When you have a restriction, whether it be up stream or down stream, the gas that exits the restriction exits at a lower pressure when gas if free flowing. There are numerous restrictions in a TIG setup. First after the regulator and tubing itself, a gas connection, thenyou have the solenoid. Then you have the gas lines from the solenoid to the front of the unit. Then you have the DINSE connector itself. Then you have the torch and the torch handle, where the cable connects and necks down to what? 1/8" copper line? What's the internal diameter on that. Then you have the gas hole in the torch head (maybe 3/32"). Then you have the collet, and the collet body and the holes in the collet body the gas has to flow through.

Again, Cite your source.

Your comment about MIG having greater restriction and using flow gauges proves you are wrong on this. According to the Victor info: Applications with LESS than 2 psig typically use flow gauges. Applications with more than 2psig should use flow meters according the the Victor information. So, your statement about MIGs having more restrictions and is why they typically use flow gauges smells awfully suspect.

Another point you fail to consider. Free flow pressure at the TIG nozzle is not the same as a measure of back pressure, depending upon where the restrictions is found, even the length of the torch (friction) place a part in creating back pressure or a restriction.

Gerald Uttrachi is ex president of American Welding Society and owner/operator of Netwelding.com. I have had several conversations with him on this subject. I have also purchased many of his products for calibration and confirmation of gas flows and pressures.

Here is his description of input/output pressures and normalizations. http://netwelding.com/How_GSS_Works.htm

[G-ManBart]

Had to exchange my 200 cf argon cylinder due to it being empty. Anyway... the gas flow tester now reads about 2 cfh lower than the flow meter. I can live with that.

A nearly empty tank makes a lot of sense. There have been many threads where people post about having porosity develop, then go on to say their tank is nearly empty, but the flow meter is still showing the normal flow rate....obviously, it wasn't the same on the torch/gun end.

[shovelon]

OT
I like CK products, just don't understand why their gas tester is priced 2x - 3x others...

Made in Italy.

[shovelon]

I'm here . Honestly, I've heard this before about those flow meters people buy, always conflicting with what is reading on the scale. Change regulators same thing. No internal leaks. Not sure what the discrepancy is. Unless there is a problem with CK graduation, or ours (since other brands are similar when tested, not thinking it is just us) or in the difference in how the figure CFH, or SCFH. But in reality, you adjust the regulator not based off a number, but off what you need to do the job. I never really consider how much or little I am using, only that I adjust it down until I get porosity, and then back up until it disappears, and then add a bit more for insurance. Then I'll look at what it says, and it usually is in the recommended range but if it isn't I don't worry about it, because you adjust the gas flow to your gas need, not a number. I use the scale more as a reference point than anything. Don't be obsessive about it. CK sells a meter. Ok. Use one or the other. But let your eyes, and ears tell you if it is right or not.

Seat of the pants gas flow is generally frowned upon and prohibited by AWS guidelines and procedures. A gas cup/nozzle orafic is calibrated by 1/16ths inch. A # 6 cup is 6/16ths of an inch. A #8 cup is 8/16ths of an inch. My shop formulas for gas flow when a specific gas flow is to be followed is this;

2 times the cup size minimum for adequate weld coverage, to 3 times maximum to prohibit venturi effect drawing air into the gas stream, with 2.5 times being the median and target. These are set gas flow settings and not to be deviated from. So if I was using a #6 cup my gas flow range would be 12 to 18cfh. I would target 15 cfh and go up or down 3 cfh from there depending on inside corners or outside corners. Inside corners trap the gas better and 12 cfh would be adequate. Outside corners do not trap the gas and 18 cfh would be a more desirable flow. All of these gas flow settings are checked and confirmed with the portable gas flow checkers at the torch every morning when the weldor turns on his or her machine for the 5 minute capacitor charge and warm up.

A # 8 cup by this formula would be 16 cfh to 24 cfh. A #10 would be 20 cfh to 30cfh. If you are adding 25% helium to your inert gas blend, add 25% more gas as helium is less dense. 50% helium add 50% more gas flow.

[robert-r]

Seat of the pants gas flow is generally frowned upon and prohibited by AWS guidelines and procedures. A gas cup/nozzle orafic is calibrated by 1/16ths inch. A # 6 cup is 6/16ths of an inch. A #8 cup is 8/16ths of an inch. My shop formulas for gas flow when a specific gas flow is to be followed is this;

2 times the cup size minimum for adequate weld coverage, to 3 times maximum to prohibit venturi effect drawing air into the gas stream, with 2.5 times being the median and target. These are set gas flow settings and not to be deviated from. So if I was using a #6 cup my gas flow range would be 12 to 18cfh. I would target 15 cfh and go up or down 3 cfh from there depending on inside corners or outside corners. Inside corners trap the gas better and 12 cfh would be adequate. Outside corners do not trap the gas and 18 cfh would be a more desirable flow. All of these gas flow settings are checked and confirmed with the portable gas flow checkers at the torch every morning when the weldor turns on his or her machine for the 5 minute capacitor charge and warm up.

A # 8 cup by this formula would be 16 cfh to 24 cfh. A #10 would be 20 cfh to 30cfh. If you are adding 25% helium to your inert gas blend, add 25% more gas as helium is less dense. 50% helium add 50% more gas flow.

Great post, sir! As a tig newbie, that's some solid information that I can put to use.

[metalman21]

Gerald Uttrachi is ex president of American Welding Society and owner/operator of Netwelding.com. I have had several conversations with him on this subject. I have also purchased many of his products for calibration and confirmation of gas flows and pressures.

Here is his description of input/output pressures and normalizations. http://netwelding.com/How_GSS_Works.htm

That website is confusing, been there before. Jammed with information,which I guess is good thing.
Jerry Uttrachi responds to emails quickly and was very helpful with selecting the best hose for my set up. Going to try one out and probably upgrade them all eventually.

[vdotmatrix]

Old post….same situation. Flow meter on TIG measures in scfh, handheld flow tester measures in L/min. L/min to scfh is roughly x2

[LtBadd]

Old post….same situation. Flow meter on TIG measures in scfh, handheld flow tester measures in L/min. L/min to scfh is roughly x2

I have ordered this one from Cyberweld, a bit less than thru Strong Hand tools, watch their video (it's short)

I always wanted the CK tester but they want WAY too much