New "Shop" - Ramblings and Dreams With a Blank Canvas

[Shootr]

Me and the missus sold the camp trailer - and that leaves this lovely 10' x 20' slab off to the side of the garage where all my stuff is currently.




The RV gate makes access nice, as well as a door from the garage to this space. There is an existing 30A TT-30 110V outlet that I'm converting to 6-50 220V for the welder. There is a dual floodlight and a duplex 110V outlet also there already.

As a hobbyist tinkerer with artsy kind of stuff, all I have tool-wise is:

* 110/220 Dual Voltage Mig/Stick/Tig welder (160A +/- from a 30A circuit)
*Portaband
*Drill Press (If Harbor Freight ever sends the replacement spindle sleeve...)

The welder and bandsaw are portable and can be rolled out to the new work area fairly easily. Drill press is right by the door. I plan on avoiding getting city planners and inspectors so no "permanent" looking structures (The d!psh!t down the road ruined that when he recently went "whole house makeover" and tried turning his garage into a bedroom (yeah, I think the french doors and framing 20' off the street didn't hide well from the happen-to-drive-by building inspector) and got Red Tagged.

What I'm thinking is just a steel carport like this (10' x 22'):


Maybe put up some short racking against the block fence to hold materials and top it with a long metal bench top. Rain is the only weather to really worry about, so if I can find some heavy canvas covers for the welding cart I may leave it in this area as well. Heck, I don't know...It's Saturday afternoon and I'm just sitting in the spa staring at it.

[camfab]

The only thing I'd be concerned with that car port is rain running toward your house in a heavy downpour. If you can mitigate that you'd be okay, well and keeping it from pouring into the neighbors house as well!. Interesting observation about your neighbor down the way. Here in California the Governor decided he was going to solve the homeless problem and changed all the rules. Anyone can turn their garage into a rental property. Completely ridiculous, sorry for going of course.

[whtbaron]

Yea, I guess you guys don't worry about snowloads and minus 40 blizzards... sounds like all you really need is a roof and an eavestrough, or maybe a pair of eavestroughs out the front of that structure you posted. Your setting looks urban to me. I would think leaving too much stuff outside will encourage theft. If you want to use the new work space, I would put everything on wheels and work on a level "floor". A couple of wooden ramps at the door could smooth out the transition. Put a decent 240 outlet by the door and use a short cord. A couple 12 g extensions would work for the 120 V. Wheel it out to work, back inside at the end of the day...

[psacustomcreations]

Shootr,
I think I would get the carport like you mention and then use the space outside as storage and clean out the garage.
Make a materials storage rack for metal, get some pallet racks or storage shelves off Craigslist and move all the little items you have in the garage outside. Look at all the knick-knacks you have in the garage and move them out of the way. As you do that, decide if you really need to keep them. This will clean out the garage and make working in there more comfortable. This is exactly what I did when I got my 40 foot shipping container. It opened up a lot more space in the actual workshop.
Since you have relatively nicer weather than we have in Virginia, you won't have to worry as much about it being damaged.
Every once in a while I go through my shop and see if there is stuff I haven't used in a while and move it outside.
The other thing I would probably make for outside is a larger welding/work table.
A major alternative to this idea is to get the carport to protect the car and then see if you can get just park the car outside from now on and use the garage as just a workshop. Still put racks outside on the side opposite the gate if there is also room to fit the car as well

[BillE.Dee]

Can you put some type of louvres on the gate to hide your stuff and what you are doing from the neighbors? Recently had some drainage installed around the pool, neighbor, 1/4 mile down the road asked what we were doing? Told her I was making a bunker. I've got much the same problem...too much "stuff" and not enough places to put it. Now searching for a decent "she shed" for my queen and her furniture re-purposing projects. She doesn't need concrete flooring , just flooring. Plus everytime I improve ,, the local govt is looking to gain a tax dollar.

[Shootr]

The only thing I'd be concerned with that car port is rain running toward your house in a heavy downpour. If you can mitigate that you'd be okay, well and keeping it from pouring into the neighbors house as well!. Interesting observation about your neighbor down the way. Here in California the Governor decided he was going to solve the homeless problem and changed all the rules. Anyone can turn their garage into a rental property. Completely ridiculous, sorry for going of course.

Born and raised in AZ - it is incomprehensible to me how folks live in places like CA, NY, NJ, etc. (politically/personal freedom-speaking)

The neighbor I share that fence with is an awesome guy and we already talked - he of course has no reservations about the carport but the runoff on that side is a valid point (well, at least the 2 or 3 times it really rains each year .)

[Shootr]

Yea, I guess you guys don't worry about snowloads and minus 40 blizzards... sounds like all you really need is a roof and an eavestrough, or maybe a pair of eavestroughs out the front of that structure you posted. Your setting looks urban to me. I would think leaving too much stuff outside will encourage theft. If you want to use the new work space, I would put everything on wheels and work on a level "floor". A couple of wooden ramps at the door could smooth out the transition. Put a decent 240 outlet by the door and use a short cord. A couple 12 g extensions would work for the 120 V. Wheel it out to work, back inside at the end of the day...

Yeah, here it is mostly make sure it's secured to the slab well or it will wind up in the neighbors yard after a dust storm...(I got a gazebo from the next door neighbor that way a few years ago in another house). Though I think we have a pretty good, neighborly area - it isn't immune.


I have security cameras around the perimeter on 24/7 and lots of signs pointing that fact out. Didn't stop some bum, at noon on a Sunday, hitching up the neighbors flatbed trailer (in his driveway) and driving off with it. Gave all the recordings to the police but they probably won't ever find it. Everything that needs to be mobile is already so it's not too big of a deal rolling it in and out when I'm working.

[Shootr]

Shootr,
I think I would get the carport like you mention and then use the space outside as storage and clean out the garage.
Make a materials storage rack for metal, get some pallet racks or storage shelves off Craigslist and move all the little items you have in the garage outside. Look at all the knick-knacks you have in the garage and move them out of the way. As you do that, decide if you really need to keep them. This will clean out the garage and make working in there more comfortable. This is exactly what I did when I got my 40 foot shipping container. It opened up a lot more space in the actual workshop.
Since you have relatively nicer weather than we have in Virginia, you won't have to worry as much about it being damaged.
Every once in a while I go through my shop and see if there is stuff I haven't used in a while and move it outside.
The other thing I would probably make for outside is a larger welding/work table.
A major alternative to this idea is to get the carport to protect the car and then see if you can get just park the car outside from now on and use the garage as just a workshop. Still put racks outside on the side opposite the gate if there is also room to fit the car as well

Believe it or not (I still don't) the missus actually suggested using the carport for her car and I take over the garage. Maybe I'm crazy, but since I'm in a regular neighborhood I think garages should have cars in them, not stuffed to the roof like a storeroom like 1/2 of them around here seem to be.

We're on the same page - a big workbench with scrap storage underneath. Or, instead of the storage and bench against the fence, maybe a 3' x 5' 'ish rolling welding table parked in the back corner that can be rolled out to the middle if I happen to need to get all the way around it. Still put some low racks against the fence.

[smithdoor]

Where I live the building department limits the size to 120 square feet and 8 foot tall with out a permit. So building very closed to fince you can not get a permit.

Today you see a lot of 10x12 shops and may see 2 or 3 very closest to get her making shops 240 square feet or even 360 square feet.
There is no limit to number of small buildings.

Dave

Me and the missus sold the camp trailer - and that leaves this lovely 10' x 20' slab off to the side of the garage where all my stuff is currently.




The RV gate makes access nice, as well as a door from the garage to this space. There is an existing 30A TT-30 110V outlet that I'm converting to 6-50 220V for the welder. There is a dual floodlight and a duplex 110V outlet also there already.

As a hobbyist tinkerer with artsy kind of stuff, all I have tool-wise is:

* 110/220 Dual Voltage Mig/Stick/Tig welder (160A +/- from a 30A circuit)
*Portaband
*Drill Press (If Harbor Freight ever sends the replacement spindle sleeve...)

The welder and bandsaw are portable and can be rolled out to the new work area fairly easily. Drill press is right by the door. I plan on avoiding getting city planners and inspectors so no "permanent" looking structures (The d!psh!t down the road ruined that when he recently went "whole house makeover" and tried turning his garage into a bedroom (yeah, I think the french doors and framing 20' off the street didn't hide well from the happen-to-drive-by building inspector) and got Red Tagged.

What I'm thinking is just a steel carport like this (10' x 22'):


Maybe put up some short racking against the block fence to hold materials and top it with a long metal bench top. Rain is the only weather to really worry about, so if I can find some heavy canvas covers for the welding cart I may leave it in this area as well. Heck, I don't know...It's Saturday afternoon and I'm just sitting in the spa staring at it.

[smithdoor]

Your site looks great and block fence is nice too.

Dave

Me and the missus sold the camp trailer - and that leaves this lovely 10' x 20' slab off to the side of the garage where all my stuff is currently.




The RV gate makes access nice, as well as a door from the garage to this space. There is an existing 30A TT-30 110V outlet that I'm converting to 6-50 220V for the welder. There is a dual floodlight and a duplex 110V outlet also there already.

As a hobbyist tinkerer with artsy kind of stuff, all I have tool-wise is:

* 110/220 Dual Voltage Mig/Stick/Tig welder (160A +/- from a 30A circuit)
*Portaband
*Drill Press (If Harbor Freight ever sends the replacement spindle sleeve...)

The welder and bandsaw are portable and can be rolled out to the new work area fairly easily. Drill press is right by the door. I plan on avoiding getting city planners and inspectors so no "permanent" looking structures (The d!psh!t down the road ruined that when he recently went "whole house makeover" and tried turning his garage into a bedroom (yeah, I think the french doors and framing 20' off the street didn't hide well from the happen-to-drive-by building inspector) and got Red Tagged.

What I'm thinking is just a steel carport like this (10' x 22'):


Maybe put up some short racking against the block fence to hold materials and top it with a long metal bench top. Rain is the only weather to really worry about, so if I can find some heavy canvas covers for the welding cart I may leave it in this area as well. Heck, I don't know...It's Saturday afternoon and I'm just sitting in the spa staring at it.

[Shootr]

Where I live the building department limits the size to 120 square feet and 8 foot tall with out a permit. So building very closed to fence you can not get a permit.

Today you see a lot of 10x12 shops and may see 2 or 3 very closest to get her making shops 240 square feet or even 360 square feet.
There is no limit to number of small buildings.

Dave

Phoenix' work permit exempt list includes "Detached Accessory Structures". In their words, no more than 200SF, single story, used for storage, tools, playhouse, gazebo, or pergola. What Phoenix specifically considers a "carport" are those structures like at apartment buildings - cantilevered or "T" structures with footings, multiple spaces, commercial application. In talking to some friends with them already, they had no issues. I installed a 8 x 14 TuffShed on the other side of the house - same proximity to the fence as this will be - no problem. Having awesome neighbors helps too!

[VaughnT]

If you're interested in a DIY option, you might be able to borrow some ideas from Jimbo.....




One thing I've never liked about those carport structures in your application is that the pour a ton of rain water down right on the foundation of the house. Might not seem like much, but when you get water moving through there.... bad things tend to happen. Even if your area gets little annual rainfall, what you do get is being funneled right into the area where you really don't want water.

[camfab]

If you're interested in a DIY option, you might be able to borrow some ideas from Jimbo.....




One thing I've never liked about those carport structures in your application is that the pour a ton of rain water down right on the foundation of the house. Might not seem like much, but when you get water moving through there.... bad things tend to happen. Even if your area gets little annual rainfall, what you do get is being funneled right into the area where you really don't want water.

That’s a nice set up, and makes the most sense protection wise. I agree with your assessment about water mitigation, problem is the guy in the video is making it even worse, because it’s either running down the block wall, or eroding the footings of that wall. Not to mention it’s likely not his property. Other issue is, if you actually do any maintenance on your home that side of the house isn’t going to get any. I think he’s right on the money, good concept, but not thought out very well.

Like many other communities, that’s a permanent structure, and it’s built to a zero lot line. No can do in most urban settings.

[VaughnT]

That’s a nice set up, and makes the most sense protection wise. I agree with your assessment about water mitigation, problem is the guy in the video is making it even worse... Not to mention it’s likely not his property. Other issue is, if you actually do any maintenance on your home that side of the house isn’t going to get any. I think he’s right on the money, good concept, but not thought out very well. Like many other communities, that’s a permanent structure, and it’s built to a zero lot line. No can do in most urban settings.

Yea, he sure did a lot wrong with that setup. It'll get the job done, but I'm thinking 5 years ahead when the unpainted downtubes rust out on the backside because of all the moisture trapped between them and the block wall! Why paint three sides and act like you've done wonders?!?


If I was Shootr, I'd come off the side of the house just far enough to get the uprights next to the big pad that's there. Sink some concrete footers for support, and it'll still leave you plenty of room to get a car in there if you need to work on it. Might not be much of a roof, but it'd offer protection from the elements and keep things covered. Could even add some Jobox-type containers to secure tools and provide a work surface. All depends on what you're planning to do outside.

At least then the rain coming off the roofs would be hitting on the big pad and move away from the house with some speed.

[Shootr]

Here's a better picture of the area.

The slab is 10'0" wide so that's why I'm shooting for the structure to be the same. On the fence side I plan on bringing the roof material down 3' to fully shield the neighbor but allow plenty of airflow so moisture won't pool up or get trapped.

On the house side, that roof overhang already puts a bunch of water into the area during the rare downpours, but besides floating the mulch a bit, it drains in no time.

The "oops" is me just realizing the type 2 110v outlets are on the same circuit as the TT-30 I plan to change to a 6-50 220v outlet (so those will have to go away). However, there is a 2 gang box on the other side of the floodlights, so I can put them over there pretty easily.

I think I'll take a look at some 24" or 36" deep used racking (tons of it on Craigslist) to make the bench and/or metal storage from.

[Shootr]

In case you were wondering - that's the hot tub. I built the pergola last year. The 4x4 uprights are screwed to Simpson post mounts, and they are buried in 70lbs of concrete in each flower pot. I never tried to build something like that before so I was afraid to make it too permanent lol...

[VaughnT]

How much rain do you get at any one time? If you get summer showers that pour gallons per minute, all that roof is going to channel water in two directions, and you'll have to deal with it somehow. Gutters sound great, but then you have to deal with the runoff that can erode lots of ground in no time flat.

If you put up a car port to cover the 10' driveway, you're focusing rain from two roofs down to the side of your house. That's gobs of water that has to be gotten rid of before it can soak in and undermine your foundation. At least in Jimbo's video, his roofline is directing water away from the house foundation. It might damage the block wall's foundation, but that's small potatoes by comparison.

[Shootr]

How much rain do you get at any one time? If you get summer showers that pour gallons per minute, all that roof is going to channel water in two directions, and you'll have to deal with it somehow. Gutters sound great, but then you have to deal with the runoff that can erode lots of ground in no time flat.

If you put up a car port to cover the 10' driveway, you're focusing rain from two roofs down to the side of your house. That's gobs of water that has to be gotten rid of before it can soak in and undermine your foundation. At least in Jimbo's video, his roofline is directing water away from the house foundation. It might damage the block wall's foundation, but that's small potatoes by comparison.

Our historical average is less than 1" per month - during the rainy season. Every few years that will all come in one night, otherwise it's just little here, little there - just enough to screw up the truck and have to get it washed lol.

[camfab]

My in-laws live in Paradise Valley. Some five or six years ago we drove out in June for my father in laws birthday. The skies got dark and in five minutes the rain was dumping so hard the street was a river and the water came right up to the front door threshold. They literally had a lake sitting out their front door, really bad grading job. 1/2 hr later it was back up to 115 and suffocating. Crazy weather
On the other hand, you almost never see graffiti, the freeways are free of litter and I agree with you on the CA brain trust.

[whtbaron]

With that little rainfall, I would still be looking at Jimbo's option. Finish the concrete between the house and the slab, keep your wall 18 to 24" inside your property line and run a good eavestrough out the front down the driveway. Avoids water issues at the wall and the house, and gives you maximum room to work.

[VaughnT]

How do you know someone's Canadian?

When they say "eavestrough" instead of the proper terminology -- gutter!

[Meltedmetal]

How do you know someone's Canadian?

When they say "eavestrough" instead of the proper terminology -- gutter!

Gutters are ground level eavestrough is just below the edge of the roof. At least in Canada.

[Shootr]

For me, gutters have always been troughs that catch and/or direct water. Street level or roof level.

[whtbaron]

Ahh.... get your mind out of the gutter and fix the damn eavestrough....

[smithdoor]

I would build a single slope roof and use gutter at fence line.
If rains No water in shop.

Dave

Me and the missus sold the camp trailer - and that leaves this lovely 10' x 20' slab off to the side of the garage where all my stuff is currently.




The RV gate makes access nice, as well as a door from the garage to this space. There is an existing 30A TT-30 110V outlet that I'm converting to 6-50 220V for the welder. There is a dual floodlight and a duplex 110V outlet also there already.

As a hobbyist tinkerer with artsy kind of stuff, all I have tool-wise is:

* 110/220 Dual Voltage Mig/Stick/Tig welder (160A +/- from a 30A circuit)
*Portaband
*Drill Press (If Harbor Freight ever sends the replacement spindle sleeve...)

The welder and bandsaw are portable and can be rolled out to the new work area fairly easily. Drill press is right by the door. I plan on avoiding getting city planners and inspectors so no "permanent" looking structures (The d!psh!t down the road ruined that when he recently went "whole house makeover" and tried turning his garage into a bedroom (yeah, I think the french doors and framing 20' off the street didn't hide well from the happen-to-drive-by building inspector) and got Red Tagged.

What I'm thinking is just a steel carport like this (10' x 22'):


Maybe put up some short racking against the block fence to hold materials and top it with a long metal bench top. Rain is the only weather to really worry about, so if I can find some heavy canvas covers for the welding cart I may leave it in this area as well. Heck, I don't know...It's Saturday afternoon and I'm just sitting in the spa staring at it.