Bird Nest

[vwguy3]

Don't exactly know. Second new liner this year, adjust the bottom roller alignment, spool off some wire through several birdnests. I can't say. I am perplexed that there seems nothing to do about the top roller adjustment. If the bottom roller was off, it was by thousandths.

The less than a year old liner was discolored near the tip, but that I would have expected.

I was having arc start issues with my 252 and Q300. I adjusted the drive roll alignment and that issue went away. I never looked at the idle roll but assumed it had the ability to self align with the drive roll.

The liner shouldn't have discoloration from heat unless you have the gun all but burned to the ground. All weld power goes through the cable hose to the conductor tube(gooseneck) then to the diffuser and finally to the contact tip.

[G-ManBart]

I was having arc start issues with my 252 and Q300. I adjusted the drive roll alignment and that issue went away. I never looked at the idle roll but assumed it had the ability to self align with the drive roll.

The liner shouldn't have discoloration from heat unless you have the gun all but burned to the ground. All weld power goes through the cable hose to the conductor tube(gooseneck) then to the diffuser and finally to the contact tip.

The idle roller has a fair amount of in/out play in it that lets it self-align with the wire. I just give the top roll a little wiggle in and out to make sure it's seated on the wire before closing the pressure latch...seems to do the trick.

[shovelon]

I am still going with tight contact tip. I always remove tip when feeding new wire into the liner, and clean out burrs and debris with the tip file. Worn tips work the best. If still a problem move a tip bigger.

[MinnesotaDave]

I am still going with tight contact tip. I always remove tip when feeding new wire into the liner, and clean out burrs and debris with the tip file. Worn tips work the best. If still a problem move a tip bigger.

I just did that with a tip that a student was running. He said it "constantly burns back now after the first time" (when he stuck the tip to the work).

WFS/volts was where I had set it, unscrewed the tip and it was dragging.

Little file work and kid is back to welding
(I only have 1 spare tip for that machine)

[driz]

Does the liner have a kink in it? Did you maybe drive a car over the stinger or trip over it some time, roll it into a corner and kink the liner , something like that. My HH 135 had something like that happen. Drove me nuts for years sticking . Mine when I finally found it had just the tiniest shallowest kink but it was enough.
You might try putting one of those lube pads ahead of where it enters the liner. I don’t even use the mounting . I just clamp it on the wire and let it ride the wire. the I got one from cyber weld for $5 and tossed it in there to help out with old slightly rusty wire. Does it help or work ,who knows .


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[12V71]

Does the liner have a kink in it? Did you maybe drive a car over the stinger or trip over it some time, roll it into a corner and kink the liner , something like that. My HH 135 had something like that happen. Drove me nuts for years sticking . Mine when I finally found it had just the tiniest shallowest kink but it was enough.
You might try putting one of those lube pads ahead of where it enters the liner. I don’t even use the mounting . I just clamp it on the wire and let it ride the wire. the I got one from cyber weld for $5 and tossed it in there to help out with old slightly rusty wire. Does it help or work ,who knows .


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In my experience, those wipers do collect junk and garbage from the wire... then dump it all at once into your drive rolls and liner. I wont use them anymore.

[Willie B]

Does the liner have a kink in it? Did you maybe drive a car over the stinger or trip over it some time, roll it into a corner and kink the liner , something like that. My HH 135 had something like that happen. Drove me nuts for years sticking . Mine when I finally found it had just the tiniest shallowest kink but it was enough.
You might try putting one of those lube pads ahead of where it enters the liner. I don’t even use the mounting . I just clamp it on the wire and let it ride the wire. the I got one from cyber weld for $5 and tossed it in there to help out with old slightly rusty wire. Does it help or work ,who knows .


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I'm very careful about kinking. I did burn the gun up a while back running Dual Shield. I bought a bunch of new parts to rebuild it then. The liner was replaced then. I put another new Miller liner in a week ago.

Shovelon's comment about a tip file has me curious. I have tip cleaners for acetylene torch, but never heard of a tip file for MIG. I'm going to explore that possibility.

The retired welder repair guy did say a couple ear plugs on the wire is fine, replace each time you rethread wire. He warned against the fiber wipers. They'll allow a wad of $hit along with fibers torn from the wiper to pass every now & then.

[Leogl]

Well I have burned 100’s of rolls of .035 and when problems start they are usually simple contact tips are a consumable if the hole isn’t round and they have been stuck they need to be replaced grinding , filing drilling tips is not a proper way to make them weld . Dipping a tip in nozzle Gell and using a wiper is a very common practice and is widely accepted . Wipers are a consumable when you change wire rolls you change wiper . Run two wipers one with lube and one dry look at the inside of those wipers when you change rolls they
are full of junk
Watched a guy in pipe fab shop use used wipers always had problems . New roll new wipers new tips when you need them

[Denis G]

Dumb question, but were any of the old liners discolored? If so, they were probably carrying welding current.

[Willie B]

Dumb question, but were any of the old liners discolored? If so, they were probably carrying welding current.

Wait a minute! aren't they supposed to? Yes, the liner I just removed was discolored for a foot on the gun end. I'd have to study old purchase records, but it is between 1 & 2 years old. Still perplexing, the new liner was bird nesting also.

Thinking it over, the welder service guy was trying it on an old rusty piece of steel without gas. It bird nested repeatedly. At home, I tried a couple days later, It behaved fine. Only two factors I can think of: Ground, or gas. Here, I ground off rust to a clean surface, and I used gas.

[Welder Dave]

Could current be arcing on the liner?

[CAVEMANN]

Do you have to cut the new liners to length? If so could the cutting deform the liner enough to cause a problem, like a little burr or flattened a bit.I always clean mine with an appropriate drill bit.

[Willie B]

Do you have to cut the new liners to length? If so could the cutting deform the liner enough to cause a problem, like a little burr or flattened a bit.I always clean mine with an appropriate drill bit.

I cut metal jacketed cable all the time. The inevitable sharp point is kept out of the inner space. Just something I always think about. Usually touch up with a file, or bench grinder.

[12V71]

I cut metal jacketed cable all the time. The inevitable sharp point is kept out of the inner space. Just something I always think about. Usually touch up with a file, or bench grinder.

I cut liners with a high leverage diagonal cutter... (dikes) If you work one jaw in carefully through the coil and then cut, usually no touch up required.

That discoloration in the last foot of the liner may just be heat from the gun and lube dust from dual shield wire. I get that on mine.

[Denis G]

The liner is not supposed to carry welding current -
https://www.bernardwelds.com/mig-gun-liners--p152451

[CAVEMANN]

I cut liners with a high leverage diagonal cutter... (dikes) If you work one jaw in carefully through the coil and then cut, usually no touch up required.

That discoloration in the last foot of the liner may just be heat from the gun and lube dust from dual shield wire. I get that on mine.

You don't see a lot of guys that know what dikes are!

[ronsii]

You don't see a lot of guys that know what dikes are!

I have a lot of dikes around here.... some big some little... some with holes between the edges for stripping

[smithdoor]

Here is a view of a wire feeder
You want to keep feed tube very close to feed rollers.
Do not tighten wire feed rollers to tight.
This will stop bird nest in the wire feeder.

Dave

Millermatic 252 is now 10 years old. It has always been useless with .023 wire. I have four guns; A short one dedicated to .023, the stock one (M25) for .030 & .035, the big Bernard gun can run .035, but it usually runs Dual Shield .045, and a spool gun.

Lately, it has taken to bird nesting with .035, and .045 also. I tried new tips & new liner, no improvement.

There is a retired, formerly Miller authorized service man in the city. I took it to him. After an hour of fine tuning, it fouls less often. His theory is an invisible layer of rust on the wire.

Anybody got suggections?

[bead-boy]

You don't see a lot of guys that know what dikes are!

From : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diagon...%20it%20out%22.

""Diags or dikes (a portmanteau of "diagonal cutters") is jargon used especially in the US electrical industry, to describe diagonal pliers.""

[Willie B]

Here is a view of a wire feeder
You want to keep feed tube very close to feed rollers.
Do not tighten wire feed rollers to tight.
This will stop bird nest in the wire feeder.

Dave

Mine is perhaps closer than in your picture. The liner comes from Miller as I used it. I considered adjusting it, but couldn't move it hardly at all without touching.

[lars66]

Grind a bevel on the end to move it a little closer to the drive rolls.

[smithdoor]

When I using Tweco I ground the brass so it would just a few thousand's of inch from the rollers.
The Miller at time was also made brass but Switch every welder to Tweco.
This stop the birds nesting with watching the rollers adjustments

Dave

Mine is perhaps closer than in your picture. The liner comes from Miller as I used it. I considered adjusting it, but couldn't move it hardly at all without touching.

[OPUS FERRO]

bead-boy

""Diags or dikes (a portmanteau of "diagonal cutters") is jargon used
especially in the US electrical industry, to describe diagonal pliers.""

Etymology has low traction with this crowd - start in
the gutter - and maybe you'll be make friends . . .

hth


Opus

[M J D]

I was thinking more along the lines of where the Dutch boy put his finger.

[Welder Dave]

Surprised there isn't an inlet wire guide after the drive rolls like on larger Miller feeders. One of the features Bernard stresses for Centerfire contact tips is they can be rotated so they don't get oval shaped from being in the same position all the time.