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Thread: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

  1. #26
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    At that inexpensive level of imports your hands are tied, which explains your welds.
    Kidding
    Do you have 220volt power ?? I suggest getting a dedicated stick machine. The Lincoln tombstone and Miller thunderbolt are bullet proof.
    Both in AC only are usually available used for $100.00 to $150.00.
    I would buy an AC/DC one. Typical those are $250.00 to $300.00 or more depending on your location.
    6010 is a DC rod which has a smoother arc. Definitely will be easier to learn with. There is a 6010 5P PLUS, which is DC. A better choice to learn with.
    Remember, the numbers on machine are only a starting point. 80 on your machine may burn the same at 70 on another.
    Check with local suppliers to see if they have a machine to try. If suppliers don't ask about a machine repair service.


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  3. #27
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Shootr View Post
    I'm using Lincoln rods.




    Well, the answer for me anyways (how many pounds to get striking an arc reliably) is 3.5 lol:
    Attachment 1722488

    I figured one more session before it gets dark - since it's a hobby - it's incredibly enjoyable to practice.

    Tried DCEN for giggles, went up to 90 amps to get similar results as before. At this moment, I finally found the right "touch" to start the arc, and stop and relight at will. For me anyways, if I get the "scratch" right, and then lift the rod almost 1/2", the arc really takes off nicely and I can drop back down to the puddle and away I go.

    Switched back to DCEP, and ran the above beads at 72amps with nary an issue. For 2 days practice, I'm pretty stoked at the progress!

    Thanks (almost) everyone for the info and help. Really appreciate your expertise and willingness to share.


    Now youre gettin the weldin habit, back up a bit to fill in the crater at the end of the weld, when you feel confident enough to try it weave it a little bit and see what happens, you are doin fine there. Do some experimenting stickin 2 pieces together on a lap joint, a t joint, and a butt weld, when you get comfy with all that move on to vertical horizontal and overhead, and when you are happy with that try some 7018 if that machine will handle it.

    Regarding your machine, I have never ever in my life used one of these 110/220 small welders or one of these inverter welders, I always used the big machines mostly the 440 volt machines, and 400 and 500 amp engine drives, all except for the old SA200 pipeliners I put together from old machines I bought so I really cant comment on your machine. But I would take Oscar at his word he seems to know a lot about these smaller ones

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  5. #28
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Shootr View Post
    Tried DCEN for giggles, went up to 90 amps to get similar results as before. At this moment, I finally found the right "touch" to start the arc, and stop and relight at will. For me anyways, if I get the "scratch" right, and then lift the rod almost 1/2", the arc really takes off nicely and I can drop back down to the puddle and away I go.
    My cheapie stick welders behave the same exact way. For S.A.G., I bought a Tooliom 135S and posted about it in the thread Brand X started titled "How cheap can you go?". I was bored in December so I bought the slightly larger one, the 195S. The arc initiation is exactly how you have described it on both units.


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  7. #29
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Found a box of Forney 6013 x 3/32", so while I'm laid up with the ching chong flu I went out to practice a bit with it. (I heard the fumes are healing).

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    Just some scrap laying around, too lazy to cut up coupons. The spike was at 110amps, the tubing was 40amps, and other stuff in the 60-70 range.

    Tried going down as low as 25 amps but couldn't get a light, 35 was about the lowest.

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    Kind of pleased with the tube welds. I burned a lot of holes in other pieces getting the settings right but all I need is one or two decent looking welds to call it a day.
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  9. #30
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Shootr View Post
    Found a box of Forney 6013 x 3/32", so while I'm laid up with the ching chong flu I went out to practice a bit with it. (I heard the fumes are healing).

    Name:  20210114_153222-01.jpg
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    Just some scrap laying around, too lazy to cut up coupons. The spike was at 110amps, the tubing was 40amps, and other stuff in the 60-70 range.

    Tried going down as low as 25 amps but couldn't get a light, 35 was about the lowest.

    Name:  20210114_153015-01.jpg
Views: 303
Size:  223.6 KB

    Kind of pleased with the tube welds. I burned a lot of holes in other pieces getting the settings right but all I need is one or two decent looking welds to call it a day.
    You are gettin better at it, some of the welds i see on the tubing look pretty nice no undercut no prosity and looks nice and smooth like you were in a comfy position, which is very important, keep practicing you are on your way

  10. #31
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Oscar View Post
    Vertical down using 6013? Whaaaa?
    My son said this was the easiest/fastest weld ticket he ever did in his stick welding class. 6013 vertical down t-joint. 135 Amps AC.

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  12. #32
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    I don't know if I'd call a downhill 6013 weld a ticket. Perhaps a test in a welding course but the question is why? It's not a weld that would be considered for anything you wanted to stay together. Shame on the instructor.

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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Welder Dave View Post
    I don't know if I'd call a downhill 6013 weld a ticket. Perhaps a test in a welding course but the question is why? It's not a weld that would be considered for anything you wanted to stay together. Shame on the instructor.
    Isnt there a fella here from England does pipe downhill with 6013? Its the weld code over there? He makes it look real pretty too. I might be thinkin of somethin else though.

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  15. #34
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Popeye an old miner View Post
    Isnt there a fella here from England does pipe downhill with 6013? Its the weld code over there? He makes it look real pretty too. I might be thinkin of somethin else though.
    Yes haven't seen any post from him for a while but here is the thread.

    https://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthrea...ight=6013+pipe
    Mike

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  17. #35
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    That's the guy from N Ireland. I think he was friends with CEP. Also as mentioned before the 6013 in Europe is different than the 6013 in N. America.
    Last edited by Welder Dave; 01-15-2021 at 07:49 PM.

  18. #36
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Welder Dave View Post
    That's the guy from N Ireland. I think he was friends with CEP. Also as mentioned before the 6013 in Europe is different than the 6013 in N. America.
    Ahhh ok, thats what i was thinkin of but its either uphill or rolled, not sure what made me think it was downhill. In any case his work sure is top shelf

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  20. #37
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Welder Dave View Post
    I don't know if I'd call a downhill 6013 weld a ticket. Perhaps a test in a welding course but the question is why? It's not a weld that would be considered for anything you wanted to stay together. Shame on the instructor.
    Just seems that our 6013 here in the States is way too runny for vertical down. Hardly any videos on 6013 vertical down on YouTube. Wonder why.
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  21. #38
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Probably not much stronger than crazy glue.

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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Welder Dave View Post
    I don't know if I'd call a downhill 6013 weld a ticket. Perhaps a test in a welding course but the question is why? It's not a weld that would be considered for anything you wanted to stay together. Shame on the instructor.
    Actually, if you read up in some older Lincoln procedure handbooks, 6013 and 6012 were very popular in manufacturing before MIG came out. Lots of car frames and smaller tanks were welded with those rods in downhill procedures because it took much less time to train operators.

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  24. #40
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Oscar View Post
    Just seems that our 6013 here in the States is way too runny for vertical down. Hardly any videos on 6013 vertical down on YouTube. Wonder why.
    My son said he just stuck the rod in there and pulled it down like a zipper. Concave or flat bead, but very smooth and suitable for sheet metal. At least it was in 1957 when my Lincoln handbook was printed.
    Last edited by Oldendum; 01-15-2021 at 09:33 PM.
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  26. #41
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldendum View Post
    My son said he just stuck the rod in there and pulled it down like a zipper. Concave or flat bead, but very smooth and suitable for sheet metal. At least it was in 1957 when my Lincoln handbook was printed.
    I believe you that it can be done. Just seems like more trouble than it's worth with such a high likelyhood of having slag inclusions from the thick, runny slag.
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  27. #42
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Welded lots of vertical down with it years ago. Not much different from mig, you have to use the arc to keep it from sagging down.

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  29. #43
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Oscar View Post
    ...

    Also, just FYI, your "125A" that you tried was likely no where near close to that much. If you put an ammeter on either the stinger or ground cable to actually measure it, I would bet money "125A" would show roughly 80A. This is what I speculate from having bought and tested very low-end, albeit functional, Chinese inverter sticker welders. On the 120V input mode, they (I'm speculating many) are actually limited to about 95A, regardless of what the display says. ...
    Amen. Some of the very nice small inverters with power factor correction and a very efficient power supply might get you up to 100 Amps or so on a 120V, 20A circuit without tripping the breaker. But they are not cheap. Thermal Arc had some good ones (TA 95, 161 and 201TS). The specs on the recent ESAB 180 look promising.

    I'm lucky that my house has 300 Amp service, so I put a 100 Amp panel in the garage addition. Wish I'd done 150. At the moment I have 30A and 50A 240V outlets. I have a 70A breaker that I used for a Syncrowave 250 that is currently out on loan to a friend.
    Last edited by Oldendum; 01-15-2021 at 10:46 PM.
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  31. #44
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Do you have a link for that chart? I want to laminate it and throw it in my welding box.

  32. #45
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Shootr View Post
    New day, session 3 was dialing in the correct amperage - 72 seemed to be the sweet spot (but you tell me)

    Attachment 1722479

    After a little break, moved on to session 4 - I really think I'm making progress - again, what say you?
    Attachment 1722480

    Attachment 1722481

    So, how many pounds of rod do I have to go through to learn the secret to striking the initial arc?!?
    I drag it towards where I want to start welding it at an angle with the tip dragging on the deck, once started just wait till you get light then start where you left off or where you want to start, then just go over the marks you created starting it.

    There is a video of someone doing roots on pipe, he has perfect technique. I will try to find it. I picked up some pointers from the video.


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  34. #46
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Shootr View Post
    Holy heck was that humbling...
    Attachment 1722413

    Trying to strike the arc, feed the rod consistently. My coordination stinks lol. Above was the first effort (never tried stick before) at various amperages from 75 to 125.

    Below is the second effort after a break and some video lessons.

    Attachment 1722414

    Man, those rods get HOT! Going to be a while me thinks to get the hang of it lol.
    You should get a big wire brush, or get a wire brush for a right angle grinder and clean up before each rod. The wire brushes for the right angle grinders are expensive and they get eaten up pretty quickly but they are fast and efficient. You should chip, then wire brush before each rod.

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  36. #47
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by leightrepairs View Post
    Yes haven't seen any post from him for a while but here is the thread.

    https://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthrea...ight=6013+pipe
    Quote Originally Posted by Welder Dave View Post
    That's the guy from N Ireland. I think he was friends with CEP. Also as mentioned before the 6013 in Europe is different than the 6013 in N. America.
    Quote Originally Posted by Popeye an old miner View Post
    Ahhh ok, thats what i was thinkin of but its either uphill or rolled, not sure what made me think it was downhill. In any case his work sure is top shelf
    Wow, just went through Pipe Fitter's message thread - just... Wow.
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  38. #48
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Quote Originally Posted by Shootr View Post
    Wow, just went through Pipe Fitter's message thread - just... Wow.
    Makes ya wanna buy a truckload of 6013, eh?
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  40. #49
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Become one with the puddle, grasshopper.

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  42. #50
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    Re: First Try at Stick - 1/8" 6011

    Your improving with your stick welding. That welder is likely making life more difficult for learning. I purchased a 170 amp 110/230 stick welder from princess auto (Canadian harbor freight type store) and it's a re-named Razorweld 170, which I believe is sold in the states . Small little toaster sized inverter but it welds quite nice and burns 7018 awesome. something for you too look into for a future upgrade.

    Not sure if your welder would run 7018, but they are a great rod to learn to use, and the 7018 ac versions restrike very nice on Dc.

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