Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 26 to 47 of 47

Thread: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

  1. #26
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    6,152
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Before I get labeled as a weirdo..................

    Steel has tensile strength. Whether it's in the horizontal, or vertical, position.

    When you properly weld a thin piece of sheet, you gain the full tensile strength in the horizontal position, or whatever position you need it to be strong. The point load tries to sink into the middle, but if the sheet is restrained, the tensile strength of the metal resists stretching. All we're doing is taking advantage of the full yield strength of the steel. Sure, there are times when the stuff stretches, despite the best we've done, but it usually takes an overstress moment to do it. Depends on the application..............which in this thread was specified as a skidsteer loader. Not dumping the Empire State Building in the bed. If it's a rock bed, OP shoulda said so.

  2. #27
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Manitoba Canada
    Posts
    5,257
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by farmersammm View Post
    Bring 'er back........................................

    Attachment 1724294 Bigger'n a bread box, and way bigger'n a 11K skidsteer.
    Sam, Sam, Sam....... now you're gonna be rebuilding transmissions and front axles. Get yourself a real tractor.... think green. Or maybe industrial yellow...
    The harder you fall, the higher you bounce...

    250 amp Miller DialArc AC/DC Stick
    F-225 amp Forney AC Stick
    230 amp Sears AC Stick
    Lincoln 180C MIG
    Victor Medalist 350 O/A
    Cut 50 Plasma
    Les

  3. Likes ronsii liked this post
  4. #28
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    6,152
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by whtbaron View Post
    Sam, Sam, Sam....... now you're gonna be rebuilding transmissions and front axles. Get yourself a real tractor.... think green. Or maybe industrial yellow...
    The ol' gal has been working for about 5yrs without a hiccup. And that exhaust sounds like VICTORY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  5. #29
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    6,152
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Hell, its been longer...............we brought that in before the drought in 2011

  6. Likes whtbaron liked this post
  7. #30
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Manitoba Canada
    Posts
    5,257
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    5 yrs ago in 2011.... I've been doing that more lately too...
    The harder you fall, the higher you bounce...

    250 amp Miller DialArc AC/DC Stick
    F-225 amp Forney AC Stick
    230 amp Sears AC Stick
    Lincoln 180C MIG
    Victor Medalist 350 O/A
    Cut 50 Plasma
    Les

  8. Likes ronsii liked this post
  9. #31
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    6,152
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    we sit across the dinner table from each other, and give each other crap...........it's our way...........because we know what we've been through. Good time, bad times, and some good schmekkkkkkkin in between In our younger days, of course Best woman on the planet can serve ya up some grief at her will if she's been by your side all along, and you call it teasing. And it is..............because we don't hate each other. We have it good!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  10. #32
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    6,152
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by whtbaron View Post
    5 yrs ago in 2011.... I've been doing that more lately too...
    Gawd.................doesn't the time fly

  11. Likes whtbaron liked this post
  12. #33
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    6,152
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Geeez, am I getting old, and stupid...............or just getting more stupid............this is really getting depressing

  13. #34
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    3,816
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Thread kind of went off the rails. With all the heavy steel used, I think 10 tons would be overloaded on the OP's trailer. Axles are likely 10K but there's a lot of steel there. Sometimes it pays to get some professional help when designing things.

  14. #35
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    6,152
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Naw, it just takes a good look in the mirror, while you're brushing your teeth, to come up with a sound plan. More people oughta take the time.

  15. #36
    Join Date
    Jan 2021
    Posts
    66
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by farmersammm View Post
    Yah, I'm comin' off like a real prik, but it is what it is. You can do this if you just do it right. It's not rocket science, and it's a lot cheaper than throwing a ton of steel at something that doesn't need it. Just tie the floor to the crossmembers, and you're golden. I'm just trying to show how it can be done for the guys that just might be getting into this.
    No argument on the first.

    You're clueless when it comes to hauling rocks and dirt. Those existing crossmembers, some had to be straightened even. My skid will lift 2 tons. So I can expect that 1.5ish will be dumped from about 4', rinse, wash, repeat. Now tell me how your flatbed will remain flat with just tying the floor to the crossmembers. Can't you see that it's already bent and was welded to the crossmembers.......

    Now maybe you can tell me where those crossmembers go on a dove tail? i'll give you a hint, there aren't any. They run with the frame, not across. on the out side a 6" C would be short due to the angle. The 8" is over kill, but wraps nicely under the existing 6" for weld support. The next inside C is right below the tires when loading. The next one is as close as I can get to the frame rails, as I cannot put one in the middle due to needing that for ramps.

    You haven't showed anything. Hauling a tractor with large wheels spreads all that weight over at least 2 crossmembers. My bob has more weight per sq inch than that tractor. easy to be a arm chair engineer.

    What, you don't think the floor isn't welded to the members? Our dump beds I designed and built are being used still this day and look almost new. I've been approached to build them for others.

    Thanks for the advice though.
    Last edited by sedgehammer; 02-09-2021 at 11:03 AM.

  16. Likes ronsii liked this post
  17. #37
    Join Date
    Jan 2021
    Posts
    66
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Welder Dave View Post
    Thread kind of went off the rails. With all the heavy steel used, I think 10 tons would be overloaded on the OP's trailer. Axles are likely 10K but there's a lot of steel there. Sometimes it pays to get some professional help when designing things.
    12k axles.

    I agree. Glad I contacted myself. Most cases I do better work than the so called professionals.

  18. Likes whtbaron, ronsii liked this post
  19. #38
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    3,816
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    There was a thread awhile back where someone said all the professional welders would make stuff out 1/2" plate and super heavy etc. There needs to be a happy medium. Over building can do the opposite of what you're trying to accomplish.

  20. #39
    Join Date
    Jan 2021
    Posts
    66
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Quote Originally Posted by Welder Dave View Post
    There was a thread awhile back where someone said all the professional welders would make stuff out 1/2" plate and super heavy etc. There needs to be a happy medium. Over building can do the opposite of what you're trying to accomplish.
    I would agree 100%. Is it over built? I am sure it is. Is it grossly overbuilt? I would rather doubt it. When I'm loading that 11k lb skid, there's a lot of weight hanging off the back of the dove tail. Could I've hired an 'engineer'? Probably not. Not realistically speaking anyways. My friend who's been welding for 45 years didn't think it was way over kill.

    On a side note. If I'm going to err, it'll be towards the 'too much' vs the 'too little'

  21. Likes ronsii liked this post
  22. #40
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    6,152
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    https://pjtrailers.com/trailers/dd-tandem-dual-dump Click on the 360* view, and flip the trailer.

    Your pics don't show the underside of your trailer, but I assume it's built about the same.

    Neither the P&J, or your trailer, is properly set up for hauling concrete tearout. (You never mentioned in your initial post that you were hauling tearout). Adding the top channel really doesn't bring it up to snuff.

    To get the best bang for your buck, the flimsy side channel (which is placed in its weakest orientation) should be replaced with 3" square tubing welded where the ends of the floor crossmembers meet the side rail. Even 2 1/2" square tubing would be stronger than that channel. They didn't build the thing to haul heavy stuff with a lot of side pressure on the walls.

    https://tellsteel.com/AlloyAbrasionResistingPlate.html The AR plate has excellent tensile strength. It would benefit from the stitch welding procedure I mentioned earlier. You got what?.........maybe 2000lbs tied up in the new floor, and half sides?

    I never said there was anything wrong with the dovetail. I don't like the sides, and the top rail. Being as you're hauling breakout, I guess the new floor plate is warranted. You need to say what you're hauling when you post something up.

  23. #41
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    6,152
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    BTW...............................I ran both the old style Fruehauff tub framed dumps, and the newer style frameless dumps, when I was a kid in my 20's. Gravel, dirt, and peat moss. They did have rip rap beds back then, and probably still do. They were a very specialized animal.

    Realistically, what you got there is a fairly light duty gooseneck. It's good for what it's made for, but it's tough to remake it into a rock hauler. Even the floor crossmember spacing is light duty from what I see............I can't see what the crossmembers actually are. 3" channel, 16"-18" O.C, would be appropriate. I'll edit this if I can look at the pics again, and prove myself wrong.

  24. #42
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    6,152
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Before I get outta here............................

    I like 1" welds every 4-6".

    Name:  floor6.jpg
Views: 110
Size:  178.2 KB

    I always pre-stress the frame to compensate for all the heat from welding the floor. In this case, the frame is slightly bowed by the bulk of the weight being carried by the single jackstand near the middle of the frame length. I do it differently on heavier frames, but it's still the same principle.

    Name:  floor7.jpg
Views: 111
Size:  200.5 KB

    Consequently, as opposed to the lousy tack job on factory built stuff, I get a nice flat floor that's been fully welded across all members.

    Name:  floor5.jpg
Views: 110
Size:  248.6 KB

    Just a little demo for y'all non perfeshinals

  25. Likes sedgehammer, Lis2323 liked this post
  26. #43
    Join Date
    Jan 2021
    Posts
    66
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Not hauling rock per se. Drive way tear outs, stumps, over burden on new drive ways, top soil, millings etc. It's not that we max out weight on all the loads, typically it's not a full load unless it's scale loaded by loader. Since the bob can reach to the center, we can dump the big stuff right in the center. We purchased it bent up. In process of straightening it out and will replace the floor at a later date.

    The trailer when purchased had 7' or 8' sides. It's lighter now then when purchased by a fair amount. I put the channel on the sides, as it matched what was there and I wasn't going to remove them all (many dump truck beds use a bent C for their uprights, I used tube). The top C was chosen for strength and weight. Yes tube is stronger, but it also dents easier, this is harder to dent up. The size tube and thickness available was a fair amount heavier. Plus the C was in stock. On our dump truck beds we used tube and then a C on top of that with a flange for a 2 x 12. Will also add a flange for a 2 x 8 or so possibly.

    The floor is stich welded as you mentioned. Side are fully due to it being blasted at some time and painted, prolly, hopefully, maybe.

    I didn't post the trailer pic to show I'm better or smarter than everyone here. I posted them because I thought it turned out nice, haven't ever seen a dove on a dump trailer and it serves our needed purposes well thus far. Could it have been done better and lighter, yes, I am sure it could have, but not by much.

  27. #44
    Join Date
    Jan 2021
    Posts
    66
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    farmersammm, you sound like you know your stuff, so I don't want to get in a pissin match with you and besides that, if your farming, you need to be an engineer on demand. I grew up on a farm and am self taught in pretty much everything I've done.
    Last edited by sedgehammer; 02-10-2021 at 11:26 AM.

  28. #45
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    6,152
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    Like I said, the dovetail is fine. They present a unique problem because of the cantilever, and have to be stout.

    The sides are the way they sent the trailer out the door, other than a redesign, it's what you're stuck with.

    I'm just stuck on using the lightest material possible. Sometimes it's not right for every application.

  29. Likes sedgehammer liked this post
  30. #46
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Western Washington
    Posts
    10,551
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    502 fix - sammmy broke it

  31. #47
    Join Date
    Jan 2021
    Posts
    66
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Flat bed dump trailer conversion to dove tail dump trailer

    I was wonderin what happened.

  32. Likes ronsii liked this post

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Page generated in 1,638,391,364.98267 seconds with 13 queries