Rod type for stick welding

[husq2100]

Hey all, I have a little job to do on short notice, figure id give stick a go. I have a little 140amp DC inverter. I will be welding 3/16" mild steel SHS to 1/4" flat plate mild steel (just an over sized end cap)

Fillet weld.

Here are my rod choices:

https://www.boc.com.au/shop/en/au/we...mma-electrodes

Best I can tell by what I see you guys code your rods are - 7016, 6013 and 7018.

I would like to know what rod type, dia and amps to use.

cheers
Serg

[monsoon-mech]

3/32" 7018 DCEP at 65-100 amps, every machine is a little different so start low and see how it performs add amperage as needed

[Louie1961]

+1 although in the flat or overhead position I might go with a 1/8th inch rod at about 120-125 amps. But that's just preference.

[MinnesotaDave]

3/32" 7018 DCEP at 65-100 amps, every machine is a little different so start low and see how it performs add amperage as needed

Yep, that's my vote too, plus it's what I have on hand anyway

But I don't mind using 6013 or 7016 for just an end cap.

[albrightree]

Structural or protective ? E7018 3/32"

Non-Critical , looks pretty, little to no sanding or grinding E6013 3/32"

Smootharc 13 is a thicker coated all positional rutile electrode that performs very well in the down hand position,
exceptionally well in the vertical-up and overhead positions,
and can also be used in the vertical-down position.
The electrode welds with a very smooth, low spatter arc to produce
a finely rippled bead surface with excellent slag detachability.

* For welding mild steels, sheet metal, tank work and general fabrication
* Excellent strike / re-strike and a high tolerance to large gaps or poor fit-up
* Easy to use and recommended for all round fabrication work
* Especially good for the less experienced welder

I'm sure at least one person will recommend the E7016, but I have never personally used it. My personal favorite is E7014 , but its not listed on your page. I did notice a 2.5Kg box of Smooth Arc 312 2.5mm for $427 dollars(aus?) wow, I'm sure that would look nice, and never suffer from cracking/weldability/corrosion issues.

Both of the above electrodes play well with most inverter welders too.

Let us know what you decide, I have a little of everything in the shop, so I know how hard it can be to decide. Buy'em both and try'em both. Post a pic if you can.

Cheers

[husq2100]

Thanks guys 👍👍

I went with 7018. They only had 1/8 in stock (and only that size listed on the shelf)

Here are the first welds. I had tried stick once many many years ago but absolutely sucked balls at it. I just watched one of Jodies videos and had a crack...

[Welder Dave]

Could fill the start and stop (corners) a little more but overall pretty good.

[husq2100]

Could fill the start and stop (corners) a little more but overall pretty good.

Yes, I definitely need more work at this! You blokes would have had a good chuckle at me trying to start with a used rod, sometimes they would strike easy, others was like a blind man tapping out the Webster’s dictionary via Morse code ��

[husq2100]

I ran my little machine at 125 amps - 7018 1/8 rod.

Here are a couple more pics. Sometimes the slag (if that’s what the burnt layer of flux sitting on the weld is called?) would be uniform and come off reasonably easy, most it didn’t . But the weld did not seem to vary as much as the slag??

[MISSING LINK]

I would say that's fairly normal for the slag to not sit uniform on top of the weld. Your welds look fairly smooth and overall pretty good. Couple of rough spots here and there but that comes with practice. Like was mentioned before maybe tie in your corners a little better, but that could be accomplished by practice and knowing how long each Rod will weld so you don't have to start off the end of your weld you can run into your weld. Sometimes the slag comes off easy, sometimes not, no matter what brand rod. Looks good, keep it up!

[husq2100]

Am I correct in saying that the weld has to be thoroughly cleaned before another weld can be stopped or started on the previous?

That slag gets in every nook and cranny

[Louie1961]

I like Jody's technique of wrapping around the corner before stopping. You don't need to clean the entire weld for a restart, just in the area where you want to tie in the restart. Some people say you don't even have to do that if the base metal is hot enough, but I always do.

[Welder Dave]

Try turning your heat up about 5 amps. It should flatten the bead slightly.

Generally you clean the slag off before continuing the weld or doing a pass(s) over top. However if you are doing a multi-pass weld with 7018 and the piece is quite hot you don't have to chip the slag off. You have to chip it off the first pass for sure but the not for the 2 passes that will go over the first pass. Again the piece has to be pretty hot. If you're doing another 3 passes over top of the 2 should work good. (Slag needs to be chipped on each layer) The advantage of leaving the slag on when doing a multi-pass weld is the weld will be extremely smooth and look almost like a very wide single pass except for more than one row of ripples in the bead. Saves a little time too by not having to chip the slag off every pass.

[CAVEMANN]

7018 will create a small ball of slag over the end of the rod that makes restarts kind of suck if you don't clean it off first, some keep an old file on hand just for that purpose, I just tap the table or floor to knock it off.

[husq2100]

Thanks guys.

So if I’m going to get into this a bit more and focus on structural steel type jobs, posts, beams, cleats etc, is 7018 the rod of choice regardless of position or joint?

[Willie B]

For strength you choose between 6011, and 7018. 6010 & 6011 are deep penetrating rods, both are fast freeze. They work well even on dirty steel, (rusty). they still perform best on clean properly shaped joints. 6011 has arc stabilizers in the flux, so it works well with AC or inverter machines.

7018 is low hydrogen. Numerous sources of hydrogen affect a weld. Virtually all dirt, grease, and contaminants contribute hydrogen, as hydrocarbons break down. Water, and hydrocarbon flux contribute. Hydrogen molecules can cause weld Lack Of Fusion, in a similar way that PAM does in a frying pan. Plenty of knowledgeable people will argue that only matters in high strength steel.

For a cap, mostly cosmetic 6013 is a great choice. You don't need deep penetration to blast away rust, or grease/paint. You want a manageable weld.

I'd choose 3/32" rod as your welder is limited in output.

[Welder Dave]

7018 is the rod of choice if you want something to stay together. All the engineering mumbo jumbo won't matter for 95% of the projects done on this forum. 6010/6011 are better for dirty rusty steel and/or when you want the deepest penetration. 6010 is often used for the first pass followed by 7018. 6013 is good for sheet metal. Anything thicker than 1/8" there are better choices than 6013. 7018 does have to be kept dry but does not require an oven unless doing code quality welding, usually on pressure vessels or piping. OP's 7018 are perfectly fine except for some minor details mentioned. If you looked in most rig welders trucks you'd likely find 6010, 7018 and maybe 7024 for production non critical jobs.

[walker]

I second going around the corner before stopping. It is more difficult, but it teaches you to loosen up a bit, and takes the starts and stops out of the corner.

[husq2100]

Thanks again guys. I actually had a box of what turns out 6011 but they are at least 10 years old. The 7018 came in a tube with a reusable plastic cap so that should help.

I do also have a 250amp dc inverter that is my TIG rig. I couldn’t find the hand piece ( not sure if I ever got one)

I will try and find some 3/32 7018.. and I guess it’s time to watch a few more of Jodies videos and get some scrap.

[ttoks]

take it from a fellow aussie, use the 7016, they're a way more newb friendly rod to run and are still a ductile hydrogen controlled weld equal to 7018.

This is a vertical up with WIA 16TC 7016, they're idiot proof.

[husq2100]

Ok so is there a rule of thumb to choosing rod size? Ie plate thickness? joint type? (ignore my little welder output for this one)

And in what situation would you say choose to do a 6010/6011 root and cap out with 7018?

[ttoks]

Ok so is there a rule of thumb to choosing rod size? Ie plate thickness? joint type? (ignore my little welder output for this one)

And in what situation would you say choose to do a 6010/6011 root and cap out with 7018?

pretty much material thickness, joint type and your experience with them, say overhead vs flat vs vertical, you can weld any thickness material thickness over 3mm with a 2,5m rod, you just need to do more passes but you will struggle welding 3mm with a 3.2mm rod especially if you don't have a lot of experience, it's also easier to run a smaller rod out of position, so you might use a 3.2 for flat and switch to 2.5 for a vertical or overhead just because its easier if you don't have alot of experience welding out of position.

With 7016/7018 I tend to reach for 2.5mm rod for 3-6mm thickness and 3.2 for pretty much anything more, sometimes 4mm if I'm doing a big job with alot of welding that for some reason can't be MIG welded.

As for 6010 root with 7018 over the top, pretty much only two cases, first is if the WPS calls for it, the other is if you HAVE to weld something that's dirty, oily, rusty ect that you can't get clean as 6010 deals with contamination alot better than 7016/7018, this is a job where I used 6010 for the rood with 7016 over the top because there was alot of dirt packed in the backside of the plate that I couldn't get out, so 6010 first pass to burn it out, then 3 passes of 7016 to get a nice strong ductile weld which is important for a dozer blade.



If speed is more important than the mechanical properties of the weld than use 6010 as it is alot faster for open root, but If you're using 6010 for speed, then you might as well do the whole weld with it, if quality is most important than use 7018 all the way.

[husq2100]

Thanks mate , good info. I’ll pick up some 7016 in 2.5.

What would be the shelf life on a pack of 6011. Sitting in a garaged toolbox in SEQ.

[ttoks]

coming into the dry season up there they should be fine until the wet season hits, 6011 (as well as 6010 and 6013) doesn't normally need a rod oven to keep them dry but the humidity up there can get pretty brutal in the wet season, I'd try and keep them inside with the air con if you run one but dont bother with a rod oven.

If the rods are sealed in an air tight container they're fine.

Now with the 7016 and 7018 normally for non coded work (where the WPS or code specifies rod baking) I think they're fine to be left out as well, but in the wet season up there they're going to absorb ALOT of water and you'll want to bake them at 150C for a while if they're from an open pack in the wet season, in the dry season keeping them in an air tight container should be fine as well though.

I think when well looked after most rods will last decades, but I couldn't really give you a timeframe of "they'll be good for x in Y conditions" keep the 6011/6010 sealed up and they should be good, and bake the hydrogen controlled rods before use in the wet season is the best ballpark I can give you.

[husq2100]

Thanks again. It might be wise for me to invest in some decent rod containers as this isn’t my day job and it would be wasteful to not look after the rods.