Argon tank from Craigslist?

[12V71]

That’s not necessarily true.
I own cylinders that have names on the neck rings.
We can have this discussion until the cows come home but the only thing that matters is what the gas supplier says that he takes his cylinder to.

Right, my commercial account states "all customer owned cylinders" If I do rent one such as a nitrogen cylinder for charging hydraulic accumulators, that on will be noted as a rental. If I need to I can exchange any number of "my" cylinders for nameless neck rings to do work outside their territory. Otherwise they just swap them out without worrying too much about neck ring stampings.
If I were to sell my cylinders outright I would at least exchange them for empties with blank neck rings or just sell them back to my supplier for current value credit on my account. Yes, that has been discussed with them.

[danielplace]

That’s not necessarily true.
I own cylinders that have names on the neck rings.
We can have this discussion until the cows come home but the only thing that matters is what the gas supplier says that he takes his cylinder to.

Exactly. Some gas suppliers just simply do not have the inventory of actual customer owned bottles so they give out ones with their name on them.

That makes it a customer owned with their name. They know they do it so they will also take them like that for exchange.

Some absolutely do not do it that way ever. Blank ring or one that says customer owned are only thing they exchange as customer owned.

[scsmith42]

That’s not necessarily true.
I own cylinders that have names on the neck rings.
We can have this discussion until the cows come home but the only thing that matters is what the gas supplier says that he takes his cylinder to.

That's good to know. In the states where I have lived owner bottles typically did not have gas supplier names on the rings.

[TexasT]

Seeing as Houston is the fourth largest city in America and has Ship yards, oil field and chemical plants as well as all kinds of other industry, I know there are numerous welding and gas suppliers down there. A simple duckduckgo search yielded me a bunch of suppliers and matheson, airgas, and praxair wouldn't be my first choices unless you know someone who works at them.

http://www.professionalweldingsupply.com/gases/
https://www.coastalws.com/location/houston/
http://aramaxinc.com
https://www.havardwelding.com

https://duckduckgo.com/?q=houston+we...ly&t=h_&ia=web

I can't imagine there isn't one closer than forty minutes away. That isn't to say going a little or a lot further isn't going to result in a better or less expensive experience.
I went the route you are trying to do with a craigslist seller. I wouldn't recommend it as you really don't know what you are getting. I worked for two different gas suppliers and know people who work for several other gas places in town so I have some knowledge of what I am getting into and how to get them traded or filled. Getting a blast n paint, swapping valves and such is handled by a place that usually does it for many gas suppliers. That is why it takes longer and Usually only has a drop off/pick up once a week in my experience so two weeks if everything goes ok with your cylinder would be the norm to get these services done. You never want to paint your cylinder. This is a GIANT red flag to a gas supplier that you are trying to pull a fast one.

Call around some and explain to them what you want and see what they offer. Some might not want to fool with you and others will be more than happy to. You just have to figure out which ones are which.

[danielplace]

That's good to know. In the states where I have lived owner bottles typically did not have gas supplier names on the rings.

Typically that is the rule if any writing at all it would say Customer Owned otherwise it is clean blank ring. That is generally the way it is supposed to work.

Most down south go by that then I moved to Ocala and they have different rules. Namely they do not have many customer owned in the inventory so you are stuck with their name on your tank and you will never get a true customer owned back for it ever most likely.


>>>>

Sure can't imagine buying a tank from a gas supplier. They are almost double most places what you can get one delivered with the gas. Then they won't even sell you big tanks most of them anymore. So you going to pay $200 for a 80 cu ft or if they will even sell a 125 it will be $400. That is insanity.

[G-ManBart]

Typically that is the rule if any writing at all it would say Customer Owned otherwise it is clean blank ring. That is generally the way it is supposed to work.

But that isn't true many places so saying "that is generally the way it is supposed to work" isn't really true.

When it comes to bottles there really aren't any general rules....it all just depends. I have bottles from three of the biggest shops in the area, all are owned, and they all have names on the rings. I don't think I've seen a single bottle here that was marked "Customer Owned" or anything similar and I've looked at hundreds and hundreds of bottles. Many of the bottles are marked with the names of companies that the current company bought up in the past, so they don't even always have the correct name on them...they don't bother changing the ring.

[danielplace]

But that isn't true many places so saying "that is generally the way it is supposed to work" isn't really true.

When it comes to bottles there really aren't any general rules....it all just depends. I have bottles from three of the biggest shops in the area, all are owned, and they all have names on the rings. I don't think I've seen a single bottle here that was marked "Customer Owned" or anything similar and I've looked at hundreds and hundreds of bottles. Many of the bottles are marked with the names of companies that the current company bought up in the past, so they don't even always have the correct name on them...they don't bother changing the ring.

That is because the have given up on the traditional rules but it is still how it is "supposed" to work.

Some work that way here too. Mine for example same way. There is no reason for customer owned when they won't sell them even anymore in a lot of places. Once us people with customer owned die off they will have the lease market on every tank over 80 or 125.

The gas suppliers are actually grinding off names to create Customer Owned blank rings because they know that is how it is supposed to work.

Evidently though certain areas as yours have just given up and tired of turning away business. It is actually a law about this on the books that says they can not deal with a competitors name on a tank and fines are very stiff for violations. Some places the law is in place and also enforced.

Yes you are right many places buy up competitors inventories or ones that have closed their doors and you may see all sorts of names on bottles that are their bottles and they can prove it and then they may use them as customer owned because for them to deal in actual customer owned bottles would mean buying new inventory which they are never going to do when they have perfectly good tanks only with names. Oh well if the customer wants gas he will take them but they really are not actual customer owned bottles even if IN FACT you do actually own them.

Actual customer owned tanks will always be blank or say customer owned and are ACCEPTED EVERYWHERE as CUSTOMER OWNED. Your tanks with names on them will not be acceptable everywhere as a customer owned tank.

More reading typical of what everyone has been saying.
https://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/fo...-and-ownership

[G-ManBart]

That is because the have given up on the traditional rules but it is still how it is "supposed" to work.

Some work that way here too. Mine for example same way. There is no reason for customer owned when they won't sell them even anymore in a lot of places. Once us people with customer owned die off they will have the lease market on every tank over 80 or 125.

The gas suppliers are actually grinding off names to create Customer Owned blank rings because they know that is how it is supposed to work.

Evidently though certain areas as yours have just given up and tired of turning away business. It is actually a law about this on the books that says they can not deal with a competitors name on a tank and fines are very stiff for violations. Some places the law is in place and also enforced.

Yes you are right many places buy up competitors inventories or ones that have closed their doors and you may see all sorts of names on bottles that are their bottles and they can prove it and then they may use them as customer owned because for them to deal in actual customer owned bottles would mean buying new inventory which they are never going to do when they have perfectly good tanks only with names. Oh well if the customer wants gas he will take them but they really are not actual customer owned bottles even if IN FACT you do actually own them.

Actual customer owned tanks will always be blank or say customer owned and are ACCEPTED EVERYWHERE as CUSTOMER OWNED. Your tanks with names on them will not be acceptable everywhere as a customer owned tank.

More reading typical of what everyone has been saying.
https://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/fo...-and-ownership

Just because you say that's how it's "supposed to work" doesn't make it true and trying to say they are "traditional rules" is silly because that simply isn't factual...it has varied by location and store for decades.

Any business that grinds off the names on a neck ring is stupid. It takes about a minute to pop off a neck ring and replace it with a blank one. Anybody who knows how this actually works know that. Some shops do that when they buy another shop and collect all their bottles, but that's definitely not always the case. I've been given an exchange bottle from a major national brand that had the neck ring from a company they bought 10-20 years prior.

Where is this law that says someone can't sell a tank with a competitor's name or face stiff fines? I've seen people say this before but nobody can ever actually show where the law is posted.

Sorry, but your entire statement that customer owned bottles will always be either blank or say customer owned is false, and they won't always be accepted everywhere. I have walked into three large shops and bought bottles that had their name on them...they weren't blank, and they weren't marked "customer owned" or anything like that. If you show up with a bottle that has their name on it they swap it for the same price. They don't care if you're leasing the bottle or own it...as long as it's one of theirs it makes no difference to them. The lease people simply pay monthly and the owners pay up front. The swap is no different to the shop...the owners already paid and the leasers pay every month. The only time it would be an issue is if a customer wanted to switch to another company or was moving.

I can buy a 330 bottle at one local Airgas and the other won't swap it even with ownership paperwork...one will sell that size only to commercial operations and the other won't. Both are Airgas stores, but under different ownership. I had an Airgas owner 330 bottle with paperwork and one store simply wouldn't touch it "no way for us to even put that in the computer to bill you" was what they said. The other shop didn't blink and asked if I wanted the same gas or something different.

The short version is...there is no one way things are supposed to be done and certainly no one way things are actually done. I'm not sure what a 12 year old thread on Home Shop Machinist has to do with anything...

[danielplace]

Just because you say that's how it's "supposed to work" doesn't make it true and trying to say they are "traditional rules" is silly because that simply isn't factual...it has varied by location and store for decades.

Any business that grinds off the names on a neck ring is stupid. It takes about a minute to pop off a neck ring and replace it with a blank one. Anybody who knows how this actually works know that. Some shops do that when they buy another shop and collect all their bottles, but that's definitely not always the case. I've been given an exchange bottle from a major national brand that had the neck ring from a company they bought 10-20 years prior.

Where is this law that says someone can't sell a tank with a competitor's name or face stiff fines? I've seen people say this before but nobody can ever actually show where the law is posted.

Sorry, but your entire statement that customer owned bottles will always be either blank or say customer owned is false, and they won't always be accepted everywhere. I have walked into three large shops and bought bottles that had their name on them...they weren't blank, and they weren't marked "customer owned" or anything like that. If you show up with a bottle that has their name on it they swap it for the same price. They don't care if you're leasing the bottle or own it...as long as it's one of theirs it makes no difference to them. The lease people simply pay monthly and the owners pay up front. The swap is no different to the shop...the owners already paid and the leasers pay every month. The only time it would be an issue is if a customer wanted to switch to another company or was moving.

I can buy a 330 bottle at one local Airgas and the other won't swap it even with ownership paperwork...one will sell that size only to commercial operations and the other won't. Both are Airgas stores, but under different ownership. I had an Airgas owner 330 bottle with paperwork and one store simply wouldn't touch it "no way for us to even put that in the computer to bill you" was what they said. The other shop didn't blink and asked if I wanted the same gas or something different.

The short version is...there is no one way things are supposed to be done and certainly no one way things are actually done. I'm not sure what a 12 year old thread on Home Shop Machinist has to do with anything...

I understand fully what you are saying. Our local Matheson will sure enough sell you only their tank because that is all they have to sell. It won't be a problem getting exchanges at Matheson with it later you have your proof they sold it to you and be marked on your account as such but it is completely worthless anywhere else. If all your suppliers don't care your golden. Every where I go cares and will NOT touch another companies bottle.


If you think you can swap neck rings in a minute you are mistaken. The actual neckring is the threaded portion that the cap screws on and it is welded to the neck of the tank at the top. The tank refurbishing companies change the neck rings all the time when they freshen them up for gas companies and will put the name they want on the ring or make them customer owned with blank or neck ring marked customer owned. Neck ring covers now are just BS glued on over the neck ring and those pry right off.

The companies selling you THEIR TANKS WITH THEIR NAMES on them is what they love for people to buy from them. Then they have to get the gas from them because others likely won't touch the tank you have because it has their name and is NOT TRULY a customer owned tank EVEN if you did pay for it and do own it.

Tanks with blank rings or customer owned on them guarantees that a gas company does not own it. They never lease those tanks because the are precious commodity these days. If you got blank or customer owned they know YOU paid for it.


They are selling you that because that is what they have for inventory because that is how they deal. A customer owned tank surely is considered blank or customer owned on the neck ring.

Haul what you think are customer owned down to south florida and see how much they are worth to you real fast and get schooled on what a customer owned tank looks like.

Yea you can buy and trade up where you bought them from but go elsewhere and you will find out otherwise or you will get out the grinder. Lol.

These CUSTOMER OWNED tanks will be accepted as customer owned anywhere. Yours would not be. You are buying gas company tanks because that is what they are selling. You can find your self in a pickle and those tanks are almost worthless to try and sell. I insist all mine stay blank or customer owned because I know for a fact what can happen when you need gas and they don't know you or your tanks. You aren't going to get gas. Period. End of story. If your entire area and all the gas companies where your at really just don't care I recon you are golden if you stay in the area that follows suit. Go else where and you have scrap metal. Not even worth it for scrap because scrap doesn't take tanks. Lol.

[G-ManBart]

I understand fully what you are saying. Our local Matheson will sure enough sell you only their tank because that is all they have to sell. It won't be a problem getting exchanges at Matheson with it later you have your proof they sold it to you and be marked on your account as such but it is completely worthless anywhere else. If all your suppliers don't care your golden. Every where I go cares and will NOT touch another companies bottle.


If you think you can swap neck rings in a minute you are mistaken. The actual neckring is the threaded portion that the cap screws on and it is welded to the neck of the tank at the top. The tank refurbishing companies change the neck rings all the time when they freshen them up for gas companies and will put the name they want on the ring or make them customer owned with blank or neck ring marked customer owned. Neck ring covers now are just BS glued on over the neck ring and those pry right off.

The companies selling you THEIR TANKS WITH THEIR NAMES on them is what they love for people to buy from them. Then they have to get the gas from them because others likely won't touch the tank you have because it has their name and is NOT TRULY a customer owned tank EVEN if you did pay for it and do own it.

Tanks with blank rings or customer owned on them guarantees that a gas company does not own it. They never lease those tanks because the are precious commodity these days. If you got blank or customer owned they know YOU paid for it.


They are selling you that because that is what they have for inventory because that is how they deal. A customer owned tank surely is considered blank or customer owned on the neck ring.

Haul what you think are customer owned down to south florida and see how much they are worth to you real fast and get schooled on what a customer owned tank looks like.

Yea you can buy and trade up where you bought them from but go elsewhere and you will find out otherwise or you will get out the grinder. Lol.

These CUSTOMER OWNED tanks will be accepted as customer owned anywhere. Yours would not be. You are buying gas company tanks because that is what they are selling. You can find your self in a pickle and those tanks are almost worthless to try and sell. I insist all mine stay blank or customer owned because I know for a fact what can happen when you need gas and they don't know you or your tanks. You aren't going to get gas. Period. End of story. If your entire area and all the gas companies where your at really just don't care I recon you are golden if you stay in the area that follows suit. Go else where and you have scrap metal. Not even worth it for scrap because scrap doesn't take tanks. Lol.

I'm not going to bother going through this point by point because far too much of it is simply wrong. You're basing your comments on what you see locally, but is not true everywhere.

Two things...

I didn't say I can swap neck rings, I said it's easy to do...hydro companies do it all the time. The rings are pressed and peened in place, not welded. Here are pictures of the equipment used:
https://weldingweb.com/vbb/threads/2...41#post2444041

When you say things like "These CUSTOMER OWNED tanks will be accepted as customer owned anywhere." it's simply not true. In some places there is no such thing as a customer owned bottle in certain sizes, so even though you own it, it won't be accepted by local shops if it's a certain size.

This is why I have said over and over that everything depends on the local area, and the shops, not what someone on the internet thinks.

[danielplace]

I'm not going to bother going through this point by point because far too much of it is simply wrong. You're basing your comments on what you see locally, but is not true everywhere.

Two things...

I didn't say I can swap neck rings, I said it's easy to do...hydro companies do it all the time. The rings are pressed and peened in place, not welded. Here are pictures of the equipment used:
https://weldingweb.com/vbb/threads/2...41#post2444041

When you say things like "These CUSTOMER OWNED tanks will be accepted as customer owned anywhere." it's simply not true. In some places there is no such thing as a customer owned bottle in certain sizes, so even though you own it, it won't be accepted by local shops if it's a certain size.

This is why I have said over and over that everything depends on the local area, and the shops, not what someone on the internet thinks.

You are absolutely right different places sure as heck do it differently.

I think that anybody reading this is smart enough to figure different places obviously do it differently from the different comments we and others have posted.
It will never change the fact of what a true "customer owned" tank looks like. Not a customer owned gas companies tank.

How does your area even differentiate what they own and what customers own ?

Just nobody cares at all where you are and all tanks are created equal and can have any gas companies name on them at all is what your saying ?

But then you say if they are blank or says customer owned those they won't touch or deal with. How would that make any sense at all ?

I think we all get the idea IT MATTERS WHO YOUR DEALING WITH.

[BillZ]

Just my thoughts on the matter; I'm from a small town very near Houston & I've found out that is is much easier to work with the welder suppliers in the smaller towns than in Houston. I can buy bottles and get them filled for about half of what Houston suppliers are asking. Yes, some extra driving but worth it in the long run.

When I find a bottle at a garage or estate sale, I take a picture of it and text it to one of the welder suppliers and just ask them if they will fill it. Yes, you have to have some kind of relationship with them in order to get the cell phone number.

It pays to be a regular.

[Rondo]

You can buy the tank and if it has no current name on the neck ring or a company that was bought out or closed you can easily create and print your own receipt showing your name and purchase date. Some of the programs on line are pretty slick. I can't think of any LWS that won't fill a customer owned cylinder. You'll still be on the hook for hydrotest every 5 years and if it looks rough you can give it a quick low cost paint job.

[cornemuse]

Pretty much no. Those are aluminum cylinders. CO2 only.

I bought a 35cf ?? 'empty' aluminium CO2 tank from a yard sale, took it to 5 Star (matheson) exchanged it for migmix no hassles.

-corne-

[12V71]

I bought a 35cf ?? 'empty' aluminium CO2 tank from a yard sale, took it to 5 Star (matheson) exchanged it for migmix no hassles.

-corne-

That is my supplier's policy regarding aluminum cylinders. May not apply to all of them. I'll have to see what the pressure stampings are on a 50# cylinder. Got one at the shop right now.

[FJCruiser]

I found what appears to be a 250-300 cf tank embossed Matheson sold locally. Tank is 55” to top of valve, 9” diameter. Guy says he was swapped one from Matheson for his own so he owns it. Just want to make sure I’m not getting hoodwinked before I buy it. Appreciate any help

[danielplace]

I found what appears to be a 250-300 cf tank embossed Matheson sold locally. Tank is 55” to top of valve, 9” diameter. Guy says he was swapped one from Matheson for his own so he owns it. Just want to make sure I’m not getting hoodwinked before I buy it. Appreciate any help

What he is telling you is almost 100% true they do that. You may or may not have trouble getting it exchanged. You won't know for sure until you try. You need account at Matheson first or you will be making a big mistake. Account first. Then talk about gas next visit after buying something you need when opening account. It is a game you must play along by the rules.