Pipe Stands

[farmersammm]

A piece of scrap is turned to make a welding fixture/gauge. The diameter is determined by the hole diameter in the plate. My mill has a quill that's prone to runout, and will make a hole about .010 oversize when using an annular cutter. Nothing really wrong with the mill, it's just the way it was made. The quill doesn't fit as tight as a Bridgeport quill.

The DOM is bored to receive the pin, and will clear the Acme threaded rod by about .015. The pin is a handy gauge when sizing the DOM.



This is how the guide/fixture works. Just a matter of inserting the pin in both pieces, and clamping it up for welding.

X6

If I get around to it, I'll weld it out tomorrow.

[farmersammm]

I had a bit of worry today. It dawned on me that the Acme rod might not be mild steel, and because of that...............possibly difficult to weld. I've welded this stuff in the past, but not for anything that required any real strength.

It turns out that the steel is a medium carbon steel. Not something I want to weld if it's gonna hold a load.

At this point, I've figured out a workaround that allows me to weld it, but only to lock it to the pipe cradle thingy. The way I'm gonna do it will not place the weld in stress, or change the rod chemistry in an area that matters. PITA.

Ten years ago, or so, I would have just welded it.............and never considered that it might be a problem. Get smarter with age I guess.

Bob suggested using a coupling nut to mount the cradle to the rod...................But WOW!!!!!!!!!!! I priced some Acme coupling nuts, and they're running about TWENTY FIVE BUCKS APIECE from McMaster It seems when you get into 1", and above, Acme threaded rod....the stuff that goes with it gets real expensive.

Anyways..........I have it covered.

[whtbaron]

Yep... that's why the RAE vice with the broken ACME rod went into the "spare parts" pile. I was looking at half the cost of a new vice just to fix it and I still needed to weld the ball for the handle onto the rod.

[farmersammm]

Got everything welded out today.

Now I get to cut it all apart tomorrow

I welded the plugs on the wrong end of the tubing..................ALL 6 OF THEM

I think I've turned into a doddering old fool

[Lis2323]

They were good welds tho, right?


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[farmersammm]

They were good welds tho, right?


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Uh................................no.

[whtbaron]

That's odd... usually the ones you have to cut apart are almost perfect...

[Lis2323]

My good welds are always the ones on the backside or out of sight.


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[farmersammm]

So, I'm gettin' ready to cut them apart.......................And I'm thinking they don't look THAT bad

I mean, like............I've seen worse

OH.........THE AGONY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[shortfuse]

Gee whiz...I can't remember the last time or if I ever made a weld in the wrong place...........OH, now I remember, it was yesterday.

Don't sweat it, sammm. You are NOT in an exclusive club!

[farmersammm]

Group Photo!!

Have to move hay off the field on the other side of the creek, so I guess that's it for the day. If K'kins gets home, and I'm not done moving it

[farmersammm]

I imagine you're wondering why I welded all this stuff overhead. I haven't welded out of position for well over a year I'm thinkin'. Haven't made anything big in a long time, so it's easy just to flip stuff to weld it.

When the plugs were made, I cut the plate on the chop saw......which isn't very accurate. Center marks for the machining were made from one edge, without averaging out the difference. I called it a nominal 3", and just set my marks 1.5" in from one side. So, in order to actually center the hole, it's a matter of eyeballing it as it sits on top of the tubing, then just clamp it up, and weld it.

Another reason to go overhead is because I can, or used to be able to, do it fairly well.....................and I need the practice for the upcoming crane build. I can't stand doing a crap job...............................so in retrospect, today was an opportunity to do better than I did the first go around.

My eyesight is getting worse, and I've pretty much lost a good deal of my depth perception. Like anything else that happens to us humans, we adapt. I'm able to see the puddle profile if I look from the back of the puddle towards the arc/rod. It makes all the difference in the world. I finally figured it out today..........it's a bit of a departure from the way I've always welded.

[farmersammm]

It's always been my goal to put out a weld that you can't tell how it was made. Flat, horizontal, overhead, etc. It should just look like a weld. It's a hard thing to drive yourself to do. But, if you keep at it, it makes you feel better about what you're doing. I guess I'll never get there 100%, but it keeps you feeling alive if you keep trying.

Tomorrow I figure I'll make a fixture to weld up the cradle plates/arms. Weld them out, then do a thing to make them safely attach to the Acme threaded rod. It's gonna be a PITA workaround. This whole job has been a ton more work than I anticipated.

[farmersammm]

BTW.....................all but one set of welds were made with 3/32 Excalibur running at 90 amps. I like the higher amps because it makes for a flatter bead, and keeps your rod lit when you're shoving it up into the puddle.

One set of welds was made with 1/8 Atom Arc, but I forget which one it was. I can say that it was really excellent. Amperage was 115. I had to abandon the 1/8 because I was getting a keyhole in the 11ga tubing. A straight drag was putting too much heat in the puddle,, and I didn't want to start whipping it to cool the puddle down. But that total drag was a thing of beauty.........no ripples......clean as ice. I think the Atom Arc will work really well on the pipe, although I'll still try the old favorite Excalibur.

One thing about Excalibur is the fact that it has very heavy slag. Slag helps to hold your puddle together when welding out of position. It starts to cool,, and form a cover the instant the arc moves on. Some of it falls on ya, but that's just a fraction of the total slag output. This helps you to carry more metal, without the fear of spilling the puddle on your lap, head, arm, and whatever ya really don't wanna burn.

I've always found it a bit unnerving when the molten slag drops on your arms. The leathers prevent burning, but it's still a funny sound to get used to. It's sorta like raindrops.

[ghost_walker]

not really clear from the pics how it was the wrong end. unless you mean the distance of the holes from the piece you welded in.

in that case would it not have been easier just to drill another hole? and say i meant to do that?

[shortfuse]

Nice welds, sammm.

Wish mine would come out that good.... (I know, practice, practice, practice.) My biggest problem lately is that I'll have a beautiful puddle and weld going for me and then suddenly my arm will jerk. Not Parkinsons or anything like that, just a random movement sometimes, usually at the wrong moment! I guess old age may play a part in that....

[SlowBlues]

Sammm you still got a great touch. How critical you are on yourself is a testament to your talent. Keep posting em up. Can't wait to see some of those beads after your surgery.

As for the project - It always all adds up to at least double (money and labor) what one anticipates when not done in a production setting. I re-learn this lesson every frickin' time.

[farmersammm]

Nice welds, sammm.

Wish mine would come out that good.... (I know, practice, practice, practice.) My biggest problem lately is that I'll have a beautiful puddle and weld going for me and then suddenly my arm will jerk. Not Parkinsons or anything like that, just a random movement sometimes, usually at the wrong moment! I guess old age may play a part in that....

I get the same thing. Usually the arm holding the stinger. What I do is to always brace my left arm, and use two hands to weld. I like to hold the rod like a pool cue in my left hand. You have to take the pain as the rod gets shorter, and hotter........but it works up to the last few inches of rod, then you switch your left hand to the stinger. This works really well on short welds up to the entire rod burnoff............but stick is just a collection of short welds, so it's all good. (This is why,, if you look at some of the pics, the fingers on the left hand glove are always burned black.)

If I can't brace, I just work like Hell to concentrate on being smooth. It can get pretty tough. I admire the guys that can hold the stinger with just one hand, unbraced, and weld............or maybe envy is the word

[farmersammm]

Today was a partial waste

I spent a good bit of time figuring out the angle I want the cradle to be.

On an imaginary 11" pipe, I tried to figure out how out of plumb the stands could be, before there's a danger of the pipe rolling off the cradle.

With the angle I'm figuring (about 128*), I can be out of plumb about 20*, and the pipe will still be secure without a strap(actually more out of plumb, but I figured in a safety factor). This is with 5" ears on the cradle. I believe most commercially made stands have shorter ears.......really never measured them. But 5" is what I want, and it's gonna be what I get

Next, I spent about an hour gazing up at the sky trying to figure out how much of an offset I need to compensate for bead shrinkage when I weld 'em up I'm guessing about 9*. I could just take some stock into the LWS, or buy the stock, and have them bend it............but they're not set up for bending thicker stuff on a small radius (I think). And depending on their workload, it could take a few days before they can get to it.

The 20* out of plumb is a worst case scenario...............I can't imagine ever being that out of plumb. But here at Uranus Inc. we go all out to protect our customers toesies

[Leogl]

Well I can’t tell by your pics but I think your v head angle is to great you don’t want your pipe to far down in it will hit the bottom and will be wobbly draw different size circles to see where your pipe is gonna set in there cause if 8 in hits bottom you will never be able to use them on 2 7/8 or 4 1/2 or even 6 5/8
I just got out of hospital or I would go measure mine I have a lot of them will take some pictures

[12V71]

Well I can’t tell by your pics but I think your v head angle is to great you don’t want your pipe to far down in it will hit the bottom and will be wobbly draw different size circles to see where your pipe is gonna set in there cause if 8 in hits bottom you will never be able to use them on 2 7/8 or 4 1/2 or even 6 5/8
I just got out of hospital or I would go measure mine I have a lot of them will take some pictures

I checked my Sumner stands, they are right at 120 degrees and around 5 inches each way. I have tacked extensions on them a time or 2.Most of the time they work just fine for me with up to 14" pipe.

[_Weldman_]

I get the same thing. Usually the arm holding the stinger. What I do is to always brace my left arm, and use two hands to weld. I like to hold the rod like a pool cue in my left hand. You have to take the pain as the rod gets shorter, and hotter........but it works up to the last few inches of rod, then you switch your left hand to the stinger. This works really well on short welds up to the entire rod burnoff............but stick is just a collection of short welds, so it's all good. (This is why,, if you look at some of the pics, the fingers on the left hand glove are always burned black.)

If I can't brace, I just work like Hell to concentrate on being smooth. It can get pretty tough. I admire the guys that can hold the stinger with just one hand, unbraced, and weld............or maybe envy is the word

I’m right handed but can improvise when need be. Hanging on pole with right hand legs wrapped around another pole to hold on as I reach to backside 20 ft up in the air using left hand to weld unsupported and the cord sometimes swinging in the wind. Then comes fun part my leads are only 10’ long…

[farmersammm]

Well I can’t tell by your pics but I think your v head angle is to great you don’t want your pipe to far down in it will hit the bottom and will be wobbly draw different size circles to see where your pipe is gonna set in there cause if 8 in hits bottom you will never be able to use them on 2 7/8 or 4 1/2 or even 6 5/8
I just got out of hospital or I would go measure mine I have a lot of them will take some pictures

The cradle will hold something as small as a 1/8 welding rod without any movement. It could even hold a sewing needle without any movement.

(The cradle is shown upside down to show how it'll be welded) By welding the cradle, instead of bending it, I have no radius at the bottom of the V to contend with. It's the same setup as a V block used for machining, or checking runout.

This is why I mentioned that I wasn't sure if the LWS could bend 3/8 stock in a tight radius. You're only limited by the radius at the very bottom of the V.

I'd figured on using one of these mounted to a portable stand in the shop. I sometimes have to machine the end of a long shaft on the mill, and it's a mess to try to hold the shaft if it's 6 feet long. A nice V cradle would be perfect for all that extra overhang beyond the vise. Make another stand, and bolt one of these to it with the existing holes, and you have a really nice setup. The threaded head will allow you to set your shaft so it sits perfectly in the vise.

[farmersammm]

I checked my Sumner stands, they are right at 120 degrees and around 5 inches each way. I have tacked extensions on them a time or 2.Most of the time they work just fine for me with up to 14" pipe.

Thanks. That helps. Now I know I'm not far off the mark.

[farmersammm]

I’m right handed but can improvise when need be. Hanging on pole with right hand legs wrapped around another pole to hold on as I reach to backside 20 ft up in the air using left hand to weld unsupported and the cord sometimes swinging in the wind. Then comes fun part my leads are only 10’ long…

It's a shame you don't have an engine drive. Then you could do away with the wire welder, and its short liner and work lead. Stick is about the best thing for stuff that's in weird positions, or hard to get to.