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Thread: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

  1. #26
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Early this morning a light dawned. I have a "Jump Liner" that came with the Bernard gun when new. I can't find any mention of Jump liner, or how to install.

    I did try pushing wire through by hand with the lead reasonably straight. It pushed freely until the last foot. As expected It got difficult in the last where the liner curves.

    Not finding instructions for the jump liner (14" long) You cut both to length. Jump liner is much smaller than the long liner. In both cases, I feel the sockets that accept liner are bored bigger than they should be & allow a bit of an angle where they join the gun.

    Yes, I've got the rollers just tight enough to move wire smoothly. Tried just a quick arc on scrap, it seems to work.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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  3. #27
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    If the jump liner was missing, no wonder you were having a bad time of things.

    https://www.tregaskiss.com/product/bernard-jump-liners/

    Binzel do a similar type of thing for their aluminium feeding plastic liners - they call it a neck liner. It joins the ptfe/plastic liner and it's a short brass spiral liner section that fits down the neck and runs right to the back of the tip.

    For steel, the liners are all one piece steel spiral liners that run to the back of the tip.

    When you take the tip (or tip holder) out, you MUST see the liner poking out. If it doesn't, then it's too short.
    Murphy's Golden Rule: Whoever has the gold, makes the rules.

  4. #28
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Congrat on you find. Be like a new machine now.

  5. #29
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Quote Originally Posted by Munkul View Post
    If the jump liner was missing, no wonder you were having a bad time of things.

    https://www.tregaskiss.com/product/bernard-jump-liners/

    Binzel do a similar type of thing for their aluminium feeding plastic liners - they call it a neck liner. It joins the ptfe/plastic liner and it's a short brass spiral liner section that fits down the neck and runs right to the back of the tip.

    For steel, the liners are all one piece steel spiral liners that run to the back of the tip.

    When you take the tip (or tip holder) out, you MUST see the liner poking out. If it doesn't, then it's too short.
    Not missing. It seems the full length liner wears, or is a problem with birdnesting, you cut off the long liner at the beginning of the gun, install this "jump liner".

    I hope it helps. It is a great deal smaller diameter than the liner in the gun which looks fine.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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  7. #30
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    I had pressing matters to attend to, didn't weld at all today except a quick trial bead. It seemed a success.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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  9. #31
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie B View Post
    Not missing. It seems the full length liner wears, or is a problem with birdnesting, you cut off the long liner at the beginning of the gun, install this "jump liner".

    I hope it helps. It is a great deal smaller diameter than the liner in the gun which looks fine.
    Ah I see, it's more a repair section then?

    Usually liners aren't massively oversized for the wire... are you sure the main liner is the right one for your wire size?
    Murphy's Golden Rule: Whoever has the gold, makes the rules.

  10. #32
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Quote Originally Posted by Munkul View Post
    Ah I see, it's more a repair section then?

    Usually liners aren't massively oversized for the wire... are you sure the main liner is the right one for your wire size?
    It's labeled .035 & .045. I don't have tips for .035 for this gun. I'd say about .060" ID. I have no local source for parts. Each part has numbers on it, so I could order replacement parts, but the whole assembly seems to not have any model #.

    Went on Bernard/Tregaskus website. They are not clear which model I have. If I wade through a mountain of old records, I might find invoice when I bought it around 2016.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  11. #33
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Quote Originally Posted by tapwelder View Post
    Congrat on you find. Be like a new machine now.
    Gee I hope. I haven't really given it a thorough test yet, but the one test weld i made time for went well.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  12. #34
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie B View Post
    It's labeled .035 & .045. I don't have tips for .035 for this gun. I'd say about .060" ID. I have no local source for parts. Each part has numbers on it, so I could order replacement parts, but the whole assembly seems to not have any model #.

    Went on Bernard/Tregaskus website. They are not clear which model I have. If I wade through a mountain of old records, I might find invoice when I bought it around 2016.
    Sorry to doubt you then, sounds right enough
    Murphy's Golden Rule: Whoever has the gold, makes the rules.

  13. #35
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    After installing the "jump liner", cutting the original liner to make it fit, I welded 1.5 hours, Perhaps actual arc time, .9 hours. I had a few stutters, thought I might have run out of wire, or another birdnest. Eventually, I ran out of wire.

    I loaded up, went off to Maine Oxy. I got to know a handsome young man I've met before, but learned he has the ability & willingness to think. I presented my gun, & my problems. He exhausted resources trying to identify my Bernard gun. That effort ended in failure. He feels there are no model numbers for Bernard guns as no two are alike.
    Bernard parts are each numbered, so exact replacements are available for order, but longer, or wider nozzles are a problem to identify.

    He did tell me my empty roll of Dual shield (Lincoln) is suitable only for 85/15 Argon/CO2.

    Could that explain some of the porosity or worm tracks I have experienced?

    Nonetheless, I came home with a new roll, set it up, it ran flawlessly!
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  14. #36
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Good to hear it's up and running. Yes, gas mixtures can make a big difference in porosity and worm tracking.

  15. #37
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Quote Originally Posted by farmersammm View Post
    If you ever ran that machine without a diffuser, bare tip............ And you happened to arc the tip against the metal, the current has nowhere to go but back into the machine. It can mess up components, but most common is burning out a diode. I imagine it might mess up a board too. Dunno The contactor circuit might be messed up, Hell, I just don't know.
    The whole assembly is charged. The gun adapter is powered, the liner, wire, everything get power at once. In the lead is a substantial woven cable the liner passes through the center. Large copper cable being a lower resistance than liner, or wire, little current flows on the wire.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  16. #38
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    I do not know if the problem is fixed. I welded up a trailer hitch assembly for a Top Kick. If a factory built assembly is available, I don't know of it.
    I'm sure I over welded, that's fine with me, under welding is my concern. I used up maybe 10 lbs of wire without a birdsnest.
    After using up my reel of wire & buying more, learning that old wire was only for use with 85/15 gas, buying different wire, it behaved better. I won't say it influenced birdnest, but the wire spraying at the joint was much cleaner.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  17. #39
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    A bit off topic. But was mentioned in a thread somewhere regarding worm tracks

    My esab 7100 ultra sheilds say it can be reconditioned at 300 degrees on metal spools for 6hrs or 125 on plastic spools for 48hrs

  18. #40
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Quote Originally Posted by tapwelder View Post
    A bit off topic. But was mentioned in a thread somewhere regarding worm tracks

    My esab 7100 ultra sheilds say it can be reconditioned at 300 degrees on metal spools for 6hrs or 125 on plastic spools for 48hrs
    Good to know. I had believed it was like 7018 stick electrode where north of 600 degrees F was needed. Neither wood or plastic reels will tolerate that.

    In earlier threads I talked of frustration with Dual Shield & worm tracks & porosity. I now wonder if wrong gas caused this?

    I studied labeling of old reel & new box & reel. There is no indication of gas specified. I had been believing various gasses would work, there had to be some component of reactive gas, usually CO2 for MIG to work.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  19. #41
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie B View Post
    I had pressing matters to attend to, didn't weld at all today except a quick trial bead. It seemed a success.
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    Glen

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  21. #42
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Quote Originally Posted by ArcTan View Post
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    Seth (#1 son) decided he wanted his own press. Similar to yours, but antique wood frame.

    In my youth we used a commercial press, likely built around 1900. It was hydraulic press, belt driven grinder. I think they once used a hit or miss engine, but in my time it was a John Deere A. About 40 feet of flat belt in figure 8 configuration. The family is rumored to have supplied brandy to Equinox Hotel in Manchester. Their hard cider was legendary. By my youth the equipment wasn't used, (until me). There were cradles for 30 barrels in the cellar.

    Their press was 1/2x1"x18? oak strips two layers spaced 1/4" apart. made a lattice 18" square. I recall 30 of these. On each, you placed a 40" square of burlap, pulled the slide to plop about a gallon of mashed apples. Fold the burlap over the top & lay another rack. A stack of maybe 15 was slid into the press. The press was rated 10 tons.
    Build a stack while another squeezed. First year four teenagers involved, we picked apples a week or more. Pressed them all one day. If I recall 210 gallons of juice.

    Yours is an ambitious project if you press that whole tote full of apples. Ought to make 70 gallons.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  22. #43
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    That was last year's setup. Haven't taken pics this year.

    I've noticed about a 5:1 ratio of apples to juice, obviously dependent on variety and ripeness of the fruit.
    Glen

    Hobart Champion 16
    Miller XMT 304 CC/CV toasted
    Hobart Hefty CC/CV
    Hobart Handler 140
    Lotos LTP5000D

  23. #44
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Quote Originally Posted by ArcTan View Post
    That was last year's setup. Haven't taken pics this year.

    I've noticed about a 5:1 ratio of apples to juice, obviously dependent on variety and ripeness of the fruit.
    Hugh Bromley, Same family as Bromley Mountain & the former name of Peru, figured rule of thumb, 3 gallons per bushel. The press was pretty effective. After squeezing there wasn't much juice left.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

  24. #45
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    I've been fabricating some this weekend. ALL overhead & vertical, except crawling between the truck frame & raised dump body to do a few flat welds. Clothes don't look very good after the weekend. A few small holes in me.

    Not a single birdnest!
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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  26. #46
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Congrats... oh holey one.... seems like a Sunday sort of thing to say...
    The harder you fall, the higher you bounce...

    250 amp Miller DialArc AC/DC Stick
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  27. #47
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Quote Originally Posted by whtbaron View Post
    Congrats... oh holey one.... seems like a Sunday sort of thing to say...
    Says the guy who tore down the church.

    Yeah, I'd been sweating it some. Welder wouldn't work. I got ditches to dig. Snow isn't far into the future. When Arc Tan brought up the subject of truck hitches, I started noticing cracks in the old hitch.

    Old hitch was mounted to the dump body. I didn't like that as it would raise the body if too much tongue weight. I had a pin at front of dump body to hold it down, but it wasn't ideal. New hitch is 8" rear of rear spring mount, 24" forward of old one. I hope it'll behave better on the road.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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  29. #48
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    At least my ditching won't be very deep... I need to bury a cable from the shop to the house ( about 350 ft. of cable, 180 ft of trenching) for the new internet setup, but I need to get it done before freeze up. Halloween is coming...
    The harder you fall, the higher you bounce...

    250 amp Miller DialArc AC/DC Stick
    F-225 amp Forney AC Stick
    230 amp Sears AC Stick
    Lincoln 180C MIG
    Victor Medalist 350 O/A
    Cut 50 Plasma
    Les

  30. #49
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    I'll try my hitch, Might be able to get to Manitoba before Halloween if I drive straight through.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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  32. #50
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    Re: I HATE my MillerMatic 252

    Got her done... that road was tough stuff...
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    Stones were even tougher. Lucky for me, I didn't hit any big ones...
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    The harder you fall, the higher you bounce...

    250 amp Miller DialArc AC/DC Stick
    F-225 amp Forney AC Stick
    230 amp Sears AC Stick
    Lincoln 180C MIG
    Victor Medalist 350 O/A
    Cut 50 Plasma
    Les

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