Results 1 to 18 of 18

Thread: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    998
    Post Thanks / Like

    Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Dummy (me) didn't take good enough notes when trying to swap out a failed on/off switch. Now I don't know what goes where and am hoping someone might be able to help.

    Buffer:
    Name:  20211121-125905-01.jpg
Views: 210
Size:  134.2 KB

    Name:  20211121-130004-01.jpg
Views: 207
Size:  122.8 KB

    Name:  20211121-130032-01.jpg
Views: 209
Size:  113.2 KB

    Will this switch work (not using the crap direct replacement)
    Name:  51-Xr-Z-1p-Ea-S-SL1001.jpg
Views: 210
Size:  89.5 KB
    Name:  613-Bcn-K3-Sb-L-SL1500.jpg
Views: 211
Size:  68.3 KB

    Grassyass in advance for any and all help.
    Yeswelder MIG-205DS
    (3) Angle Grinders at the Ready
    Just a hobbyist trying to improve

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    998
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Motor Plate:
    Name:  20211121-130220-01.jpg
Views: 202
Size:  128.1 KB

    Old Switch:
    Name:  20211119-102747.jpg
Views: 204
Size:  98.6 KB

    Name:  20211119-102758.jpg
Views: 206
Size:  83.1 KB

    Name:  20211119-102804.jpg
Views: 201
Size:  93.8 KB
    Last edited by Shootr; 11-21-2021 at 04:30 PM.
    Yeswelder MIG-205DS
    (3) Angle Grinders at the Ready
    Just a hobbyist trying to improve

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    1,316
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Looks like your pictures show where they all came from on the old switch.

    What you need to know is how all those 6 switch terminals are switched ?

    Have you tried looking for schematic on the switch or is it just a 3 pole single throw ?

    If we had switch schematic then we could place them on your new switch(s) properly.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    ct.
    Posts
    1,428
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Have you checked the pin function of old and new
    switches with a multimeter? In the pic., it looks like
    new switch is double pole double throw. Looks like
    terminals at the bottom ( in pic.#5) might be the commons.
    No idea what’s going on with old switch.
    Miller a/c-d/c Thunderbolt XL
    Millermatic 180
    Purox O/A
    Smith Littletorch O/A
    Hobart Champion Elite

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    1,316
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    The new ones are double pole double throw.

    Commons are in center and switched to the top and bottom terminals.

    If you just knew how old switch was switching be easy to setup wires on new switches.
    Last edited by danielplace; 11-23-2021 at 09:40 AM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    Clovis California
    Posts
    4,106
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Is this 2 speed or high low switch?
    It looks like it is 120v ac motor?
    Can post a photo of the old switch front and back?

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by Shootr View Post
    Dummy (me) didn't take good enough notes when trying to swap out a failed on/off switch. Now I don't know what goes where and am hoping someone might be able to help.

    Buffer:
    Name:  20211121-125905-01.jpg
Views: 210
Size:  134.2 KB

    Name:  20211121-130004-01.jpg
Views: 207
Size:  122.8 KB

    Name:  20211121-130032-01.jpg
Views: 209
Size:  113.2 KB

    Will this switch work (not using the crap direct replacement)
    Name:  51-Xr-Z-1p-Ea-S-SL1001.jpg
Views: 210
Size:  89.5 KB
    Name:  613-Bcn-K3-Sb-L-SL1500.jpg
Views: 211
Size:  68.3 KB

    Grassyass in advance for any and all help.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Birmingham, AL
    Posts
    344
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    I'm guessing this is the original switch?

    https://www.amazon.com/outstanding-2...46829950&psc=1

    Name:  sw1.jpg
Views: 130
Size:  79.8 KB

    Name:  sw2.JPG
Views: 127
Size:  41.8 KB

    Hopefully this will help others help answer your question.

    I think you said you did not want to use the cheap replacement......but for $5.59, I would! Maybe buy two or three to have a backup! Just my 2!

    Joe

  8. Likes Shootr liked this post
  9. #8
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    998
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Quote Originally Posted by AlabamaJoe View Post
    I'm guessing this is the original switch?

    Hopefully this will help others help answer your question.

    I think you said you did not want to use the cheap replacement......but for $5.59, I would! Maybe buy two or three to have a backup! Just my 2!

    Joe
    That was the third switch in 2 years and I was frustrated at the fragility of them.

    My issue is when I disassembled it, I did not take good enough notes/pictures and now do not know which wires connected to which.

    There are two separate red and 2 yellow wires coming out of the motor - then another red, and a green, coming out of the capacitor. I tried various combinations and could get a buzz, a reaaaaally slow start up with no torque, or nothing - never full speed at the correct rotation.

    I'm waiting for the manufacturer to get back to me with a diagram but figured I would see if anyone can advise how to connect which wires to each other and to the switch.
    Yeswelder MIG-205DS
    (3) Angle Grinders at the Ready
    Just a hobbyist trying to improve

  10. Likes AlabamaJoe liked this post
  11. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    1,916
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    This any help?

    ---Meltedmetal

  12. Likes Shootr liked this post
  13. #10
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    998
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Very much, thank you!

    I know I wired it OK but now nothing. I am thinking the capacitor is dead. I get "OL" when checking it.

    Any thoughts that if it is - then the motor should do nothing, no buzz, nada?
    Yeswelder MIG-205DS
    (3) Angle Grinders at the Ready
    Just a hobbyist trying to improve

  14. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    1,916
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Certainly looks like your capacitor is dead(open). The diagram would indicate that you should have a connection though the main coil U1/U2. The aux. coil Z1/Z2 would be cut out of the circuit by the open capacitor. I would think it might hum and possibly run if started by hand. Verify that you still have continuity though the coils.
    ---Meltedmetal

  15. Likes Shootr liked this post
  16. #12
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    998
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Quote Originally Posted by Meltedmetal View Post
    Certainly looks like your capacitor is dead(open). The diagram would indicate that you should have a connection though the main coil U1/U2. The aux. coil Z1/Z2 would be cut out of the circuit by the open capacitor. I would think it might hum and possibly run if started by hand. Verify that you still have continuity though the coils.
    I get 3.4 on one set, and 4.1 on the other. Between your video, a couple others, and a decent schematic - I'm 99% sure I'm wiring it correctly (direct - no switch involved for now).

    That's what bothers me - no hum or anything. The new cap is a whole $12 so it's worth to at least try that.
    Yeswelder MIG-205DS
    (3) Angle Grinders at the Ready
    Just a hobbyist trying to improve

  17. #13
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    998
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Finally - victory is mine. None of the diagrams or videos were accurate to my situation. Sat down with a bunch of jumpers and a note pad and started the process of elimination. I think it was the second one that worked - but backwards. Reversing the hot and common didn't work, 3 more tries and finally all was right with the world.

    I used the excuse to justify buying another one so I could get the ashtray done. Now it is destined to become a little 2" x 48" belt grinder.
    Yeswelder MIG-205DS
    (3) Angle Grinders at the Ready
    Just a hobbyist trying to improve

  18. Likes Meltedmetal liked this post
  19. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Soda springs,Id
    Posts
    5,513
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    My only question is what did the two stripped wires go to?
    Ol' Stonebreaker
    "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"
    Hobart G-213 portable
    Miller 175 mig
    Miller thunderbolt ac/dc stick
    Victor O/A setup
    Makita chop saw

  20. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Milwaukee, WI
    Posts
    441
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    The capacitor in the starting circuit is usually connected in series with a centrifugal switch. Sometimes the centrifugal switch contacts get pitted and cause problems and sometimes the switch can be broken or dislodged.
    If you ever take the bells off the motor and have to inspect the centrifugal switch, you'll see where the capacitor wires should go.
    Example:
    http://michael-parrish.com/2016/08/2...ration-part-4/

  21. #16
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    998
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Layman's (me) wiring diagram:

    Name:  20211125_081434-01.jpg
Views: 76
Size:  181.5 KB

    2 pairs out of the buffer - each was: one yellow and one red. Yellows were labeled (by me) A1 and B1, reds were A2 and B2.

    One leg of incoming power went A2 and B1.
    Second leg went to the cap and B2.
    Final connection was A1 to the cap.

    Wasn't electrocuted, no smoke or heat, purrs like a kitten.

    I'm using an external ON/Off switch - I don't need the drama of trying to figure that out...

    Thank you all again for jumping in and helping - you are the best!
    Yeswelder MIG-205DS
    (3) Angle Grinders at the Ready
    Just a hobbyist trying to improve

  22. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    1,916
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    I'm glad you got it functional again.

    Just an observation. If you change the labels on the 2nd diagram in the video you will get exactly what you have. A1=Z1, A2=Z2,B1=U2,B2=U1. Great that it is back to work!
    ---Meltedmetal

  23. Likes Shootr liked this post
  24. #18
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    998
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Help Dummy Wire a Bench Buffer

    Quote Originally Posted by Meltedmetal View Post
    I'm glad you got it functional again.

    Just an observation. If you change the labels on the 2nd diagram in the video you will get exactly what you have. A1=Z1, A2=Z2,B1=U2,B2=U1. Great that it is back to work!
    Electrical is as foreign a language to me as chinese. Amazed I'm still here after all the projects I've managed to complete!
    Yeswelder MIG-205DS
    (3) Angle Grinders at the Ready
    Just a hobbyist trying to improve

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Page generated in 1,642,852,795.21928 seconds with 15 queries