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Thread: Yet Another Weld Cert Question

  1. #1
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    Yet Another Weld Cert Question

    I work for a small company that specializes in aerospace/robotics and I currently handle all of our welding. I'm not a welder per se, but took a few basic welding classes in college and have welded a fair amount on aluminum, mild steel, and stainless. I only TIG weld, never MIG or stick. We don't have enough welding tasks right now to employ a full-time professional welder(I'm typically only welding maybe one or two days a week). We also don't weld on any pressure vessels or flying parts. We usually outsource most of our bigger weld jobs.

    My boss has requested that I get a weld certification that would cover most of the tasks we do for now. Again, this isn't due to any customer requirements (yet), it's mostly just to say we have a certified welder on staff that we are using. I just started researching certs and am a little overwhelmed with all of the options. I think just a basic D1.1 and D1.2 would be good enough? A D17.1 would probably be best but I think it would be overkill for what we do.

    One of the jobs we do is a 3/16" thick rectangular tube A36 frame with a 1" thick A572 plate on top. Vertical, overhead, variety of joint types. I also weld a good amount of 5052 and 6061 parts from 0.060-0.500".

    I'm not too far from the Hobart school in Troy, so I'll probably start there but wanted to get some opinions first...


    Thanks!

  2. #2
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    Re: Yet Another Weld Cert Question

    Doesnt sound like they are busting your balls about being cheapand they understand other business cost so why not take a stroll thru Hobart. Doesnt sound like this is under pressure, good thing for insurance to be able to say certified and gives them a warm feeling.

  3. #3
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    Re: Yet Another Weld Cert Question

    All the tig is slow but saves a lot of mess.

  4. #4
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    Re: Yet Another Weld Cert Question

    I purchased tons of A572 coil grade 50.
    It ease to weld with flux core.

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by LimitedSlip7 View Post
    I work for a small company that specializes in aerospace/robotics and I currently handle all of our welding. I'm not a welder per se, but took a few basic welding classes in college and have welded a fair amount on aluminum, mild steel, and stainless. I only TIG weld, never MIG or stick. We don't have enough welding tasks right now to employ a full-time professional welder(I'm typically only welding maybe one or two days a week). We also don't weld on any pressure vessels or flying parts. We usually outsource most of our bigger weld jobs.

    My boss has requested that I get a weld certification that would cover most of the tasks we do for now. Again, this isn't due to any customer requirements (yet), it's mostly just to say we have a certified welder on staff that we are using. I just started researching certs and am a little overwhelmed with all of the options. I think just a basic D1.1 and D1.2 would be good enough? A D17.1 would probably be best but I think it would be overkill for what we do.

    One of the jobs we do is a 3/16" thick rectangular tube A36 frame with a 1" thick A572 plate on top. Vertical, overhead, variety of joint types. I also weld a good amount of 5052 and 6061 parts from 0.060-0.500".

    I'm not too far from the Hobart school in Troy, so I'll probably start there but wanted to get some opinions first...


    Thanks!

  5. #5
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    Re: Yet Another Weld Cert Question

    Well here is the deal. In order to weld qualification plates you just can't wing it. You need to obtain the qualified WPS for your base and filler rod combination for GTAW. You can buy one from AWS for 5052 alum sheet using 4043 filler(the only one offered for alum at all). And a myriad of steel combinations for structural steel and filler rod combinations. All tig. You weld your coupons withing the essential variables within the qualified WPS. Go to the AWS bookstore and read the offerings.

    I would have your boss buy you a student membership with AWS. Then buy the D17.1, D1.1, and D1.2 specifications, then the appropriate SWPS. Forget about precipitation hardening alums as you there are no WPS available and you would have to make one yourself, and would cost thousands.

    From the code books, choose your plate thicknesses, filler, joint configuration, and weld them per the guidelines in the code book. I always choose groove plate as it also qualifies fillet, and can be tested with a simple bend test or xray. So prep the plates, weld, and either do your visual and xray, or visual and bend test yourself per the diagrams in the code books. If they pass without breaking or out of spec defects you write the WPR(welder performance report), assign yourself a number, date, and have the report signed by your boss(he is the certifying entity) and put in your the file with the supporting WPS(SWPS if bought by AWS).

    All of this is owned by your boss and is not transferable from company to company. The WPSs are proprietary and can be reviewed by a customer but not photographed or copied in any way. I make a lot of my own PQRs, and WPSs, and I own them on behalf of my customer for me to weld their parts. Your WPR and supporting test documents however can be forwarded to your customers at will as they establish qualification and they may need them on file. If your customer brings in a certified weld inspector to inspect your welds, the first thing asked for is the WPS.

    The length of time your certs are valid are infinite provided you weld that process within a 6 month period and can provide proof on continuity. A pay stub is enough in my company.

    And stay with tig. You will prevail.
    Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR"
    MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX4ea,Dynasty200DX,Li ncolnSW200-2ea.,MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig2ea,MigMax1ea.

  6. #6
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    Re: Yet Another Weld Cert Question

    Here a link by the government on welding
    A572 steel
    https://www.thruway.ny.gov/business/.../appendixf.pdf

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by LimitedSlip7 View Post
    I work for a small company that specializes in aerospace/robotics and I currently handle all of our welding. I'm not a welder per se, but took a few basic welding classes in college and have welded a fair amount on aluminum, mild steel, and stainless. I only TIG weld, never MIG or stick. We don't have enough welding tasks right now to employ a full-time professional welder(I'm typically only welding maybe one or two days a week). We also don't weld on any pressure vessels or flying parts. We usually outsource most of our bigger weld jobs.

    My boss has requested that I get a weld certification that would cover most of the tasks we do for now. Again, this isn't due to any customer requirements (yet), it's mostly just to say we have a certified welder on staff that we are using. I just started researching certs and am a little overwhelmed with all of the options. I think just a basic D1.1 and D1.2 would be good enough? A D17.1 would probably be best but I think it would be overkill for what we do.

    One of the jobs we do is a 3/16" thick rectangular tube A36 frame with a 1" thick A572 plate on top. Vertical, overhead, variety of joint types. I also weld a good amount of 5052 and 6061 parts from 0.060-0.500".

    I'm not too far from the Hobart school in Troy, so I'll probably start there but wanted to get some opinions first...


    Thanks!

  7. #7
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    Re: Yet Another Weld Cert Question

    The wire and rod I used was E71-T1 and E7018.
    In the PDF it shows 4 types I only 2 types.
    This was to reduced my inventory.

    You find after the North Ridge earthquake that made more laws for welders to follow. The state discovered shops where not following the AWS and other standards.

    The good news for my shop as I did follow all the AWS rules and used the correct wire and rod.

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by LimitedSlip7 View Post
    I work for a small company that specializes in aerospace/robotics and I currently handle all of our welding. I'm not a welder per se, but took a few basic welding classes in college and have welded a fair amount on aluminum, mild steel, and stainless. I only TIG weld, never MIG or stick. We don't have enough welding tasks right now to employ a full-time professional welder(I'm typically only welding maybe one or two days a week). We also don't weld on any pressure vessels or flying parts. We usually outsource most of our bigger weld jobs.

    My boss has requested that I get a weld certification that would cover most of the tasks we do for now. Again, this isn't due to any customer requirements (yet), it's mostly just to say we have a certified welder on staff that we are using. I just started researching certs and am a little overwhelmed with all of the options. I think just a basic D1.1 and D1.2 would be good enough? A D17.1 would probably be best but I think it would be overkill for what we do.

    One of the jobs we do is a 3/16" thick rectangular tube A36 frame with a 1" thick A572 plate on top. Vertical, overhead, variety of joint types. I also weld a good amount of 5052 and 6061 parts from 0.060-0.500".

    I'm not too far from the Hobart school in Troy, so I'll probably start there but wanted to get some opinions first...


    Thanks!

  8. #8
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    Re: Yet Another Weld Cert Question

    Quote Originally Posted by smithdoor View Post
    The wire and rod I used was E71-T1 and E7018.
    In the PDF it shows 4 types I only 2 types.
    This was to reduced my inventory.

    You find after the North Ridge earthquake that made more laws for welders to follow. The state discovered shops where not following the AWS and other standards.

    The good news for my shop as I did follow all the AWS rules and used the correct wire and rod.

    Dave
    I'm not looking to change my process or materials on this, was just giving an example of some of the welding that we are doing. Aesthetics are a close 2nd to structural integrity on this stuff so I'd prefer to stick with TIG (only type of welding I'm experienced enough with to get consistently good results).

  9. #9
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    Re: Yet Another Weld Cert Question

    Quote Originally Posted by shovelon View Post
    Well here is the deal. In order to weld qualification plates you just can't wing it. You need to obtain the qualified WPS for your base and filler rod combination for GTAW. You can buy one from AWS for 5052 alum sheet using 4043 filler(the only one offered for alum at all). And a myriad of steel combinations for structural steel and filler rod combinations. All tig. You weld your coupons withing the essential variables within the qualified WPS. Go to the AWS bookstore and read the offerings.

    I would have your boss buy you a student membership with AWS. Then buy the D17.1, D1.1, and D1.2 specifications, then the appropriate SWPS. Forget about precipitation hardening alums as you there are no WPS available and you would have to make one yourself, and would cost thousands.

    From the code books, choose your plate thicknesses, filler, joint configuration, and weld them per the guidelines in the code book. I always choose groove plate as it also qualifies fillet, and can be tested with a simple bend test or xray. So prep the plates, weld, and either do your visual and xray, or visual and bend test yourself per the diagrams in the code books. If they pass without breaking or out of spec defects you write the WPR(welder performance report), assign yourself a number, date, and have the report signed by your boss(he is the certifying entity) and put in your the file with the supporting WPS(SWPS if bought by AWS).

    All of this is owned by your boss and is not transferable from company to company. The WPSs are proprietary and can be reviewed by a customer but not photographed or copied in any way. I make a lot of my own PQRs, and WPSs, and I own them on behalf of my customer for me to weld their parts. Your WPR and supporting test documents however can be forwarded to your customers at will as they establish qualification and they may need them on file. If your customer brings in a certified weld inspector to inspect your welds, the first thing asked for is the WPS.

    The length of time your certs are valid are infinite provided you weld that process within a 6 month period and can provide proof on continuity. A pay stub is enough in my company.

    And stay with tig. You will prevail.
    I'm assuming if I go through Hobart they will provide the appropriate coupons and tests? I would prefer to just study the specifications on my own time then go up there and take the written and weld tests.

    When keeping the certification current, can that be as simple as welding a coupon to the original testing specifications every six months?

  10. #10
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    Re: Yet Another Weld Cert Question

    Quote Originally Posted by LimitedSlip7 View Post
    I'm assuming if I go through Hobart they will provide the appropriate coupons and tests? I would prefer to just study the specifications on my own time then go up there and take the written and weld tests.

    When keeping the certification current, can that be as simple as welding a coupon to the original testing specifications every six months?
    Yes if you go through Hobart, they should have everything in order. However you will still need to procure the appropriate documents like the WPS to follow anyway. There is a method to this madness. And you will be all the better for it, especially if your boss ponies up the dough. Become a student member of AWS firstly whatever course you follow.

    As far as continuity every 6 months, just fire up the machine and weld that process(tig in my case). Then have someone initial a dated photo of the part, and keep on file somewhere. My weldors are hired in as weldors, and a continuous paycheck is good for me.
    Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR"
    MillerDynasty700DX,Dynasty350DX4ea,Dynasty200DX,Li ncolnSW200-2ea.,MillerMatic350P,MillerMatic200w/spoolgun,MKCobraMig260,Lincoln SP-170T,PlasmaCam/Hypertherm1250,HFProTig2ea,MigMax1ea.

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