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Thread: 250-300 amp tig

  1. #1
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    250-300 amp tig

    Hello

    What is the best choice for a tig welder for occasionally 1/4 to 3/8 aluminum
    1/8 go 3/16 most of the time. (Hobbyist)
    I want to upgrade thermal arc 186.

    Thanks

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Miller Dynasty 280
    Invertig 313
    Not sure what Lincoln offers
    Everlast, some love em, some hate em
    Richard
    West coast of Florida

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Regardless of the machine you get, you can always add helium to the mix to help with thicker aluminum.

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    I love my Miller Dynasty 280DX. Its 8 years old now. It hasn't the power my Old Dialarc 250 (310 Amps AC). I supplement with some helium when 280 isn't enough.

    There are a good many choices now. I still would be careful about Chinese machines.
    Last edited by Willie B; 01-03-2022 at 07:40 PM.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Find a nice used Syncrowave 250.
    Miller Multimatic 255

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Syncrowave is a transformer machine require a 90amps breaker?
    Difference between 280dx and invertig 313
    It is possible with a smallest 220-230 amps machine and helium? Invertig 221,fronius and lincoln aspect 230.

    Thanks for your help

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralphm View Post
    It is possible with a smallest 220-230 amps machine and helium? Invertig 221,fronius and lincoln aspect 230.

    Thanks for your help
    3/8" aluminum it's possible depending on the mass of the part
    Richard
    West coast of Florida

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    I'd say a Dynasty 280 would be a good choice... Or a Lorch/Tweco 300... Or a Fronius Magicwave 2700

    None of these machines are cheap... they're 300 amp class industrial machines designed to weld all day long and all night long.

    You could buy an Everlast, of course. It will... probably.. work.
    Murphy's Golden Rule: Whoever has the gold, makes the rules.

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by Munkul View Post
    I'd say a Dynasty 280 would be a good choice... Or a Lorch/Tweco 300... Or a Fronius Magicwave 2700

    None of these machines are cheap... they're 300 amp class industrial machines designed to weld all day long and all night long.

    You could buy an Everlast, of course. It will... probably.. work.
    I'd avoid starting with a plan to use helium. It is EXPENSIVE, & hard to get. Industry needs it & supplies are sporadic. Start with at least a 250 amp AC machine, 60% duty cycle. Later if you find you want to repair an engine block or other BIG item, you might spring for a bottle of helium.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralphm View Post
    Syncrowave is a transformer machine require a 90amps breaker?
    Difference between 280dx and invertig 313
    It is possible with a smallest 220-230 amps machine and helium? Invertig 221,fronius and lincoln aspect 230.

    Thanks for your help
    Miller Dynasty 280-approx $12,000 (fully equipped with a cooler, cart, etc)
    Lincoln Aspect 375 -approx $11,800
    Esab ET301i -approx $9,000
    Fronius Magicwave 230i-approximately $7,200
    HTP Invertip 313 -Approximately $7,500

    Used syncrowave 250 -Approximately $2K

    If money is no object, then go with whatever you like. If you are on a budget, go get a nice used Syncrowave or even a Lincoln PrecisionTIG 275. Yes you will need to upgrade the breaker and wiring for this one outlet (I ran my syncrowave on 6 gauge wire with a 110 amp breaker for years with no problem. My house only has 200 amp service). Whatever you choose you are likely going to need to upgrade your electrical service. Several of the welders listed above only reach their full duty cycle on 3 phase power. The miller Dynasty requires 10 gauge conductors and an 80 amp fuse for use on 240 volt single phase power. The step up from that to 6 gauge and a 110 amp fuse for a syncrowave is not that much money.

    PS: All prices assume purchase in the US. I just noticed you are in Canada which is going to make all of these welders more expensive
    Last edited by Louie1961; 01-04-2022 at 07:54 AM.
    Miller Multimatic 255

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralphm View Post
    Syncrowave is a transformer machine require a 90amps breaker?
    As Louie mentioned, if money is no object there are a lot of good choices out there. I've had something like 17 different Syncrowave 250 and 250DX welders over the past few years. I started out buying one for myself, then bought a slightly newer/nicer one and sold the first for a profit. Then I did that again and next thing you know I've had a bunch of them and the one I'm keeping is like new.

    I have run those machines on a 230V 60A breaker setup and never had an issue. I don't normally weld over about 275A, so maybe if I was running the machine at the max of 310A it would trip the breaker....I keep meaning to max it out and run for a while to see what would happen. So, depending upon your work, it may not be a factor.
    Last edited by G-ManBart; 01-04-2022 at 11:09 AM.
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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Thanks for th priceless advices. I am very happy to receive many options. Used syncrowave and precision tig are very difficult to find here but it's really a good option. Do you miss the options of the inverter welder?

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    I inquired about TIG a number of times. Before I discovered this forum & one or two others, information was scarce & not always accurate. I got to know a manager at Airgas. He was in Rutland, they transferred him to Bennington. At the time, I knew virtually nothing about TIG, but knew of it because numerous people in my very small town worked at General Electric in Rutland. GE is a defense contractor, there is a lot of secrecy. TIG was a process not classified, but the only people who understood it were very closed mouth. Their jobs depended upon it. I believe GE management were more tolerant of in house repairs of engine blocks & pistons, even a Mercedes distributor, than they would of sharing a process. I confess I benefitted from GE factory technology a time or two.

    Truth is, for me, it made me more interested to do it.

    As years passed, the how to became less secret. The internet offered part of the information.

    I asked Paul. He pitched Miller Diversion 180. He led me to believe it'd do what I wanted. It took a week, I had outgrown it. I wanted more! Diversion had LOW duty cycle. For aluminum, it was severely limited.

    I asked a million questions of everybody I could find to talk about the subject. Haun Welding Supply just over the border in NH had used machines. I was discussing them one day. A customer, a full time welder overheard the conversation, he said Syncrowave 250! If you can power it, Syncrowave 300.

    At the time, a new Syncrowave 250 was $5500. without water cooler. Haun had a used one for $3500. I couldn't pull the trigger right then.

    Local free paper had an ad for a Dialarc 250HF with cooler $1800. I visited the owner. He had welded 1" thick stainless many years as his job. He retired early when the company closed, he bought the welder he had used. I bought it from him for $1600. Miller Dialarc 250HF is a great welder, none better for steel & stainless, less wonderful with aluminum. I point out the weldors first using these used pure helium & that made all the difference.

    Very soon thereafter Miller introduced a new model, the Dynasty 280DX. It took some convincing that a mailbox welder weighing 52 LBS could match a 600 LB Syncrowave.

    Manufacturers ALL offer a good steel TIG machine. Great aluminum TIG machines are more complicated, and expensive.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralphm View Post
    Thanks for th priceless advices. I am very happy to receive many options. Used syncrowave and precision tig are very difficult to find here but it's really a good option. Do you miss the options of the inverter welder?

    On 1/4 to 3/8ths inch aluminum, no, you won't miss any of the features of an inverter. At these thicknesses the only thing that matters is horse power...amps pure and simple. If you are doing a lot of thin aluminum (like sheet metal thicknesses) then maybe you would miss the adjustable frequency and pulse. But not on the thick stuff. Zap, who is an admin here, used to use an ancient refrigerator sized, 900 lb, sine wave welder with no features at all (330 AB/P). It didn't even have adjustable balance. He did absolute works of art with it...aluminum intake manifolds for his race car, and the like. He taught a lot of folks here how to TIG weld (me included, fortunately) and he believes that you don't need any of those features to do good work. He has the portfolio of work to back up his position. If you want all the inverter features you either need to skip the heavier material or pony up for something like the Dynasty 280
    Miller Multimatic 255

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  21. #15
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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie B View Post
    I'd avoid starting with a plan to use helium. It is EXPENSIVE, & hard to get. Industry needs it & supplies are sporadic. Start with at least a 250 amp AC machine, 60% duty cycle. Later if you find you want to repair an engine block or other BIG item, you might spring for a bottle of helium.
    I wasn't suggesting Helium Willie, those machines I mentioned all have between 280-300 amps available
    It's actually quite easy to get hold of over here, but it's EXPENSIVE. Cheaper just to buy a bigger machine.

    I agree completely with what you're saying. Over 200 amps AC you don't need adjustable frequency or pulse or fancy waveforms. In an ideal world you'd have square wave with adjustable balance, as you do get a lot more punch and the tungsten looks after itself a lot better.
    If on a budget, then a good conditon Syncrowave, Precision TIG, or a Linde/Murex/Esab, or maybe even a Migatronic MTE if you can get them over there.

    I had a Migatronic MTE 440 for a short while, that thing was a BEAST, 440 amps of square wave adjustable balance. Lovely soft but forgiving arc on it. Really heavy on electricity, it needed 63 amps 415v 3 phase input to use the full range. Sold it to a guy who already had one and needed a working spare, for business continuation in case his first one went down (they're obsolete now)
    Murphy's Golden Rule: Whoever has the gold, makes the rules.

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by Louie1961 View Post
    On 1/4 to 3/8ths inch aluminum, no, you won't miss any of the features of an inverter. At these thicknesses the only thing that matters is horse power...amps pure and simple. If you are doing a lot of thin aluminum (like sheet metal thicknesses) then maybe you would miss the adjustable frequency and pulse. But not on the thick stuff. Zap, who is an admin here, used to use an ancient refrigerator sized, 900 lb, sine wave welder with no features at all (330 AB/P). It didn't even have adjustable balance. He did absolute works of art with it...aluminum intake manifolds for his race car, and the like. He taught a lot of folks here how to TIG weld (me included, fortunately) and he believes that you don't need any of those features to do good work. He has the portfolio of work to back up his position. If you want all the inverter features you either need to skip the heavier material or pony up for something like the Dynasty 280
    I don't think they offer the Dynasty 280 now. It's 300 or 400. Shovelon has a 750.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie B View Post
    I don't think they offer the Dynasty 280 now. It's 300 or 400. Shovelon has a 750.

    No, they offer a 210, 280, 400 and 800 now in the dynasty lineup. https://store.cyberweld.com/midy280dxcow1.html
    Miller Multimatic 255

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralphm View Post
    Thanks for th priceless advices. I am very happy to receive many options. Used syncrowave and precision tig are very difficult to find here but it's really a good option. Do you miss the options of the inverter welder?
    I have two TIG welders right now. One is a modern AC/DC inverter with pretty much every option you can think of and it welds beautifully. The other is a Syncrowave 250DX so a standard square wave transformer machine. For aluminum 1/8" thick or thicker I have always gotten slightly better results with the Syncrowave. I don't know why, but it must just be me. I've spent hours with the two machines next to one another trying to get identical results and no matter what I do, the finished product is just a bit nicer with the Miller. It's actually sort of annoying! It's a small difference, and you probably wouldn't notice it if I didn't point it out, and put two finished pieces together to show you, but it's there for some reason.

    So, like the other guys have said, for the work you're talking about you shouldn't notice any difference. Thin material is where the new features really make a difference. If you plan working with thin material the inverter features are definitely worth it.
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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    I had an Evertlast 255EXT, sold it and bought a used Dynasty 280DX tigrunner. I love the Dynasty. One of the reasons I bought it was there is a Miller approved repair shop very close by. This is important because I'm hearing impaired and telephones are a nightmare. The Everlast is a very good machine at a very reasonable price and I would recommend it. The gas solenoid started to leak. Everlast customer support was great, got a new part from them very quickly and all was well. However, phone conversation made me want to deal locally if I have problems with a welder.
    Millermatic 255
    Dynasty 280 DX
    Ready Welder I
    Hypertherm 30XP

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by G-ManBart View Post
    I have two TIG welders right now. One is a modern AC/DC inverter with pretty much every option you can think of and it welds beautifully. The other is a Syncrowave 250DX so a standard square wave transformer machine. For aluminum 1/8" thick or thicker I have always gotten slightly better results with the Syncrowave. I don't know why, but it must just be me. I've spent hours with the two machines next to one another trying to get identical results and no matter what I do, the finished product is just a bit nicer with the Miller. It's actually sort of annoying! It's a small difference, and you probably wouldn't notice it if I didn't point it out, and put two finished pieces together to show you, but it's there for some reason.

    So, like the other guys have said, for the work you're talking about you shouldn't notice any difference. Thin material is where the new features really make a difference. If you plan working with thin material the inverter features are definitely worth it.


    After reading all of your posts, it's one off the best options. The price for a dynasty 280 is a non-sense for my hobbyist point of view.(and find a used one is almost impossible) The price off the invertig 313 is probably the max i would pay. But, after reflexion, my thermal arc 186 make everything i want in thin stuff and for me, has enough fonctions and adjustements. I know it is not the top off the line but the first result come from the guy behind the hood. I am not in production, the duty cycle is not my priority. I need to find a very good used transformer to complete my inverter in thick stuff and, with the rest of the money, replace my inverter when it dies or upgrade it.

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    1st on WeldingWeb to have a scrolling sig!



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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Do you have an opinion between syncrowave250dx,invertig 313 and dynasty 280?

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralphm View Post
    Do you have an opinion between syncrowave250dx,invertig 313 and dynasty 280?
    Syncrowave is old school. I think they call it chopper technology. In its day, there was nothing better. It provided square wave power (very desirable for welding aluminum).

    Dynasty 280DX is the inverter. Using very little power, it offers four choices of AC wave shape (I use advanced square only), it enables me to tune balance between EP & EN. It gives pulse, and I can adjust frequency. About ten other features I don't know how to use. With a software upgrade, I can control amplitude of EP & EN. 8 years ago, it was the most advanced machine in its substantial price range.

    I can offer no information about InverTIG.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig


    Do you have an opinion between syncrowave250dx,invertig 313 and dynasty 280?

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    Re: 250-300 amp tig

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie B View Post
    Syncrowave is old school. I think they call it chopper technology. In its day, there was nothing better. It provided square wave power (very desirable for welding aluminum).

    Dynasty 280DX is the inverter. Using very little power, it offers four choices of AC wave shape (I use advanced square only), it enables me to tune balance between EP & EN. It gives pulse, and I can adjust frequency. About ten other features I don't know how to use. With a software upgrade, I can control amplitude of EP & EN. 8 years ago, it was the most advanced machine in its substantial price range.

    I can offer no information about InverTIG.

    Many model/years of sycrowave, what is your suggestion for my search? model, year, options etc. thanks

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