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Thread: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

  1. #26
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Good to know.
    I have had to do per heat for antiques restoration.
    That could be good thing no per heat need and you can charge for rod to cover the cost.

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by shovelon View Post
    Yep, pricey, but this filler does not require preheat or special post weld cooling. There are a lot of antiques restoration firms in Los Angeles that can't find replacements to the original. I make my money and run.

  2. #27
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldiron2 View Post
    There were actually four different versions of XYRON. I could shoot pictures of their pages from a 1963 Eutectic catalog and post them, if anyone is interested. Scanning as a pdf makes files too large to post here.
    That doesn't surprise me at all, I've run a variety of EUTECTIC products and liked the way the ran, I've still got a few varieties on the rack. The XYRON I used was very machinable and contoured well with a die grinder and a burr, I used it to weld an EGR fitting back on the exhaust manifold on my father in laws Maverick 200 six cylinder.

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  3. #28
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    I have a cast iron job I need to try and repair. It is an H bar for a miniexcavator. it attaches the back of the bucket to the arm. It will see alot of tinsel and compression stress. I would love to try the ez weld shovelon talks about, as this would avoid preheat. Besides the obvious time saved, the bushings are in place and they have a small rubber wiper seal that would melt away. My 2nd choice would be to go with ni99 with pre/post heat. I would use my coal forge for pre heat. I have always used gas brazing for cast iron with good results but I am looking for maximum streagth/durability. I am out of my element an looking for advice

  4. #29
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    I'm curious what the composition of that "EZ Tig" wire is...anyone know?

    I googled it, and the Amazon page for something called "EZ Tig wire" said it can "weld" copper to steel...which makes me think it's a brazing wire, since as far as I know, you can't "weld" copper to steel...

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  6. #30
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    This is the h bracket

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  7. #31
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Quote Originally Posted by Simclardy View Post
    This is the h bracket
    Do you have the missing part, the one not shown in the rightmost picture? If not, might it be easier to fabricate the whole center section from steel and weld the outer bearing ends on? Build a jig to keep alignment perfect? Do you have access to a lathe and/or mill?

    MG used to have information about a stick procedure alternating between 99Ni and a lesser Ni alloy (IIRC), finishing with a cast iron that gave a correct finish, if needed...and I used it with success once, but don't currently know where the documentation of the procedure is.

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  9. #32
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    It looks like cast iron did you test for cast iron?

    If cast iron a I would vee the cast iron at weld point and preheat the part before welding . I would use brazing with a torch.
    They do make rods for stick welding, TIG & TORCH welding.

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by Simclardy View Post
    This is the h bracket

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  11. #33
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    FYI
    In some cases I would make new part out steel. If the hole alignment maybe need for equipment to work right.
    In some cases running a boring bar will do the job.

    Most cases you can do good job of jigging the part up and will work great.

    Typically I would Torch or TIG incase there is a bad spot. I see the bad with torch or tig and arc can be missed.

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by Simclardy View Post
    This is the h bracket

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    Last edited by smithdoor; 07-24-2022 at 02:55 PM.

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  13. #34
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldiron2 View Post
    Do you have the missing part, the one not shown in the rightmost picture? If not, might it be easier to fabricate the whole center section from steel and weld the outer bearing ends on? Build a jig to keep alignment perfect? Do you have access to a lathe and/or mill?

    MG used to have information about a stick procedure alternating between 99Ni and a lesser Ni alloy (IIRC), finishing with a cast iron that gave a correct finish, if needed...and I used it with success once, but don't currently know where the documentation of the procedure is.
    I don't have the missing piece. Which was a discovery when I laid it out. Lol.
    I was think along the lines of using a steel plate with sides. I don't have access to a lathe/mill yet. Aesthetics don't matter so no need to color match. He can always paint it.
    Thanks

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  15. #35
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Quote Originally Posted by smithdoor View Post
    It looks like cast iron did you test for cast iron?

    If cast iron a I would vee the cast iron at weld point and preheat the part before welding . I would use brazing with a torch.
    They do make rods for stick welding, TIG & TORCH welding.

    Dave
    I believe it is cast iron by the look. What kind of test? Sparks? What rod would you use for gas brazing/welding?
    Thanks

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  16. #36
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    You would be way ahead by throwing that broken cast piece in the trash and making a replacement from steel. Then start a new thread.

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  18. #37
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    I think you 'll need to BUY that piece, I don't see you being able to Graph something on to it and be ANYWAYS NEAR strong enough....

    That, or start-from-scratch and fab it out of Steel
    Last edited by BaTu; 07-24-2022 at 05:43 PM.

  19. #38
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Quote Originally Posted by BaTu View Post
    I think you 'll need to BUY that piece, I don't see you being able to Graph something on to it and be ANYWAYS NEAR strong enough....

    That, or start-from-scratch and fab it out of Steel
    I disagree. I've seen broken or worn parts for old engines, tractors and other equipment repaired and made stronger than original, this mostly for equipment long 'obsolete'. I've also seen missing parts "manufactured", sometimes mimicking the original details perfectly but using newer methods and materials like welding from steel (as you also suggest).
    The real question is what is the PO capable of without help and what available methods are easiest or cheapest for him.

    He doesn't list a location which makes it hard for anyone near him to know it and to volunteer help, too.

  20. #39
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bradley256 View Post
    You would be way ahead by throwing that broken cast piece in the trash and making a replacement from steel. Then start a new thread.
    Even if a new part is made from steel, the original has some heavy cast iron sections that could be used for other jobs, so would be worth saving rather than "trashing".

  21. #40
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Thanks, I did speak to the owners/friend and the thought was to buy a new one for around $800. I view the job more as a learning tool than a "real" job. I live in Harwich MA. Looking to move to Maine, WVirginia, or Tennessee. Looking for farm land and less yuppies.

  22. #41
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Your not wrong, but that would be too easy!

  23. #42
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Quote Originally Posted by StandarDyne View Post
    I'm curious what the composition of that "EZ Tig" wire is...anyone know?

    I googled it, and the Amazon page for something called "EZ Tig wire" said it can "weld" copper to steel...which makes me think it's a brazing wire, since as far as I know, you can't "weld" copper to steel...
    It is some kind of soft steel with a flux or powdered metal core. They call is something like unobtainium or something.
    Weld like a "WELDOR", not a wel-"DERR"
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  24. #43
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    In my limited experience, I like 312 stainless, or Hastelloy.

    You need to fixture to place the components exactly where they need to be.

    cut away enough metal to butter each broken surface. the filler is less important than buttering both faces. You've left enough space to weld to the coated surfaces.
    An optimist is usually wrong, and when the unexpected happens is unprepared. A pessimist is usually right, when wrong, is delighted, and well prepared.

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  26. #44
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldiron2 View Post
    I disagree. I've seen broken or worn parts for old engines, tractors and other equipment repaired and made stronger than original, this mostly for equipment long 'obsolete'. I've also seen missing parts "manufactured", sometimes mimicking the original details perfectly but using newer methods and materials like welding from steel (as you also suggest).
    Sure, for Lots of stuff like that but,,, I think this is Very different because of what it's doing. This isn't an "ear" on an engine block or transmission, this is an intrical part in a very high stress group of, hydraulically controlled, components. There's going to be a Lot asked of that part, and look how well it stood-up in it's original condition....

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  28. #45
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    What is part for?

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by Simclardy View Post
    I believe it is cast iron by the look. What kind of test? Sparks? What rod would you use for gas brazing/welding?
    Thanks

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  29. #46
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Quote Originally Posted by BaTu View Post
    Sure, for Lots of stuff like that but,,, I think this is Very different because of what it's doing. This isn't an "ear" on an engine block or transmission, this is an intrical part in a very high stress group of, hydraulically controlled, components. There's going to be a Lot asked of that part, and look how well it stood-up in it's original condition....
    Your right. The problem is the main bucket pin has too much play and it was putting a twisting force on the h link. This will be corrected.

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  30. #47
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    How well this be corrected?

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by Simclardy View Post
    Your right. The problem is the main bucket pin has too much play and it was putting a twisting force on the h link. This will be corrected.

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  31. #48
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Quote Originally Posted by smithdoor View Post
    How well this be corrected?

    Dave
    I believe they are going to use a boring bar and press new bushings. I have never seen a boring bar so don't quote me.

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  32. #49
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Then this will easy if off 1/64" or even 1/16" the machine shop will fix the bore.
    The will bore a larger hole and make bushing to press in the bored hole.

    Oods are they set on a Bridgeport mill a in large the hole. So if you get off the bore will fix that error.

    Dave

    Quote Originally Posted by Simclardy View Post
    I believe they are going to use a boring bar and press new bushings. I have never seen a boring bar so don't quote me.

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  33. #50
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    Re: How would you weld this broken cast iron part?

    Spray welding is another way to successfully join cast iron to like new condition. For something like the part in question, you'd have to Vee it out enough to get full penetration (into the middle) and make a jig to hold the 2 pieces in alignment. A small furnace like they use for forging to heat it up would be a real benefit too. You could make one with some fire bricks and a Tiger torch (weed burner).

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