It Must Be Hay Season (Contaminated Diesel)

[farmersammm]

I made this tank about maybe 24ish years ago, and I regret to this day, not putting a drain plug in it. Dunno what I was thinking at the time, but I completely spaced it out I guess. So...........the only way to get water out of the bottom is to use a siphon hose. PITA.

Anyways I can't be sure, but I'd estimate I got close to 3-5 gallons of free water out of it. Hasn't been drained in probably 3 years...dunno. I do know that it might be at least 2yrs since I hauled any diesel in the tank. Haven't cut hay for that long, what with the equipment problems. So...this diesel is completely contaminated with solids. The bottom of the tank is very rusty from all those years of water sitting there.

After draining the water, the remaining diesel looked like this.

The water was drained in the driveway until diesel started to come out. Then I moved the trailer down past the back gate to drain all of the remaining diesel.

Backing the short distance to the back gate stirred up a ton of rust sediment.

In the time it took to completely drain the tank, I took another sample. This shows just how much of the suspended sediment dropped out of the fuel in the half hour it took to drain the remaining fuel.

I'd like to completely clean the tank, but I need to get in the field by Monday at the latest, so it has to wait. I only filled the tank with enough fuel to run the tractor for maybe 3 days. I'll find out if the tank pump filter will cope with the rust burden. I assume it will, because it always has. The Goldenrod filters seem to do a very good job.

We were sitting on the bumper while the tank drained. It was nice and cool in the shade.

I was talking about how hard it's going to be to clean the tank.

K'kins didn't skip a beat........................................."You shoulda put man holes in it when you built it"

Simple, no-nonsense, to the point. It's why I'm crazy about her.

She works in the oil patch, and there isn't a tank out there that doesn't have a man entrance for cleanout.

If I had this to do over, I'd put a bolted cover in each of the 3 bays to allow arm access. About halfway down to the bottom on the side of the tank. The tank is divided into 3 bays due to the baffles. Would have added a bit of work, but would have been the proper thing to do.

Diesel and Water

I tried to find some honest information about the effects of water suspended in diesel. It took nearly an hour to find something that wasn't a stinkin' advertisement for snake oil, or magic fuel filters. Although the following are still sales pitches to some extent.

https://www.cenex.com/about/cenex-in...minated-diesel

https://www.cenex.com/about/cenex-in...-out-of-diesel

https://www.cenex.com/fuels/faqs

Article explaining the hygroscopic nature of diesel, which is like Ethanol blended gasoline. It's a matter of saturation.........and at some point the water drops out to the bottom of the tank.......but only to the point of maximum saturation. Diesel will always have some emulsified water in it.

https://www.the-triton.com/2016/03/w...s-worst-enemy/

All of my diesel powered equipment has a bottom drain in the tank, a water separator filter ahead of the fuel filter, and the final fuel filter. These have always seemed to take care of any free water in the fuel. So I see no need for the snake oil stuff. If it was necessary, the engine manufacturer would recommend it. And, I figure all the necessary additives are included at the refinery.

[farmersammm]

I suppose the tank hasn't rusted through because I made it out of 10ga Heavy booger..........around maybe 300#. Then fill it with 150gal of diesel, and you gots one mildly large bit of weight But she ain't rusted through in almost a quarter Century.

Reason I used heavier material was the fact that I didn't own a wire welder back then

[52 Ford]

10 gauge steel... Drain it out and cut out some access holes in the top. I'd use a grinder or a plasma cutter. Maybe an oxy-fuel cutting torch, but I know how you are with those things... Don't wanna have BOTH hands f'd up at the same time

Anywho, I'd cut it open (AND EXPECT A FIRE). Cut to L shapes with the torch or a grinder to make a square. Leave the corners so the off-cut doesn't fall. Extinguish the fire before the off-cut falls loose. That way, the fire in the tank can't get as much oxygen and it'll be easier to extinguish.

WEAR YOUR WELDING GLOVES.

Don't wanna end up like one of them dudes that scorched the back of their hand with an oxy-acetylene torch!

I'd add a drain, pressure wash the tank, dump in a bunch of rust remover (vinegar might work... it's cheap, anyway), then pressure wash it again.

Add a reservoir below the tank. Maybe a piece of 2" pipe? Cap it, drill a hole in the cap, and put a 1/2" ball valve. That way you have somewhere for water to collect other than the actual tank.

Personally, I'd weld a threaded bung onto the tank versus drilling and threading it. Again, I'd go for some big diameter pipe to hold all that water and sediment. Might wanna add a couple filters to your fuel pump. too!

[farmersammm]

So you buy this stuff.................. https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/CRC05670

Where does the water go........................ To the bottom of the tank. Which, unless you have a drain provision, sits and ruins the tank over time. Or, you suck up slugs of it through the pump intake.

I believe the only real solution is a water separator. Free water will drop out all along the fuel route from fuel fill, to final run through the injector pump. All you can do is try to get rid of any free water all along the way to the pump.

[farmersammm]

10 gauge steel... Drain it out and cut out some access holes in the top. I'd use a grinder or a plasma cutter. Maybe an oxy-fuel cutting torch, but I know how you are with those things... Don't wanna have BOTH hands f'd up at the same time

Anywho, I'd cut it open (AND EXPECT A FIRE). Cut to L shapes with the torch or a grinder to make a square. Leave the corners so the off-cut doesn't fall. Extinguish the fire before the off-cut falls loose. That way, the fire in the tank can't get as much oxygen and it'll be easier to extinguish.

WEAR YOUR WELDING GLOVES.

Don't wanna end up like one of them dudes that scorched the back of their hand with an oxy-acetylene torch!

I'd add a drain, pressure wash the tank, dump in a bunch of rust remover (vinegar might work... it's cheap, anyway), then pressure wash it again.

Add a reservoir below the tank. Maybe a piece of 2" pipe? Cap it, drill a hole in the cap, and put a 1/2" ball valve. That way you have somewhere for water to collect other than the actual tank.

Personally, I'd weld a threaded bung onto the tank versus drilling and threading it. Again, I'd go for some big diameter pipe to hold all that water and sediment. Might wanna add a couple filters to your fuel pump. too!

When, and if, it starts to leak...................it's going to the scrapyard if they'll take it. I have absolutely no intention of ever doing any kind of hot work on an old fuel tank.

They replace tank bottoms where K'kins works...........but only after steam cleaning the interior, and burning the tank out with a pile of cedar trees inside it. It's extremely dangerous work.

For me, it's easy enough to build a new tank after 25yrs. Small as it is, it's not worth the risk to reclaim it.

[N2 Welding]

Tisk tisk. Come on Samm, fighting cancer and handling fuels bare handed? Do I need to send you a box of rubber gloves? Oh anyway hope you are feeling good and getting stuff done that needs to get done.

[52 Ford]

When, and if, it starts to leak...................it's going to the scrapyard if they'll take it. I have absolutely no intention of ever doing any kind of hot work on an old fuel tank.

They replace tank bottoms where K'kins works...........but only after steam cleaning the interior, and burning the tank out with a pile of cedar trees inside it. It's extremely dangerous work.

For me, it's easy enough to build a new tank after 25yrs. Small as it is, it's not worth the risk to reclaim it.

Fine! Don't take a torch to your fuel tank! Be all sensible about it!

When you make another one, try to design the floor of the tank so that it slopes to a single lowest point, then cut that out, add a fairly large NPT fitting at that point. That way you can add a length of pipe under the tank to capture any water and sediment. At the end of the pipe, get a flat cap to thread onto the pipe and drill and tap it for a small-ish ball valve offsetting it so it lands at the very bottom of the big pipe under the tank. When the tank is empty, you can drain what's in the pipe reservoir into a bucket, then unscrew the cap to scrape out any sediment that's settled out, rust, dirt, etc.

That's prolly what I'd do, anyway. Just the first thing that came to mind.

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[N2 Welding]

Fine! Don't take a torch to your fuel tank! Be all sensible about it!

When you make another one, try to design the floor of the tank so that it slopes to a single lowest point, then cut that out, add a fairly large NPT fitting at that point. That way you can add a length of pipe under the tank to capture any water and sediment. At the end of the pipe, get a flat cap to thread onto the pipe and drill and tap it for a small-ish ball valve offsetting it so it lands at the very bottom of the big pipe under the tank. When the tank is empty, you can drain what's in the pipe reservoir into a bucket, then unscrew the cap to scrape out any sediment that's settled out, rust, dirt, etc.

That's prolly what I'd do, anyway. Just the first thing that came to mind.

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Only problem I see with that design is if you bump the valve with anything that causes it to open the valve while you are mobile and spill out a bunch of expensive fuel and not realize it until it is too late :/

[John T]

Just another case of neglect.

Now we get another multipage saga trying to fix something that was completely avoidable.

And for a "so called" farmer, it is shameful that you have no concern for the environment... dumping diesel fuel like that.

Older is not always wiser.

[Oxford1]

Just another case of neglect.

Now we get another multipage saga trying to fix something that was completely avoidable.

And for a "so called" farmer, it is shameful that you have no concern for the environment... dumping diesel fuel like that.

Older is not always wiser.

And we’ll hear pretty quickly about how it’s critical to get this hay made.

[M J D]

No part of this comes as any surprise. Apparently the Homer Simpson approach of " sit back, do nothing, see what happens, doesn't always work out well.

[Lis2323]

10 gauge steel... Drain it out and cut out some access holes in the top. I'd use a grinder or a plasma cutter. Maybe an oxy-fuel cutting torch, but I know how you are with those things... Don't wanna have BOTH hands f'd up at the same time

Anywho, I'd cut it open (AND EXPECT A FIRE). Cut to L shapes with the torch or a grinder to make a square. Leave the corners so the off-cut doesn't fall. Extinguish the fire before the off-cut falls loose. That way, the fire in the tank can't get as much oxygen and it'll be easier to extinguish.

WEAR YOUR WELDING GLOVES.

Don't wanna end up like one of them dudes that scorched the back of their hand with an oxy-acetylene torch!

I'd add a drain, pressure wash the tank, dump in a bunch of rust remover (vinegar might work... it's cheap, anyway), then pressure wash it again.

Add a reservoir below the tank. Maybe a piece of 2" pipe? Cap it, drill a hole in the cap, and put a 1/2" ball valve. That way you have somewhere for water to collect other than the actual tank.

Personally, I'd weld a threaded bung onto the tank versus drilling and threading it. Again, I'd go for some big diameter pipe to hold all that water and sediment. Might wanna add a couple filters to your fuel pump. too!

I built this one out of 10 gauge steel 12 years ago It has a baffle, 3/4”NPT drain plug, lifting eyes, brackets for filler nozzle and 4 point bolt downs.

Also a small integrated tool box with “bumper”










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[Lis2323]

Maybe pickup a used store bought one and steam it out before use

One of my tenants built a nice little cage for theirs…..




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[Louie1961]

When, and if, it starts to leak...................it's going to the scrapyard if they'll take it. I have absolutely no intention of ever doing any kind of hot work on an old fuel tank.

They replace tank bottoms where K'kins works...........but only after steam cleaning the interior, and burning the tank out with a pile of cedar trees inside it. It's extremely dangerous work.

For me, it's easy enough to build a new tank after 25yrs. Small as it is, it's not worth the risk to reclaim it.

Diesel is not explosive in the same way that gasoline is. The flash point of diesel is like 180 degrees higher than that of gasoline. I am not saying it won't burn or explode, but at room temperature it doesn't give off enough vapor to ignite. You can literally throw a lit match into a pan of diesel fuel and the match will go out. I think if you fully drain the tank and rinse it out with plenty of hot soapy water, there will be little to no diesel left to vaporize. I am not sure burning the tank out is needed, nor any safer than actually welding on it.

[mla2ofus]

With it being 10ga I don't see why can't drill and tap a 1/4" or 3/8" pipe thread hole and install a ball style drain valve on it with the tank blocked up so the water will all drain to that end. Also remove the valve handle and put a lanyard on it and open and close the valve with it and leave it off when not in use.

[John T]

I built this one out of 10 gauge steel 12 years ago It has a baffle, 3/4”NPT drain plug, lifting eyes, brackets for filler nozzle and 4 point bolt downs.

Also a small integrated tool box with “bumper”

Very nice as usual.

Seems everything you build is well thought out.
Practical yet tasteful.

[farmersammm]

Half filled the tank to get through what needs to be done this week. Came out fairly clean after changing the pump filter. The trailer was parked about 1 hour before pumping the fuel. It ought to settle out even more by tomorrow. Raise the draw a bit as an additional precaution, and it's good to go.

The pump filter is 10 microns, water separator is around 12 microns, the final filter is 10 microns. I keep a spare final filter on hand, so I figure it's time to make hay.

Air up the tire on the swather, grease it, and it's ready to fly.

We had a fun evening. I finally finished tweaking K'kins new electric fence, and we let the cows up into the yard to do some "mowing" She's reached a point in life where she can't handle the entire yard anymore(and I'm damn sure not up to it), so we decided to pasture half of it when it needs to be eaten down. It's a hoot to watch a cow get zapped on the nose with a shot of juice. Big snort, the legs splay out a bit, and she backs up like a scalded goose I like the poly wire because it's highly visible to a cow. Once they hit it a few times, they stay clear of it. It's not a high pressure fence, but it works well when there's ample forage.

If you time it right, you can get them in, and out, before the grass starts to run through them. About half an hour does it, or a bit more.. Helps keep the yard clean (somewhat). Is what it is. If she's happy, I'm happy. Anyways.......it's only half the yard, so it isn't too close to the house.

[52 Ford]

Only problem I see with that design is if you bump the valve with anything that causes it to open the valve while you are mobile and spill out a bunch of expensive fuel and not realize it until it is too late :/

Locking ball valve?

[farmersammm]

What a Day!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Started out in the low 70's, and gradually worked its way up to around 83*. IN THE MIDDLE OF THE HOT SEASON HERE. I mean WOW!!!!!!!!!! It just doesn't get any better than this.

Tractor ran good, swather ran good until it ruined a rocker arm shaft boss. Not very worried about it. It'll last through the first cutting, then it'll make a nice 5 page thread..........machining and welding Just happily pounds away while you're running it(shrug). Probably 30 thou slop. Ought to take out the opposing boss, and the bearings before its done(shrug)

Tore out about 16' of fence at the water gap across the creek. Can't see in the shade anymore(shrug)

About half of the small field cut. Looks like maybe 3-4 bales to the acre. Johnson Grass Cow Candy!!

Nice to get on a machine again, and run hard. GAWD WHAT A DAY!!!!!!!!!!!! And..........the hand works fine. The scarring is supple enough for full hand movement.

First hay season in 2 years, and I'm diggin' it

Baler will probably do something bad..................but WTF(shrug). It's hay season again!!

[John T]

[farmersammm]

Hesston 1

Grass 0

60yr old Oliver, 50yr old Hesston 1014..........................WINS THE DAY ONE MORE TIME.

If the old gal will give me about another 60hrs......................we'll make it through the season. Then we can hope steel goes down in November, and get to fixin' the Allis, and the Allis. (We're a 2 Allis family)

[Sberry]

I repair a tank in a loader a while back. That I will find a pic of but the top rotted. I drained it washed it out a little cut top open and super washed it like new and weld a new top back on it.

[Sberry]

Cleaned like new.

[farmersammm]

Cleaned like new.

If my tank rusts through in the next decade, I'll probably try to fix it I guess. I'm just not crazy about working on fuel tanks.

Hell....................it might rust through in the next few days.........who knows(shrug) 25yrs is a lotta time for a tank.

[Sberry]

This the bottom looked new, top rusted thru. But I fix bottoms of them too. I have good way or can clean them though.